GT500 vs. ZL1.

[thePill]

I made this thread so members are afforded the opportunity to sling mud at the opposition. I will also be consolidating all the reviews of the two in this thread. There will be a lot of bench racing between these two until it happens. After the test, there will be a lot of sh!t talking... This is Ali vs. Frazier, Hogan vs. the Giant, Red vs. Blue... A Smackdown for the 2013 section... Free speech here, maybe some of the Camaro5 mods would like to grace us with their opinion.

 

[ragingclue]

...but we have nothing of substance yet. Just conjecture.

EDIT: Good job with the pic though.

 

[Gunslinger9416]

Hey Pill, is the Shelby taller than the ZL1, or are the pics just a tad off?

 

[thePill]

I will begin by pointing out the shear weight of the '12 ZL1. Auto rags typically see about 130lbs spread on the curb weights. This puts the ZL1 manual between 4050 (Motor Trend had the lightest ZL1 at 4051) and 4180lbs. The 6L90 ZL1 will likely weigh about 60lbs more than the heaviest ZL1 manual at about 4240lbs. That is CTS-V weight there...

 

[thePill]

Hey Pill, is the Shelby taller than the ZL1, or are the pics just a tad off?

I believe the pictures were taken from different distances, but they matched up perfectly...

...but we have nothing of substance yet. Just conjecture.

EDIT: Good job with the pic though.

Until we have substance, sling intellectual mud.... Once we have the test, links will be provided as they can be accessed easily by adding them to the first post.

 

[thePill]

Real world 1/4 mile numbers for the ZL1 are actually worse than the 2007 GT500 as tested by Road and Track. Weight is going to really hurt this thing and we haven't even factored in summer heat yet. Sure your tires are stickier but your CPU is pulling timing... A major reason Team Corvette and Camaro are testing in cold weather is because they are unsure of the heated lap times and performance.

 

[PaulVincent]

Frazier

 

[Captain Beyond]

The GT500 definitely wins the looks. :coolman:

 

[Ninjak]

I honestly believe that the ZL1 would do no better in 1/4 than a supercharged SS. The Mag suspension will probably not effect a 1/4 that much and from the video's I have seen it has plenty of wheel hop.

My guess it will do low 12 with a decent driver, and high 11's with DR. Pretty much what a 11~12 GT500 AND a 11 GT can do......

 

[Devious_Snake]

op:

 

[Mystichrome#365]

camaros are big heavy boats... gt 500 is gonna bust its ass

 

[slynch68]

Shouldn't they have named
It the Z28? That was chevrolet's corner carver. The ZL1 was their drag racing car. Can't wait to bust one at the track soon

 

[thePill]

"Track-Ready" is a buzz word used by Team Camaro to market a car that should have been the Z28. As the Track star progressed through development, and the unavailing of the Boss 302, the Z28 mutated into a large, overweight track hog. Fast as it might be, weight is the ultimate enemy. a 4200lb car places an extremely large workload on the brakes, suspension and tires. The ZL1 comes from the factory with DOT 3 fluid... That is NOT track ready. What about the drag strip, that is still considered a track right? Motor Trend is using corrected times, unless anybody thinks a Boss 302 can run a 12.4 at 4400 feet. In fact, every single magazine seemed to be using corrected times (even the 12.9)... Why? Because a corrected run is easier to do and with high levels of intelligence, GM chose to perform a test at 4400 feet at a not so popular track. The ZL1 instantly became a drag racing flop..... It obviously wasn't ready for that track... We can't really brag about its performance at Inde because there are no real times posted for any other car other than the Boss 302 and GTR.

Now, on to VIR where everyone knows the head to head will be (I said this a few weeks ago). Team Camaro had an existing video of a 2011 GT500 SVTPP to base their run on. Why not just grab a 2012 GT500 and go head to head instead of racing a 2 year old video? It's nice and cool, the GT500 would love to run at those temperatures instead of mid summer... The ZL1 will probably beat the 2011 GT500 at VIR, why not prove it? It is a clever marketing scheme, we are overweight, underpowered and was originally intended to be a Z28... The quarter mile is a big part of American life so... lets try to change the standard.

VIR was run, same day as another supercharged beast was (the ZR1). Claiming the top US performance lineup... But why no Z06? No CTS-V?

Being "Track Ready' was instantly confused by Camaro5 fans as being Competition Ready. They believe that once the steering wheel is in their hand, it will magically transport them to the podium and on to a championship. This assumption is WRONG. Even if the Boss 302 was competition ready, it still had to fight its way through GS, GTS and T2. The ZL1 is not prepared for the track, the only legal classes you can run MagnaRide in SCCA is STO, T1, T2, T3 and Showroom Stock. You cannot use the LSA in anything other than Showroom Stock and I don't even think the ZL1 has been registered yet. NASA and SCCA Solo is pretty much an uphill battle for a 4200lb car with mild to heavy understeer.


So, back to open track days and the NEW standard in the pony car segment. What we are currently witnessing, is basically an evolution of a drag race. A one lap race that proves the car can handle but just like a typical drag race, can it accomplish the feet over and over again. Is the ZL1 really ready to go head to head with real track stars? No... Would it be a fine basis to build a track car? No... I would take an SS first. Can it move its weight to produce a quick lap? Sure, but can it do it more than once. Ford isn't really marketing the car as a competitive road course car... you have the option to build it that way but most GT500's will be destroying pavement and asphalt. GM sees the drag race now as a sub standard measurement of performance. If an ass kicking is abound, then change the damn subject... These two cars (Mustang and Camaro in general) try very hard to be track ready competition cars. The Boss 302 and GT are pretty much pulling it off... The Camaro? Not so much. This "Track Ready" nonsense will continue, until Ford redefines the Pony Car in 2015... and then watch the old ZL1's have their asses handed to them by a 5.0 GT.

"A track ready vehicle, optimized for road racing. This is a complete package that also comes with a track warranty.... basically anyone can get in and drive and be consistent with confidence and completely enjoy the experience."

~ Random Team Camaro member

 

[Darth Racer]

Heck, the '11-12 GT500 is running ETs & speeds very close to the ZL1. I wonder why someone doesn't run a test of those cars? Come on MM&FF....Evan Smith....have a drag test between those cars!

The '13 Shelby will defeat the ZL1. It's just a matter of physics.

 

[IOMZL1]

A major reason Team Corvette and Camaro are testing in cold weather is because they are unsure of the heated lap times and performance.

I don’t think this statement holds water. Are we slinging facts here or can we just make up things to say? I think this thread has potential if we can keep away from the B.S. and speculation.

 

[peteypab2133]

I think the ZL1 is a great looking car. It will be fine. I grew up in a house full of explorers and mustangs. Sooo naturally I am a fan of the GT500. But the numbers normally do not lie, I do think the GT500 will out perform it, but unknown in what aspects

 

[Snagged]

Well that was done by a journalist was it not? We all know how well they can drive. ;-)

 

[GarageLogic]

Oh, and in case you missed the memo, the ZL1 is now considered a supercar, not just a measly musclecar like the GT500. According to Dragoneye over on C5, that is.

 

[Snagged]

Oh, and in case you missed the memo, the ZL1 is now considered a supercar, not just a measly musclecar like the GT500. According to Dragoneye over on C5, that is.

Well that is good to know. :lol1:

 

[thePill]

I don’t think this statement holds water. Are we slinging facts here or can we just make up things to say? I think this thread has potential if we can keep away from the B.S. and speculation.

I am considering the fact that heat soak is a major concern during spring, summer and fall. My source? Car and Driver on the 2010 and 2011 GT500 during the 2009/2010 Lightning Lap. Heat soak does happen, and when it does, the 2010 GT500 can lose 12-16% of its power. That is 64-86 horsepower lost at the flywheel due to pulled timing.

With 32-45 degree ambient temperatures, it would prolong heat soak by 30% (quick estimate). If GM chose to run a free breathing Z06 at the same time, the ZR1 might not look as impressive. I am under the impression that the ZR1 run was to lay down a benchmark for the ZL1. The ZR1 wasn't involved in the press event as far as I am aware of so, it was used to fluff the ZL1s time. If you can compare the CTS-V's heat soak issues, they will directly be evident in the same 1.9l LSA. This is a major complaint with private owners....

This is probably why you see the published ZL1's 1/4 and 0-60 times all over the spectrum, some editors are getting the cars soaked and it has a drastic effect on performance.

The Eaton top mounted positive displacement supercharger is the most heat soak prone blower design on the market today.