You would loose that 500rwhp GTO bet, i can assure you , and stock vs stock, goats are just 100-125lbs heavier. and i'd think with a 500+ termi you should beat both goats in the video, although, the yellow one might surprise you, several times..... and with less than those 500 formidable hp.
Well with same horsepower I m not worring about losing to GTO. If is your car maybe we could set something up for this summer. I did get KB on it over the winter but no times yet since its cold outside and track are closed. I like them both GM or Ford. I have a cam only camaro SS and I like it so I dont have problem with GM vs Ford thing.
Well with same horsepower I m not worring about losing to GTO. If is your car maybe we could set something up for this summer. I did get KB on it over the winter but no times yet since its cold outside and track are closed. I like them both GM or Ford. I have a cam only camaro SS and I like it so I dont have problem with GM vs Ford thing.
With same or similar hp yeah you shouldn't worry about the gto, because it will be a good race; and could go either way. But there aren't that many gto's that trap 127 that's a really good mph and et. I see your name is z eater ever run into a modded c6 z06?
With same or similar hp yeah you shouldn't worry about the gto, because it will be a good race; and could go either way. But there aren't that many gto's that trap 127 that's a really good mph and et. I see your name is z eater ever run into a modded c6 z06?
I will this summer since there is only one guy that is under 30 and has one and its modded.
I know nitrous could be done on cobra's I was responding to someone saying it will take a lot for a gto to reliably keep up with a cobra which is false. A 150 shot alone on an a4 gto has put it at an 11.4, and automatic gto won't need as much tire as a cobra to yank it off the line in a drag race. And a dude comparing a 3000 pound 405 hp corvette to a 3700 pound 400 gto who woulda thunk it the gto didn't stand a chance by golly There are a lot of cars that would get beat by a stock c5 z06, a terminator included (which is not much lighter than a gto); that's the worst comparison I've ever seen. The only thing worse would be you comparing the z06 to a stock z28 camaro. Anyways back on topic a 150 shot on a stock gto would put it in the mid 11's, and I'm not saying it would rip a kenne bell or whippled cobra. A twin screwed cobras would probably slap a nitrous only gto silly, which is why I'm glad the vast majority of cobra's don't have twin screws.
How many stock GTOs have run mid 11s with just a 150shot? Certainly not 90% of them, just like how many bolt-on upper pulley only Cobras with around 450rwhp have 11.2-11.4s@123mph? It's been done, but that doesn't mean they all run those kind of times. IMO, nitrous on a stock GTO is not enough to beat 90% of 03-04 Cobras out there. There is a difference between records and what a car runs on average. There are pullied Cobras with just minor weight reduction running in the 10s, but that doesn't automatically mean all pullied Cobras can beat 90% of 10 second cars out there. Just like the vast majority of Cobras don't have twin screws, the vast majority of GTOs don't have a 150shot slapped onto an otherwise stock car running >11.5s.
It's nothing against the GTO, but it's hard to argue that the Cobra doesn't have a clear performance advantage mod for mod, or with a huge shot of nitrous. You're talking about a heavier car with an aluminum N/A motor vs a lighter car with a forged iron block, internals and a factory blower with supporting stuff. The GTO is a nice platform, but I think it's pretty obvious which platform will respond better to mods on average.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mebetter
A 150 shot on a stock m6 or a4 gto would be more than enough, to reliably beat 90% of the terminators out there.
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Ported blower, BF TB/Plenum, BF 2.76+idlers, Spec Clutch, Full length Headers
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How many stock GTOs have run mid 11s with just a 150shot? Certainly not 90% of them, just like how many bolt-on upper pulley only Cobras with around 450rwhp have 11.2-11.4s@123mph? It's been done, but that doesn't mean they all run those kind of times. IMO, nitrous on a stock GTO is not enough to beat 90% of 03-04 Cobras out there. There is a difference between records and what a car runs on average. There are pullied Cobras with just minor weight reduction running in the 10s, but that doesn't automatically mean all pullied Cobras can beat 90% of 10 second cars out there. Just like the vast majority of Cobras don't have twin screws, the vast majority of GTOs don't have a 150shot slapped onto an otherwise stock car running >11.5s.
It's nothing against the GTO, but it's hard to argue that the Cobra doesn't have a clear performance advantage mod for mod, or with a huge shot of nitrous. You're talking about a heavier car with an aluminum N/A motor vs a lighter car with a forged iron block, internals and a factory blower with supporting stuff. The GTO is a nice platform, but I think it's pretty obvious which platform will respond better to mods on average.
How many stock GTOs have run mid 11s with just a 150shot? Certainly not 90% of them, just like how many bolt-on upper pulley only Cobras with around 450rwhp have 11.2-11.4s@123mph? It's been done, but that doesn't mean they all run those kind of times. IMO, nitrous on a stock GTO is not enough to beat 90% of 03-04 Cobras out there. There is a difference between records and what a car runs on average. There are pullied Cobras with just minor weight reduction running in the 10s, but that doesn't automatically mean all pullied Cobras can beat 90% of 10 second cars out there. Just like the vast majority of Cobras don't have twin screws, the vast majority of GTOs don't have a 150shot slapped onto an otherwise stock car running >11.5s.
It's nothing against the GTO, but it's hard to argue that the Cobra doesn't have a clear performance advantage mod for mod, or with a huge shot of nitrous. You're talking about a heavier car with an aluminum N/A motor vs a lighter car with a forged iron block, internals and a factory blower with supporting stuff. The GTO is a nice platform, but I think it's pretty obvious which platform will respond better to mods on average.
LS1GTO.com Forums - LS1&LS2-Forced Induction, Stroker, Nitrous, 6 speed
Your missing my point I'm not going into details of how many people have put a 150 shot on a stock gto because there is no way I could know exactly how many people have done it. What I am saying is that it's not as expensive as one person was assuming it was for a gto to beat the average eaton cobra.
I dunno what else to tell you but do the math put 500 rwhp+ 550+ rwtq in an automatic car with some tire that weighs approximately 3800 pounds, and the probabilty of it running an 11 is pretty good. Some might run slower some might run faster but the majority of them should fall in that range. For further data to back my claim, examine the link I sent you, as a supplement, to the equation.
But sure theoretically cars that are boosted from the factory and have forged internals have an advantage over n/a cars. Heck I would know I have a Buick Grand National. In theory it seems reasonable but from a technical standpoint that's not necessarily true. Most owners of boosted cars increase their hp by increasing boost, going by standard atmospheric pressure of 14.7 a car that is running approximately 15psi has in effect doubled his cubic inches. In the short run adding nitrous to a n/a car would even out the scale of owners of cars such as a Grand National or cobra that are increasing their boost, because in most cases the oem power adders will only get a car so far. However a twin screwed cobra running over 20 psi, let's just say it would take a lot more than a 150 shot on a gto to run down one of those; and seeing that it's easy for cobras to upgrade from the stock eaton to a twin screw then I would agree that once a cobra gets to the 600 rwhp range it get's expensive for the gto to reliably keep up . But if we're talking which is the better platform to go with if your looking for big hp numbers 1000+ rwhp then that's another story.
LS1GTO.com Forums - LS1&LS2-Forced Induction, Stroker, Nitrous, 6 speed
Your missing my point I'm not going into details of how many people have put a 150 shot on a stock gto because there is no way I could know exactly how many people have done it. What I am saying is that it's not as expensive as one person was assuming it was for a gto to beat the average eaton cobra.
I dunno what else to tell you but do the math put 500 rwhp+ 550+ rwtq in an automatic car with some tire that weighs approximately 3800 pounds, and the probabilty of it running an 11 is pretty good. Some might run slower some might run faster but the majority of them should fall in that range. For further data to back my claim, examine the link I sent you, as a supplement, to the equation.
But sure theoretically cars that are boosted from the factory and have forged internals have an advantage over n/a cars. Heck I would know I have a Buick Grand National. In theory it seems reasonable but from a technical standpoint that's not necessarily true. Most owners of boosted cars increase their hp by increasing boost, going by standard atmospheric pressure of 14.7 a car that is running approximately 15psi has in effect doubled his cubic inches. In the short run adding nitrous to a n/a car would even out the scale of owners of cars such as a Grand National or cobra that are increasing their boost, because in most cases the oem power adders will only get a car so far. However a twin screwed cobra running over 20 psi, let's just say it would take a lot more than a 150 shot on a gto to run down one of those; and seeing that it's easy for cobras to upgrade from the stock eaton to a twin screw then I would agree that once a cobra gets to the 600 rwhp range it get's expensive for the gto to reliably keep up . But if we're talking which is the better platform to go with if your looking for big hp numbers 1000+ rwhp then that's another story.
First let me just say I don't know how this thread took this direction since the thread was about a TS Cobra vs. a basically bolt-on GTO, but that's ok.
As for your comparison on modding cost, everything you can do to a GTO you can do to a Cobra for the same or less money and go faster (bigger tire, less weight, forged motor.). The only advantage on the GTO side (from an ET and drag racing standpoint) is the fact that you can get a decent auto in a GTO. Since Z-Eater has an auto, I suspect that's why he made his earlier comment about not fretting GTO's with equal HP.
We race with lots of GTO guys with mods from Blower to Turbo to N20 to Stroker to Bolt-on........you name it. Comparable Mods or Comparable Dollars and the Cobra will take the "W" 95% of the time. Until you combine a built stroker motor with a power adder on the GTO, they're usually playing catch up. As to the link in your post to the GTO Board.....some of the guys we race with are on those lists.
First let me just say I don't know how this thread took this direction since the thread was about a TS Cobra vs. a basically bolt-on GTO, but that's ok.
As for your comparison on modding cost, everything you can do to a GTO you can do to a Cobra for the same or less money and go faster (bigger tire, less weight, forged motor.). The only advantage on the GTO side (from an ET and drag racing standpoint) is the fact that you can get a decent auto in a GTO. Since Z-Eater has an auto, I suspect that's why he made his earlier comment about not fretting GTO's with equal HP.
We race with lots of GTO guys with mods from Blower to Turbo to N20 to Stroker to Bolt-on........you name it. Comparable Mods or Comparable Dollars and the Cobra will take the "W" 95% of the time. Until you combine a built stroker motor with a power adder on the GTO, they're usually playing catch up. As to the link in your post to the GTO Board.....some of the guys we race with are on those lists.
LS1GTO.com Forums - LS1&LS2-Forced Induction, Stroker, Nitrous, 6 speed
Your missing my point I'm not going into details of how many people have put a 150 shot on a stock gto because there is no way I could know exactly how many people have done it. What I am saying is that it's not as expensive as one person was assuming it was for a gto to beat the average eaton cobra.
I dunno what else to tell you but do the math put 500 rwhp+ 550+ rwtq in an automatic car with some tire that weighs approximately 3800 pounds, and the probabilty of it running an 11 is pretty good. Some might run slower some might run faster but the majority of them should fall in that range. For further data to back my claim, examine the link I sent you, as a supplement, to the equation.
But sure theoretically cars that are boosted from the factory and have forged internals have an advantage over n/a cars. Heck I would know I have a Buick Grand National. In theory it seems reasonable but from a technical standpoint that's not necessarily true. Most owners of boosted cars increase their hp by increasing boost, going by standard atmospheric pressure of 14.7 a car that is running approximately 15psi has in effect doubled his cubic inches. In the short run adding nitrous to a n/a car would even out the scale of owners of cars such as a Grand National or cobra that are increasing their boost, because in most cases the oem power adders will only get a car so far. However a twin screwed cobra running over 20 psi, let's just say it would take a lot more than a 150 shot on a gto to run down one of those; and seeing that it's easy for cobras to upgrade from the stock eaton to a twin screw then I would agree that once a cobra gets to the 600 rwhp range it get's expensive for the gto to reliably keep up . But if we're talking which is the better platform to go with if your looking for big hp numbers 1000+ rwhp then that's another story.
Almost all those cars in that list that are running 11s with nitrous are doing it with a full exhaust and other bolt-ons. Headers alone is what it costs to put a pulley, tune, intake on a Cobra. I can post a list of pullied Cobras running 10.60s-11.50s too, and that's just the Mid atlantic list.
Also, both cars do not weigh 3800lbs. The Cobra weighs 3650lbs. Also, show me a dyno of a stock AUTOMATIC GTO putting down 500rwhp+ with JUST nitrous.
My point is ON AVERAGE, it takes a lot more money to BEAT a cobra RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY in a GTO, in any case scenario. Like I said, the GTO is a great platform but it's heavier, less powerful stock, (Cobras were way under-rated) and don't respond as well as a boosted motor, with, or without nitrous. You simply can't argue that for the cost of headers installed on a GTO you can add a pulley, intake and mail order tune to your Cobra and make almost 450rwhp. There are eaton/nitrous cars in the 9s and 10s, but I'm not going to start posting up lists, and like you said I don't know exactly how many people are running that combo but it has become a pretty popular one.
Almost all those cars in that list that are running 11s with nitrous are doing it with a full exhaust and other bolt-ons. Headers alone is what it costs to put a pulley, tune, intake on a Cobra. I can post a list of pullied Cobras running 10.60s-11.50s too, and that's just the Mid atlantic list.
Also, both cars do not weigh 3800lbs. The Cobra weighs 3650lbs. Also, show me a dyno of a stock AUTOMATIC GTO putting down 500rwhp+ with JUST nitrous.
My point is ON AVERAGE, it takes a lot more money to BEAT a cobra RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY in a GTO, in any case scenario. Like I said, the GTO is a great platform but it's heavier, less powerful stock, (Cobras were way under-rated) and don't respond as well as a boosted motor, with, or without nitrous. You simply can't argue that for the cost of headers installed on a GTO you can add a pulley, intake and mail order tune to your Cobra and make almost 450rwhp. There are eaton/nitrous cars in the 9s and 10s, but I'm not going to start posting up lists, and like you said I don't know exactly how many people are running that combo but it has become a pretty popular one.
Pontiac Gto Nitrous
447 rwhp and 497 real wheel torque with a 100 shot ,pretty close to your 450 rwhp cobra; and the torque curve is just as good as well. So with a 150 shot add another 50 or so to the wheels and maybe 75-100 rwtq. Why do you bring up headers? They are 300$ and don't really add much over 20 hp unless the gto is cammed. A cammed, header, set up for a gto will run around 500 to 800 give or take depending on the set up and the GTO will be 450 rwhp and this could be installed by your everyday driveway mechanic in a day or so. How much would it cost to do the 4 cam swap in a cobra, or how much for full exhaust including headers on a cobra? So if one were looking for bang for the buck performance why would they spend $300 for pacesetter headers and get 20 hp; when they could get a used nitrous kit for $300 or so and have 150 hp to the wheels. Dollar for dollar a gto is comparable to an eaton cobra; sure some people like to go the expensive route and pay thousands of dollars for performance parts that yield 5 hp. And if that's what they like more power to them, but we're talking about bang for the buck bargain performance. And when all is said and done a 300 dollar used nitrous wet kit is pretty much all it would take for an auto gto to wear out most full weight non ported eaton cobras. Once the cobra goes the twin screw route like the OP well then the poor goat is in trouble as was shown, especially if its owner is cheap lol...
Pontiac Gto Nitrous
447 rwhp and 497 real wheel torque with a 100 shot ,pretty close to your 450 rwhp cobra; and the torque curve is just as good as well. So with a 150 shot add another 50 or so to the wheels and maybe 75-100 rwtq. Why do you bring up headers? They are 300$ and don't really add much over 20 hp unless the gto is cammed. A cammed, header, set up for a gto will run around 500 to 800 give or take depending on the set up and the GTO will be 450 rwhp and this could be installed by your everyday driveway mechanic in a day or so. How much would it cost to do the 4 cam swap in a cobra, or how much for full exhaust including headers on a cobra? So if one were looking for bang for the buck performance why would they spend $300 for pacesetter headers and get 20 hp; when they could get a used nitrous kit for $300 or so and have 150 hp to the wheels. Dollar for dollar a gto is comparable to an eaton cobra; sure some people like to go the expensive route and pay thousands of dollars for performance parts that yield 5 hp. And if that's what they like more power to them, but we're talking about bang for the buck bargain performance. And when all is said and done a 300 dollar used nitrous wet kit is pretty much all it would take for an auto gto to wear out most full weight non ported eaton cobras. Once the cobra goes the twin screw route like the OP well then the poor goat is in trouble as was shown, especially if its owner is cheap lol...
I bring up headers because the list you posted nearly every GTO running 11s with nitrous has at LEAST headers, and almost all the autos are running a stall. Pacesetter headers? Is that the cheapest set you could find, who actually installs those?
Once again, that is NOT the norm for a GTO, I'm talking about on average. On average it takes A LOT more coin to beat a Cobra consistently mod for mod.
3650lbs for the Cobra
3800lbs for the GTO with less power, no forged internals and no power adder
You want to talk about bargain performance and very impressive times? Fine, lets not talk average, lets talk capabilities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stiegemeier
03 04 Cobra-500 Rwhp-the Easy Way
Stiegemeier Ported Blower, Throttle Body and Plenum 57 RWHP-$695.00
2.76 BilletFlow Upper Pulley - $150
100 mm Idler
Belt
CAI - $150
NGK TR6 spark plugs
Diablo Predator Tuner
That will get you to 500 RWHP
Zomg, all Cobras with $1500 in mods can beat 90% of mid 10 second cars.
Or how about all the low 11 second 450rwhp Cobras, I guess those count too if you want to bring up impressive accomplishments and "bang for your buck performance". Who cares about average anyways when talking about beating 90% of a platform! Lets all just quote the best that's been done and fastest e/t lists! /sarcasm
A strong a4 ls2 gto will get 340-350. However those are the average numbers for the m6 gto ask me how i know Full bolt on fast intake, ported throttle body, full exhaust, and possibly even heads, and the gto will be in the 400 range without a cam or FI. And it doesn't take much money for a gto to keep up with a terminator. A 150 shot on a stock m6 or a4 gto would be more than enough, to reliably beat 90% of the terminators out there.
you might wanna think that over
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god blessed terminators on their way out of the factory
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'03 mineral grey terminator
jlt cai, smoke taillight tint, mgw orange handle, borla stinger cb, h&r race springs, mm flsfc, billetflow irs brace
'96 forest green gt
'87 black lx 5.0
yeah, i spend most of my off-work time driving the car, dreaming about what i want to do to the car, searching the internet for parts, installing parts, washing/cleaning the car, or reading on here about what others have done to their's. it's sad. worst part is i don't make enough $ to support this addiction. that is precisely what it is... an addiction, like to a drug. again, sad.
That is true. I wish my engine was forged from the factory and could fit a twin screw.
Haha me too man us gto guys envy the fact that the twin screw companies never show are cars any love. I would love to see a twin screw cobra like the op's take on a twin screw forged gto.
, and stock vs stock, goats are just 100-125lbs heavier. and i'd think with a 500+ termi you should beat both goats in the video, although, the yellow one might surprise you, several times..... and with less than those 500 formidable hp.
There are a lot of cars that would get beat by a stock c5 z06, a terminator included (which is not much lighter than a gto); that's the worst comparison I've ever seen. The only thing worse would be you comparing the z06 to a stock z28 camaro. Anyways back on topic a 150 shot on a stock gto would put it in the mid 11's, and I'm not saying it would rip a kenne bell or whippled cobra. A twin screwed cobras would probably slap a nitrous only gto silly, which is why I'm glad the vast majority of cobra's don't have twin screws. 
Cobra ftw
Is that the cheapest set you could find, who actually installs those?
/sarcasm
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