Hauler driver got pulled over.. a little unusual

[blacksheep-1]

Our regular Semi driver (with a CDL) was driving the toter home (registered in PA as a rec vee) He was pulled over in Texas by a county
" commercial vehicle enforcement officer" which wrote him a ticket for not having the vehicle registered as a commercial vehicle, and not having a log book.
The toter home had a 40ft trailer with spares in it for the racecar, which was inspected by the officer, along with a vehicle inspection.
I have actually driven this myself before across the US and back,(and I don't have a CDL).
So we're trying to figure out if it's even worth it to register it as a rec vee, although commercial vehicle taxes would probably be a lot higher, and if a CDL is required to drive it or not.
I would have thought that FDOT would be dealing with this, not the county..but he was doing a big business stopping rigs pulling out of Austin after the race.
Apparently it's legit in Maryland where it was registered.
Do other states not recognize rec vees from other states..or what gives?
FWIW the vehicle is not required to cross the scales.
Thanks.

 

[mammothcar1]

There have been quite a few discussions about your exact situation over on Yellow Bullet.
(Mods. sorry if I crossed a line referencing another forum.)

 

[silver03svt]

A little more information is needed about how you are using the "RV" in reference to your racing activities. FMCSA lists specific requirements for what is considered a CMV in how it is used. What CFR sections are listed on the inspection report and/or citations?

 

[blacksheep-1]

A little more information is needed about how you are using the "RV" in reference to your racing activities. FMCSA lists specific requirements for what is considered a CMV in how it is used. What CFR sections are listed on the inspection report and/or citations?

I will do my best to answer that question, here's a pic of the vehicle (actually with an illegal trailer attached..but that wasn't the case in Texas). Clearly, it's a semi, being used to haul a race car trailer, registered as a rec vee, which is actually not unusual, the paddock is full of these labeled "private coach not for hire".
The ticket was for 2 things, 1. no logbook, and 2. invalid registration (not registered as a commercial vehicle). I'm not looking to bust chops here, clearly it's pushing the "rec vee" angle, but I don't want to get nailed for having the wrong license if I ever drive it. The reason I got picked is that I used to teach emergency vehicle driving for fire apparatus.

 

[silver03svt]

I will do my best to answer that question, here's a pic of the vehicle (actually with an illegal trailer attached..but that wasn't the case in Texas). Clearly, it's a semi, being used to haul a race car trailer, registered as a rec vee, which is actually not unusual, the paddock is full of these labeled "private coach not for hire".
The ticket was for 2 things, 1. no logbook, and 2. invalid registration (not registered as a commercial vehicle). I'm not looking to bust chops here, clearly it's pushing the "rec vee" angle, but I don't want to get nailed for having the wrong license if I ever drive it. The reason I got picked is that I used to teach emergency vehicle driving for fire apparatus.

Even seeing that, and being FMCSA (DOT) inspector, there still needs to be more information gathered on it. Is the vehicle SOLELY used for recreational purposes? Most would see a racecar hauler (racing for money/sponsors/etc.....) more as a business (think NASCAR/NHRA/etc.....) and not as a recreational vehicle. In that scenario, it is a CMV, needs to be registered as such, require a CDL to operate, and the driver would need a log book because he is MORE than 150 miles from the base of operations.

From my opinion, that is just my perspective of the FEDERAL side of it, and as you know, STATE laws will vary as well.

 

[STAMPEDE3]

By definition for your intended use it should not require a CDL.
However, some states require more licensing or registration when it comes to trucks over 26K and/or air brakes.

In Tx you should have a non commercial class A or B but I would think that your license is determined by the state you live/registered.
Non commercial license for these still normally need to take the CDL written test.

But as Doug said, knowing what it is used for plays a part but I know many racing guys who have the same set up registered the same.

 

[blacksheep-1]

Even seeing that, and being FMCSA (DOT) inspector, there still needs to be more information gathered on it. Is the vehicle SOLELY used for recreational purposes? Most would see a racecar hauler (racing for money/sponsors/etc.....) more as a business (think NASCAR/NHRA/etc.....) and not as a recreational vehicle. In that scenario, it is a CMV, needs to be registered as such, require a CDL to operate, and the driver would need a log book because he is MORE than 150 miles from the base of operations.

From my opinion, that is just my perspective of the FEDERAL side of it, and as you know, STATE laws will vary as well.

Well we race in a "pro series" 10 times per year (actually kind of funny, as if anyone made money at racing) so maybe your interpretation is the best. But for the most part it's used for non pro racing and a place to relax.
in any case, to be on the safe side I should get a CDL I guess.

 

[silver03svt]

Well we race in a "pro series" 10 times per year (actually kind of funny, as if anyone made money at racing) so maybe your interpretation is the best. But for the most part it's used for non pro racing and a place to relax.
in any case, to be on the safe side I should get a CDL I guess.

I think the CDL wouldn't be necessary if YOU owned the setup (truck and trailer), and YOU were driving it when/if it were stopped. At that point, the "RV" side of it is more credible in the eyes of the law. Kind of hard to claim it as an "RV" when somebody else drives it around for you.

Same with any private party vehicle really. I can have a 3 axle tractor and a 2 axle trailer with a GVWR of 80,000 pounds and NOT need a CDL or register it as a CMV IF I am the owner/operator and ONLY use it for my private use. "NOT FOR HIRE" does not always mean it is a private use vehicle.

I know, the Federal law is as clear as mud, and it really boils down to the DOT man doing the inspection. I have always said to play it safe. It may cost a bit more up front, but might save you more in the long run.

 

[jbs$]

You need to lawyer up with one of the downtown guys, not a regular ticket chaser. This appears on the surface as something that could get out of hand and cost you some serious money. The fact that it was a county monuntie not the hwy. patrol is a good indicator that it was a money hunt to start with.

 

[Thump_rrr]

Our regular Semi driver (with a CDL) was driving the toter home (registered in PA as a rec vee) He was pulled over in Texas by a county
" commercial vehicle enforcement officer" which wrote him a ticket for not having the vehicle registered as a commercial vehicle, and not having a log book.
The toter home had a 40ft trailer with spares in it for the racecar, which was inspected by the officer, along with a vehicle inspection.
I have actually driven this myself before across the US and back,(and I don't have a CDL).
So we're trying to figure out if it's even worth it to register it as a rec vee, although commercial vehicle taxes would probably be a lot higher, and if a CDL is required to drive it or not.
I would have thought that FDOT would be dealing with this, not the county..but he was doing a big business stopping rigs pulling out of Austin after the race.
Apparently it's legit in Maryland where it was registered.
Do other states not recognize rec vees from other states..or what gives?
FWIW the vehicle is not required to cross the scales.
Thanks.

You have a driver actually driving the vehicle as opposed to someone on vacation, so it is not being driven recreationally.
He needs a log book PERIOD.
As for it being a recreational vehicle it can be if you are driving it for your own pleasure.

 

[STAMPEDE3]

You have a driver actually driving the vehicle as opposed to someone on vacation, so it is not being driven recreationally.
He needs a log book PERIOD.
As for it being a recreational vehicle it can be if you are driving it for your own pleasure.

If the driver is being paid I agree.
If he is not paid then it is no different than a group of friends going fishing at a campground towing a big boat.

Friends racing for fun vs shop guys being paid makes a difference I think.

 

[blacksheep-1]

OK, after all the legal stuff this is how it turned out, the driver was being paid to drive the rig, therefore he did indeed need a log, and it was a defacto "commercial vehicle". Therefore the ticket{s} stood. The lawyer requested that he receive no points and would pay the fine and court costs but the judge wanted points on the license. It does seem that CDL license holders are held to a higher standard than regular drivers, and rightly so, although it seems like maybe under the circumstances the judge would throw him a bone..but whatever.
In any case if you have a rig registered as an RV, either the owner needs to be driving it, or someone that is NOT being paid to drive.

Thanks for your input, I thought you might like to know how it turned out..

Be safe

 

[silver03svt]

Thanks for the update. Hopefully the points won't affect your driver's CDL too much.