How much power can these new 5.0 motors handle?

[backinastang]

Ford will warranty a 525 S/C kit running 6 or so lbs. The don't warranty the 624 hp version which is 9 or so lbs. Those are flywheel ratings. I'd say Roush is pushing it with 575hp. Because this is a guessing game I'd say 550hp so 7 lbs of boost for be safe and get at least 75k miles out of your car.

 

[alex12gt]

A factor of safety of 1.5 gives 618chp , 1.8 gives 742chp. Completely inline with the whp numbers you just posted, 495-594 with a 20% drivetrain loss.

I really dont think a 20% loss is the case that number is kind of an old number id bet drivetrain loss is even less then 15%

 

[slagburn]

Slagburn's car was making about 500-520whp for over a year and something like 25K miles. He upped the boost and was making right at 560whp for iirc about 7k miles and is now building his motor thanks to an oh so slightly bent rod. He got lucky and cought it before it completely let go and put windows in the block. I believe he was shifting at 7K also. If you want a true to god reliable power limit I would say 525whp and you can enjoy the motor living for a long time like that. Once you go above that it starts to become a crap shoot.

Mostly right. I only have about 500-1000 miles on that little pulley, I only ran it with race gas or Torco in the tank. Numbers were about 600, then about 650 pullied down to the smallest one they make for the 2.3 Whipple. Corrected numbers, usually at 1.22-1.25 factor to SAE up here. My thought was always that I could keep the uncorrected number under 600 and be fine. Not so.

The thing is, we are the experimenters right now. If Ford did this 'testing' we don't know about it except what is implied by the various warranty durations. What will they hold for 10K miles vs 30K or 60K, etc? Nobody knows yet.

 

[seank]

I really dont think a 20% loss is the case that number is kind of an old number id bet drivetrain loss is even less then 15%

Use any factor you want drivetrain loss is irrelevant in this discussion. Whether you're losing 10% or 25% has no effect on on what the rods, pistons, and valve train will tolerate.

 

[alex12gt]

Use any factor you want drivetrain loss is irrelevant in this discussion. Whether you're losing 10% or 25% has no effect on on what the rods, pistons, and valve train will tolerate.

Except for the fact that 95% of people use rwhp on this for so drivetrain loss at least give you an idea of what the motor itself will take

 

[bexamous]

Shocking, a ford motor with weak rods and pistons!!

There is a difference between 'weak link' and 'weak'.

 

[svt5.4]

Ford will warranty a 525 S/C kit running 6 or so lbs. The don't warranty the 624 hp version which is 9 or so lbs. Those are flywheel ratings. I'd say Roush is pushing it with 575hp. Because this is a guessing game I'd say 550hp so 7 lbs of boost for be safe and get at least 75k miles out of your car.

525hp -20% auto loss = 420rwhp. Crap, a tune would put me close to a ford s/c number. :nonono:

 

[WHSTLR]

Everyone is only looking at PSI from boosting. What about nitrous? How much can it handle? Is a 150 shot with a progressive ramped up over the 1200ft (of the 1320) any worse than boost? Is a 100 shot from the hit a hard wear and tear compared to a TS? Etc..>!

 

[alex12gt]

525hp -20% auto loss = 420rwhp. Crap, a tune would put me close to a ford s/c number. :nonono:

As stated before that drivetrain loss of %20 does not apply to these cars

 

[svt5.4]

As stated before that drivetrain loss of %20 does not apply to these cars

I think 20% still applies towards transmissions however, I think I agree it doesn't apply to these motors. The motors are underrated. I think a fair estimate out of a 525hp kit would be 445-455. (90-115hp increase from factory)

 

[alex12gt]

I think 20% still applies towards transmissions however, I think I agree it doesn't apply to these motors. The motors are underrated. I think a fair estimate out of a 525hp kit would be 445-455. (90-115hp increase from factory

If there was 20% loss thatd put these motors to around 330 to the rear wheel and there is no way the motor is that overrated the new shelby is rated at 660 and is putting down right around 600 and not exactly sure on this info but have read the shelby has less then %10 loss:rolling:

 

[seank]

So most 5.0s I've seen put down in the neighborhood of 365 stock or ~12% loss. At the end of the day it still doesn't matter. What matters is crank horsepower. Wheel horsepower is a false indicator because of how much variation can be seen in dyno numbers. At the end of the day I'm sticking with 575-650 crank horsepower and you should be enjoying your car without opening the motor for near factory longevity. It will still be critical to take actual use and proper maintenance in to consideration though.

 

[truebluedevil02]

So most 5.0s I've seen put down in the neighborhood of 365 stock or ~12% loss. At the end of the day it still doesn't matter. What matters is crank horsepower. Wheel horsepower is a false indicator because of how much variation can be seen in dyno numbers. At the end of the day I'm sticking with 575-650 crank horsepower and you should be enjoying your car without opening the motor for near factory longevity. It will still be critical to take actual use and proper maintenance in to consideration though.

Your exactly right, 12% is the norm. Auto cars used to be close to 20% but now they are becoming more and more efficient and I think they are around the 15% mark now. I would have completely agreed with your HP claim as well until my buddy's car bent a rod at right around 580whp. Granted it got A LOT of abuse and miles on it at around 520whp but still. I think at 600whp if you take care of it an otherwise un modded/abused car will probably make it 10K ish miles before it breaks but there are so many variables in this equation that no one can say for sure.

 

[seank]

Yep, use will dictate actual life. Someone could be at 750 and granny the thing all the time with an occasional romp and it live for 50k while a guy at 525 who beats it at the track every weekend is opening the motor at 10k. People will also need to understand that with increased power comes increased maintenance efforts.

 

[WHSTLR]

LOL! You guys got stuck on one topic and missed my question. Post #48

 

[seank]

I have absolutely zero knowledge about N20 so I chose not to address that. I've never used it or intend to. At the end of the day 600 chp is probably the sweet spot or approaching the upper limit of what it will tolerate for long term OE like life. That's not to be used as gospel but based on known failures and some basic engineering assumptions that's what I'm going with until more data is present and people have been pushing these motors for more than just slightly over a year.

 

[RusWolf]

I think you mean oil pump gears and the gears are 3-400 plus install

Yes, that's what i meant )

I was actually curious on the labor cost on average.

I'm planning on keeping the car until around 2016 so i would like to have everything in once piece lol...So i guess little upgrades will come eventually and i should probably start saving for a new engine just in case.

Hopefully by then i will able to afford 2016 GT500 and maybe even TT it, lol...


MMR was offering a killer deal on their new block. $2000 for a fully built block!
If i see a deal like that in 6-7 month i may just jump on that, get it with billet gears and be good to go to up the boost to 12-14 psi and make around 700 with Novi 2200.

The question is, WHERE to use that power?
I do not go to the track a whole lot, and i do not race on the street...so really the only thing i do is keep to myself and smile knowing that i have a pretty quick car!

 

[WHSTLR]

I have absolutely zero knowledge about N20 so I chose not to address that. I've never used it or intend to. At the end of the day 600 chp is probably the sweet spot or approaching the upper limit of what it will tolerate for long term OE like life. That's not to be used as gospel but based on known failures and some basic engineering assumptions that's what I'm going with until more data is present and people have been pushing these motors for more than just slightly over a year.

No worries, thanks for the tip!

 

[RusWolf]

I'm always curious about "giggle" juice...

BUT

Nitrious is like a smoking hot prostitute... you want to hit it but too afraid of the consequences!

At least in my case, lol

 

[150xlt]

Im getting my dollars ready and getting ready to pound the pot smoking prostitute! Got my injectors to convert the car over to e85 and will be getting tuned for the plate kit already installed in the next week or two.