built motor / cams / 2.9 whipple crusher power estimate

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

Almost finished with the new motor. car is just about ready to come together.

Motor specs. 5.3 stroker shortblock, forged i beam rods w/ arp 2000 bolts, arp hardware across the board, mahle pistons "yes mahle not manley". Lightly ported heads w/ comp stage 3 cams. 9:5:1 compression. ID1300s. Thinking i will pull the trigger on a gen 2 whipple 2.9 crusher this weekend. Intend on running a pump gas / torco tune and a seperate e85 tune.

What kind of power do you think it will put down on 93 pump gas w/ torco? On E85?

Shooting for range of 1000 rwhp.

Hoping @Malcomv8 has some input

gt347mustang · Mar 6, 2018

Hate to burst your bubble but 1000 ain't happening.

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

gt347mustang said:
Hate to burst your bubble but 1000 ain't happening.

I didn't think I'm terribly far off my power goals. Please explain though. I'm all ears.

gt347mustang · Mar 6, 2018

What are your cams degreed at?

Why is compression so low?

Adding cubic inch on a PD blower generally doesn't add much(if any) horsepower, so the 5.3 isn't helping as much as you think.

If you're dead set on 1000 go turbo

Soap · Mar 6, 2018

gt347mustang said:
If you're dead set on 1000 go turbo

Or get rid of those pistons and go to 11.5:1+ compression. However that is not going to be very pump gas friendly.

--Joe

98 Saleen Cobra · Mar 6, 2018

You need more compression and stg3 ported heads.

TooFast98Cobra · Mar 6, 2018

850rw at most

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

gt347mustang said:
What are your cams degreed at?

Why is compression so low?

Adding cubic inch on a PD blower generally doesn't add much(if any) horsepower, so the 5.3 isn't helping as much as you think.

If you're dead set on 1000 go turbo

My engine assembler and I decided on the low compression with the idea in the back of our minds that I'm going to be throwing a lot of boost at it and I wanted to keep it reliable despite the boost levels.

I am set on keeping the PD blower however. Don't have any interest in going turbo with this car.

I am unsure of where my assembler degreed the cams to, but i will find that info out and post it.

A local guy here in new england "@mbarbalinardo on instagram" did a very similar build on a 5.3 and with a vmp tvs @16 psi on pump gas and made 740 rwhp with ease. I don't know of any stock bore terminators making that kind of power on 16 psi / pump gas.
Picking up another 260 rwhp with e85 and a 2.9 crusher didn't sound out of the question to me.

Not saying you are wrong. Just stating my opinion. This is why i posted this thread

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

Soap said:
Or get rid of those pistons and go to 11.5:1+ compression. However that is not going to be very pump gas friendly.

--Joe

E85 is not readily available in NH so i need something that i can still run on pump / torco if i intend on driving the car on any longer rides. "Have to truck up E85 from MA and have a pump set up in my garage"

gt347mustang · Mar 6, 2018

None of the parts you're putting on the car are new or revolutionary, so what makes you think your build is something special that will break 4 digits where no typical build using similar or even better parts will only make high 800's? I feel that maybe we're missing a critical component or something that'll add 150+ HP to your specific car.

Please find 5 examples of 4.6 based mod motors that have eclipsed 950 and let's compare build sheets to yours.

GodStang · Mar 6, 2018

gt347mustang said:
None of the parts you're putting on the car are new or revolutionary, so what makes you think your build is something special that will break 4 digits where no typical build using similar or even better parts will only make high 800's? I feel that maybe we're missing a critical component or something that'll add 150+ HP to your specific car.

Please find 5 examples of 4.6 based mod motors that have eclipsed 950 and let's compare build sheets to yours.

Of the cars I can think of that are 900rwhp and above Twin screw all are 9.5:1 and above. 8.5:1 not happening unless a lot of boost and E85, custom cams, and great heads. I could see a good amount of boost and E85 hitting 800s.

You basically have my old build but you have .3 liters more but I had more compression. I ran it on 93 octane and I ran 28.5psi and E92. Ya 1000rwhp aint going to happen without cheating the dyno.

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

GodStang said:
Of the cars I can think of that are 900rwhp and above Twin screw all are 9.5:1 and above. 8.5:1 not happening unless a lot of boost and E85, custom cams, and great heads. I could see a good amount of boost and E85 hitting 800s.

You basically have my old build but you have .3 liters more but I had more compression. I ran it on 93 octane and I ran 28.5psi and E92. Ya 1000rwhp aint going to happen without cheating the dyno.

out of curiosity, What did your set up make?

c6zhombre · Mar 6, 2018

You need a lot more compression to approach the E85 goal.....but then you jeopardize the pump gas realibility. It's a conundrum.

GodStang · Mar 6, 2018

aarons04cobra said:
out of curiosity, What did your set up make?

The old setup was something like low 700s on 18psi and 93 octane and upper 700s on high boost and E85. I ran too much boost I think and that is why I have a bigger blower now.

I think with your setup with 93 and torco depending on timing and boost I would look at 680-720 SAE range and E85 if you pick right pulley combo and good cooling you could look at 770rwhp-850rwhp. I would say 830 on the high side I would walk away happy.

I hope you go out there and prove us wrong but just from what I have seen in the past.

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

GodStang said:
The old setup was something like low 700s on 18psi and 93 octane and upper 700s on high boost and E85. I ran too much boost I think and that is why I have a bigger blower now.

I think with your setup with 93 and torco depending on timing and boost I would look at 680-720 SAE range and E85 if you pick right pulley combo and good cooling you could look at 770rwhp-850rwhp. I would say 830 on the high side I would walk away happy.

I hope you go out there and prove us wrong but just from what I have seen in the past.

Great input. Thank you very much.
Its too late for me to change compression now without tearing into the motor again. I would be happy with low to mid 800s but my goal was really to at least get my 1000 rwhp on the dyno.
"back story on the car" it belonged to a close friend of mine who passed away in early 2015. It was his goal to get this car to the 1000 rwhp mark on a PD blower. I purchased the car from his family and have built it to its current status. Not trying to hit the 1000 rw mark for any sort of dick measuring contest. Simply trying to hit a sentimental goal.

aarons04cobra · Mar 6, 2018

GodStang said:
The old setup was something like low 700s on 18psi and 93 octane and upper 700s on high boost and E85. I ran too much boost I think and that is why I have a bigger blower now.

I think with your setup with 93 and torco depending on timing and boost I would look at 680-720 SAE range and E85 if you pick right pulley combo and good cooling you could look at 770rwhp-850rwhp. I would say 830 on the high side I would walk away happy.

I hope you go out there and prove us wrong but just from what I have seen in the past.

What are your thoughts if I spent the extra money and moved to the gen 3 2.9 crusher? Iv heard rumor of 50-80 hp more on the same boost levels.

Also curious on the 2.6 vmp tvs but I don't think I want to wait until June for it

GodStang · Mar 6, 2018

aarons04cobra said:
What are your thoughts if I spent the extra money and moved to the gen 3 2.9 crusher? Iv heard rumor of 50-80 hp more on the same boost levels.

I have not seen enough real world information on the Gen 3.

willis414 · Mar 6, 2018

Go see Pete @ performance dyno, get some E85. I think you'll be happy!

01Jes · Mar 6, 2018

850~900 if you turn the piss out of it. Then add a 150 shot. You’ll get there

98 Saleen Cobra · Mar 6, 2018

aarons04cobra said:
My engine assembler and I decided on the low compression with the idea in the back of our minds that I'm going to be throwing a lot of boost at it and I wanted to keep it reliable despite the boost levels.

I am set on keeping the PD blower however. Don't have any interest in going turbo with this car.

I am unsure of where my assembler degreed the cams to, but i will find that info out and post it.

A local guy here in new england "@mbarbalinardo on instagram" did a very similar build on a 5.3 and with a vmp tvs @16 psi on pump gas and made 740 rwhp with ease. I don't know of any stock bore terminators making that kind of power on 16 psi / pump gas.
Picking up another 260 rwhp with e85 and a 2.9 crusher didn't sound out of the question to me.

Not saying you are wrong. Just stating my opinion. This is why i posted this thread

AED did a 5.0 stroker, 10:5 compression, stock bore teksid. Custom cams, ported heads, it made 980rwhp SAE.. and well into the 1k range on pump E85.. On C85 it made 1000rwhp SAE.. So it has been done.. Again with .3 more displacement and less heads and probably not as good of cams you aren't going to get close.. Also that was a 2.9 crusher on a 3.0" pulley and stock lower.. So it's got more in it..
My suggestion: cancel the order on the 8.5 pistons and go 10:5..

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