3.8 Whipple on 93 octane

gonabite

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Has anyone bolted the 3.8 on an tested with 93 octane with the 3.75 pulley or smaller to see what max power is before being octane limited?

I'm wondering the versatility of this setup. Obviously 11-1200 is possible with E-85 or race fuel. However with supporting the fuel system upgrades is 900-950 possible on 93 octane?

I know myself and I always go down the rabbit hole. So doing bolt ons and porting the stock blower will just be a band aid and a temporary fix for my sickness.

Figured if I can get over 900 with a fuel system and the 3.8 that will scratch the itch for now, and when I start heading back to the drag strip ( because its inevitable) Ill throw the E 85 tune in it.
 

Klaus

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Has anyone bolted the 3.8 on an tested with 93 octane with the 3.75 pulley or smaller to see what max power is before being octane limited?

I'm wondering the versatility of this setup. Obviously 11-1200 is possible with E-85 or race fuel. However with supporting the fuel system upgrades is 900-950 possible on 93 octane?

I know myself and I always go down the rabbit hole. So doing bolt ons and porting the stock blower will just be a band aid and a temporary fix for my sickness.

Figured if I can get over 900 with a fuel system and the 3.8 that will scratch the itch for now, and when I start heading back to the drag strip ( because its inevitable) Ill throw the E 85 tune in it.

3.8 on pump gas seems like a complete waste.
 

gonabite

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Clearly reading comprehension isn't a strong suit here.

So I'll help you folks comprehend. I asked a question, which means I'm looking for an answer.

I'm not looking for opinions, or worthless threads of opinions.

I have built countless low 9 second cars, I understand volumetric efficiency and engine dynamics.

What would be a waste for me would be spending $8k doing bolt ons and porting a stock blower to squeeze ever bit of power out of that blower, then when I want more power have to buy a 3.8 anyway.
 

gonabite

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No sir my mind is not made up. I'm only looking to see if anyone has results with what I asked.
 

biminiLX

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Who is doing your tuning?
My ‘22 is scheduled to be built in June so I’m having a similar debate.
Depends how far you want to push the car, because as you know, the stock blower can take it a long way.
Unfortunately no data to share but I do have first hand knowledge of the 3.0 and 3.8 on a top end Coyote build.
Stock blower maxed out or either of the whipples can make enough to challenge the stock bottom end.
-J
 

me32

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Oh this has the potential to get good. As the OP has stated the stock blower is a waste. So best option get the 3.8L and play with pulley's and see what works out. We all look forward to the data you will provide.
 

gonabite

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Who is doing your tuning?
My ‘22 is scheduled to be built in June so I’m having a similar debate.
Depends how far you want to push the car, because as you know, the stock blower can take it a long way.
Unfortunately no data to share but I do have first hand knowledge of the 3.0 and 3.8 on a top end Coyote build.
Stock blower maxed out or either of the whipples can make enough to challenge the stock bottom end.
-J

Congratulations on your build.

I like your thinking. If you have the slightest thought of going big, may as not waste money on doing your build around the stock blower.

Corbin Johnson, who calibrates for Fathouse Performance would be who I would use to calibrate my car. He has done excellent work for me in the past helping me take a record that still holds to date on another platform.
 
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robvas

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Congratulations on your build.

I like your thinking. If you have the slightest thought of going big, may as not waste money on doing your around the stock blower.

Corbin Johnson, who calibrates for Fathouse Performance would be who I would use to calibrate my car. He has done excellent work for me in the past helping me take a record that still holds to date on another platform.
What did say about using the 3.8?
 

gonabite

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Oh this has the potential to get good. As the OP has stated the stock blower is a waste. So best option get the 3.8L and play with pulley's and see what works out. We all look forward to the data you will provide.

I'm not sure where you see that I ever posted that the stock blower is a waste.

I'm looking for anyone who has has experience with this setup.

I have paved many a roads of new platforms and engine builds of new parts over the years.

This time I'm getting to the party late on a two year old platform and am looking for as much information from people like me who have given the same type of information out over the years because I was one of the first to do something.
 

gonabite

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What did say about using the 3.8?
I haven't asked him yet. I was waiting to see if anyone here had heard of or done it yet. I may call Ken at PBD and see if he ever played around with the 3.8 on 93 just for the hell of it on the dyno.
 

biminiLX

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I haven't asked him yet. I was waiting to see if anyone here had heard of or done it yet. I may call Ken at PBD and see if he ever played around with the 3.8 on 93 just for the hell of it on the dyno.
I’ve talked to Ken a few times, most recently at Mod Nats last November and while I’ll be keeping this ‘22 wife/kid friendly (compared to my ‘14), he and I both liked the idea of twins on this platform with the DCT.
Obviously you’ll be in good hands with your connections at Fathouse but it’s hard to ignore the info/experience Ken and PBD have on this platform.
-J
 

2V Terror

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Here is my take on things.

The stock blower is a 2650. These can handle/support/make a lot of power. The limit will be the fuel being used whether it is 91 octane, 93 octane, race gas, meth, or ethanol percentage. In this case the fuel being used is 93 octane.

So how much can 93 octane support? That is the question. To me it seems as if 93 octane is good for around 800+ RWHP but not much more. In some cases people have made 850s and even close to 900s. But that could be more due to dyno variances and other differences. I have some quotes that say I could make 850s on 93 octane on my 20 GT500 but that includes porting and other mods.

So really it is about boost. If you can keep the boost low then you can make more power but it still would be limited...just to what point??

Obviously the 3.8 is going to be more efficient than the stock 2650. So right there you will be making more power with less boost. But if all you are doing is the blower and pulley then you actually are wasting time and money. With such limited mods you won't do much better than the stock unit if you do any better at all. It would seem to me that the only time the 3.8 would be useful, outside of the coolness factor, is when you're doing LTs, cams, and a bunch of other stuff.

So basically if all you do is the 3.8 and a pulley then you'll still be capped right around the same levels that the stock blower will be at. Maybe you'll make more power per boost but you'll still be stuck in the 800s on 93 octane. So unless the goal is to build further in the future then it wouldn't be a good idea. If you plan to add cams and LTs and more stuff then yea, buy the bigger blower now and save the time and money.

So basically whether you do a ported stock blower or the 3.8 you will be limited to 800s. If you do cams and other stuff then you can squeeze a little more but you will still be limited and it won't be worth the money spent. If you do a bunch more mods with a goal to use stronger fuels and more supporting mods then the 3.8 will really shine and will outrun the stock blower. But at this point, again, 850s - 900s depending on dyno, weather, tuner, etc. I would not push it too much further past that.
 

2V Terror

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Basically, until you get to where you're doing other more extensive mods, I don't see the 3.8 doing anything a stock ported blower can do if the limit is 93 octane. Maybe the 3.8 might squeeze out a little more. But it won't be enough to justify the cost of the blower upgrade.
 

biminiLX

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Turbo and rpm for detonation resistance on pump but I don’t even consider pump (other than maybe flex fuel) 93 for any of my boosted builds.
-J
 

cobrainfo1

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I have Exactly the setup you're inquiring about with dyno sheets.

21 GT500 3.8 whipple just as the kit comes on 93 & E85
2in American racing headers to a borla Atack exhaust
ID1300 injectors
On the 3.865 pulley the kit comes with

Made 915rwhp on 93
And 1030 on E85

HPP Racing did the full installation, I just got the car back today. (Maybe in the future I'll add a pound of boost if I can squeek it out on 93) have yet to confirm with Manny if that's possible.

Came out of a 760whp 14' gt500 thinking making this transition would be nothing, and frankly this new GT500 scares me a little bit it's raw & rowdy as hell.

I'd be glad to share graphs and pictures I'm not the most savvy on picture forum posts
 

biminiLX

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Very nice!
I’m currently debating the same kit.
Do you think the headers are necessary? I might just do race pipes although full headers are the better option.
I personally don’t plan to do pump 93 but my tuner likes 93+Boostane over pump E85 but I’ll probably stay pump E85 and use 93+Boostane.
Great results. How is it just on pump 93 around town? What tire do you run?
I have 325 Toyos to install.
On pic what phone do you use? I upload directly from iPhone.
-J
 

cobrainfo1

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I think the headers & no cats is what pumped my numbers a little bit. I had full exhaust stainless works on my 14' gt500 also no cars and this new GT500 is just ridiculous how it sounds the exhaust note can't be compared to anything I've heard before mustang wise. Scale ridiculous....

I tossed and turned porting the stock blower with full supporting mods and have absolutely zero regrets going with the whipple

Shoot me a text even (817-789-800three)
 

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