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4.6L 3v Ford Performance phaser kit

Discussion in 'Road Side Pub' started by RedVenom48, Apr 23, 2021.

  1. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Wife and I are looking at an 06 Mustang GT Convertible. My car to get to and from work M-F, wife works from home. Once Im home and the weekends, the car is hers. Not looking for performance, just the fun of a convertible and 3v rumble for her. I'll enjoy far better mpg than the Excursion or GT500. Coyote GTs are stupid expensive at the moment.

    I know the 3v in the Mustang has low oil pressure and phaser issues, but does anyone know if the parts kit from Ford Performance, kit number: M-6004-463V has all the updated parts? I already have the updated Ford Performance oil pump kit I was going to use on my GT500, but those plans are cancelled.

    Specifically, are these parts considered good to go, or good for another 90k or so.

    @kevinatfms @svtfocus2cobra any experience with these?
     
  2. svtfocus2cobra

    svtfocus2cobra Opprimere, Velocitas, Violentia Operandi Established Member

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    I haven't dealt with the issue on a 3V Mustang before and unfortunately I've never ordered the individual replacement parts for any of the 3V motors due to the handful of them we did get being so far gone at the point when it got to us that it was just diagnosed as needing a new motor. It is my understanding though that all new replacement motors from Ford and the aftermarket companies all utilize the updated parts, so if Ford sells the motors with the new parts then they likely sell the updated parts individually as well.
     
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  3. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    Even the newer stuff can break. I did the full FRPP kit on the wife's 06 when she had it. We timed it well as when we pulled the cover one of the guides had broken. But the driver phaser lasted about 10k. The second one lasted about 5. For the third replacement I went with a Dorman part and we traded the car in shortly after that.
     
  4. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Just curious, did you also upgrade the oil pump to the FRPP 3v/Trinity GT500 pump when you made the repairs?
     
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  5. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    No. We did this a few years ago. I never noticed an issue with the oil pressure. The pin holding the spring on the phaser is what broke in my case.
     
  6. kevinatfms

    kevinatfms Ex-Ford/Kia/Hyundai Tech Premium Member Established Member

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    How many miles on the car? Any maintenance records? Dealer used car or private sale? Also, put spark plugs on that list of items to check....06 models have the "killer" 2 piece projected tip spark plugs.

    Never used the Ford Performance kit. I worked on a few F150's and an Expedition with the Livernois lockout kit(which is extremely nice BTW). We usually just used OE parts counter stuff as they didnt have a full phaser kit at the time even from OE/Motorcraft. Warranty also wouldnt let you replace both sides unless both banks tested bad which was unusual. Other times it would wipe a camshaft and then a motor replacement was cheaper for the customer.

    The biggest issue is the screens on the phaser mounting blocks bolted to the front of the head or the actual phaser solenoid getting clogged with trash. If you change the oil regularly and use a quality oil filter you shouldnt have to worry about phaser issues(unless its an early 05-06 model). The redesigned phaser solenoids went into effect at the end of 2006 when the new cylinder head was being phased in.

    Is there something wrong with your car now or you just going to do preventive maintenance?

    Oh and i highly suggest hot rod cams if your wife wants that sound. They are insanely good, make great power on stock heads and have very good driveability. I made 360whp with full bolt ons, ported heads and some NSR cams(which were not big enough) on my 2005 GT. Had i gone with the Hot Rod cams i believe i could have picked up another 15-20whp. The NSR cams just were too small for the combination i had. Either way, it was enough to put me neck and neck with a 2013 Boss 302 due to the weight difference of my car to my friends car.

    If there isnt a care about them then id go with lockouts from Livernois and get the corresponding tune. Never have to worry about them again without any real downsides.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2021
  7. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Thank you for the reply!

    We actually passed on the 2006 and bought a 2007 Grabber Orange Mustang GT vert with only 75,500 miles. Purchased from a Nissan dealer right next door to a Ford dealer haha. We are 3rd owner, all AZ car and looks to have been garaged its whole life as there is no sun damage anywhere.

    My wife absolutely LOVES her car, and she was surprised at how much she loved the color.

    Sounds like we did ourselves a favor going 07. Was there a midyear production change or did all 2007s get the updated heads/plugs?

    I knew going in about the 2 peice plugs and phasers, but the wife admitted to me that she loves the retro look for the 05-09. Her fav mustangs are Gen 1 64-68, then 05-09.

    Lol, I told her if the 3v ever really gives us real problems it's getting Coyote swapped.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2021
  8. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    The plugs weren't changed until 2008. And I think it was a mid year change as my 2008 Expedition still had the two piece plugs. They're really not that bad to change if you take your time. I've changed quite a few sets and only had one break. That was on an F150 with over 120K and I was getting cocky as it was the last plug.
     
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  9. cidsamuth

    cidsamuth Liberty Biberty Established Member

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    It was definitely mid-year 08 that the heads/plugs changed. When my 08 was stock, it had the old style. The entire issue is overblown though . . . it's only an issue if they have never been changed. If they have been changed already, chances are they are a one-piece plug design and fine. Even with the old plugs, there's much bad info out there on where they seized and how.

    When I had a Brenspeed B326 built, they used the old style heads, as it is just what they had in stock at the time. No concerns from me.

    Also, according to Brenspeed, all those Ford Performance kits now have phasers updated using lessons learned from the Coyote designs -- so one would assume the current design was updated post 2011. I don't remember much in the way of details, only that this was important for me because I kept the VCT active (though limited) with the increase valve spring strength of the Stage 3 B326; they claim the redesign was important to the phasers overcoming the valve springs.

    Hope that helps.
     
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  10. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Good to hear they arent as massive a pain in the ass as it's made out to be. Certainly not one of Ford's brightest designs (also looking at you Gold coolant in the 6.0 and Fo/Fi powershift transmissions).

    Any tips on the plugs? Does penetrating oil help? Oil brand rec?
     
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  11. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    Its certainly did help, thank you! Its a fair chance the plugs havent been changed since the miles are so low. But it's on the top of my list for PM along with a switch to Amsoil and the tried and true FL-820S FoMoCo filter.

    As for the updated phasers, it's nice to see that they would still care about older 3v owners. With as long as cars are staying on the road, I'd hope that something as important like replacement phasers would be updated. Coyote VCT technology was a giant leap forward over the 3v phaser tech. If they put those lessons into the 3v replacement phaser, I'm much more at ease now.

    Thanks!!
     
  12. kevinatfms

    kevinatfms Ex-Ford/Kia/Hyundai Tech Premium Member Established Member

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    Ford procedure required a 1/4-1/2 turn to loosen, fill plug well with a cleaner(cannot remember which one it was) and let it soak down into the threads. After around 30 min you were to remove the plugs. It was the prelim TSB before Lisle came out with the plug tip remover tool(epoxy).
     
  13. Recon

    Recon Well-Known Member Established Member

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    Pretty sure the updated plugs started in May of 08.
    Good choice on the color but I might be extremely biased, it’s my favorite color on the phase I s197. Love it on my GT.


    Pick your poison.
     
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  14. 01yellercobra

    01yellercobra AKA slo984now Established Member

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    I would have the wife drive her car to get it fully warmed up. Then like mentioned loosen all of them about 1/4 turn. I then sprayed PB Blaster down the hole and let it sit for a few minutes. After that it was just slow turning and if it felt sticky I would stop and spray more PB Blaster. I saw some posts of guys using impacts after the initial turn and soak and having good luck. But I was never that brave.

    I would let it cool down before putting in the new plugs with a good coating of anti-seize.
     
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  15. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    I was going to make a post down in Pics And Video Buffet this weekend welcoming her to the club.

    To be quite honest, it's still hitting my wife that she has a bucket list car as her daily now. It hit me yesterday when we had the garage open and her GT and my Shelby met for the first time haha.
     
  16. cidsamuth

    cidsamuth Liberty Biberty Established Member

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    The plug issue with the old style heads is a little misunderstood. When you look at the plugs, there is about a 1" section between the electrode/strap and the threads. That section is very close to the heads when installed. It builds grime and seizes to the heads over time. The threads are not really the problem. I assume the TSB wants that 1/2 turn on the plugs before using break-free so that it can penetrate past the threads and get to that section stuck to the head.

    When you reinstall plugs, the TSB calls for nickel (high heat) anti-sieze on that section of the plugs and nothing on the threads. The idea is that it will keep built up grime from sticking to the plug and causing the plug and head to become one.
     
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  17. 03cobra#694

    03cobra#694 I Have LL’s Hammer Staff Member Super Moderator

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    My old 04 5.4 had the two piece plugs. All 8 broke when I changed them at 100K.
     
  18. kevinatfms

    kevinatfms Ex-Ford/Kia/Hyundai Tech Premium Member Established Member

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    Exactly what it is used for. Its been years since ive seen that TSB.

    That little smooth protruded section after the threads gets a TON of carbon build up which seizes into the bore of the head. The 1/2 turn is enough to let the penetrant or carbon cleaner to get in there to loosen it enough. IIRC, it was still a 50/50 shot if that even worked. We broke so many plugs in the beginning that guys started to get crazy with methods to get them out....even saw one guy use a freaking impact on them.
     
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  19. cidsamuth

    cidsamuth Liberty Biberty Established Member

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    There are still some Facebook geniuses recommending impacts on it.
     
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  20. RedVenom48

    RedVenom48 Ghost Editor-in-Chief Premium Member Established Member Beer Money Bros.

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    I was under the impression that porcelain didnt take kindly to blunt force trauma, lmao.
     
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