Coyote vs ls motor's

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Silver2003Cobra

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Does the engine weight, size, hp, tq change because its a corvette?

Thats right...

nope.. but the vehicle it's moving is more aerodynamic and lighter, directly effecting fuel economy.. because the engine isn't having to work as hard to keep the vehicle moving in a Y body as compared to a F body..
 

meaty mac

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The point in all this is that GM and Ford both build great engines. They both have the ability to buld quality OHC and OHV engines. Each company decides which is the best way for them to meet market demand, price, sales targets, CAFE standards, etc. Currently GM thinks its best solution is the OHV V8 and Ford thinks its is the OHC V8. The beauty is that each company has he ability to change this perspective as time passes and things evolve. Thats what keeps us car guys reading, tinkering, racing, arguing, and generally enjoying life:beer:

Yeah, competition improves the breed, no doubt. :beer:
 

mebetter

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I'm not familiar with the Ford/Holman Moody 427 but I have always been pretty pleased with GM's Northstar engine.

The Northstar was making ~300hp NA from 4.6L in 1993. I have also read that the Northstar block is supposed to be capable of 5.4L.

The supercharged 4.4L Northstar also made nice power in the STS-V and XLR-V at 469hp and 443hp respectively. That was some pretty darn good power back in 2006 considering Ford debuted the GT500 in 2007 with 500hp from their 5.4L.

The point in all this is that GM and Ford both build great engines. They both have the ability to buld quality OHC and OHV engines. Each company decides which is the best way for them to meet market demand, price, sales targets, CAFE standards, etc. Currently GM thinks its best solution is the OHV V8 and Ford thinks its is the OHC V8. The beauty is that each company has he ability to change this perspective as time passes and things evolve. Thats what keeps us car guys reading, tinkering, racing, arguing, and generally enjoying life:beer:

Very well said. I think this is something we can all agree on. :thumbsup:
 

lilbuddy1587

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This thread started out as the Coyote motor vs the "ls motor's" did it not?

Lets make it simple, regardless of size and any other excuse you can think of;

LS7 > Coyote 5.0
 

RydeOn

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Who gives a crap, stock?

I am really into the high RPM range the 5.0 will probably like to play in when it is tweaked out!

8000 rpm + forged 5.0 + whipple = :rockon:

Love the direction Ford is going. Bragging about cubic inches never was my thing.
 

9secondko

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with all this talk about whose motors are best and which is better stock, which responds to mods better, etc. the coyote isn't even out yet. and the current modulars have shown they can be beasts.

I thought it was interesting to see that Hennessey, one of the most respected aftermarket modders and tuners for the LS engine, took a Camaro and threw its engine away as it was useless to do what they needed to. Decided to use the blown 6.2L ZR1 engine and mod it out to make 724 HP in their most powerful configuration.

The current Shelby on the other hand, has a Super Snake edition which pounds the ground with 725 ponies. and it's only a 5.4L. So 1 MORE HP from .8L Less displacement. Pretty good stuff. and you get the Ford factory warranty to boot.

The Hennessey:
724 HP Hennessey HPE700 Camaro Screams Around Texas Track - hpe700 - Jalopnik

The King of the Road:
Shelby Announces 725hp "Super Snake" Package for 2010 Mustang GT500 - Wide Open Throttle - Motor Trend Magazine

Something tells me the 5.0 and its offspring are going to throw some serious surprises into the mix.
 

meaty mac

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with all this talk about whose motors are best and which is better stock, which responds to mods better, etc. the coyote isn't even out yet. and the current modulars have shown they can be beasts.

I thought it was interesting to see that Hennessey, one of the most respected aftermarket modders and tuners for the LS engine, took a Camaro and threw its engine away as it was useless to do what they needed to. Decided to use the blown 6.2L ZR1 engine and mod it out to make 724 HP in their most powerful configuration.

The current Shelby on the other hand, has a Super Snake edition which pounds the ground with 725 ponies. and it's only a 5.4L. So 1 MORE HP from .8L Less displacement. Pretty good stuff. and you get the Ford factory warranty to boot.

The Hennessey:
724 HP Hennessey HPE700 Camaro Screams Around Texas Track - hpe700 - Jalopnik

The King of the Road:
Shelby Announces 725hp "Super Snake" Package for 2010 Mustang GT500 - Wide Open Throttle - Motor Trend Magazine

Something tells me the 5.0 and its offspring are going to throw some serious surprises into the mix.

There a two versions of the Super Snake. The 605 (TVS) has a warranty

The 725 (KB) version does not
 

mustangmanjeff

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yeah Like i said all along the coyote is a base v8 gt they say that doesnt matter I think it does, esp when its 300hp in the basev6 400hp in the base gt the cobra is gonna be 540hp+ and dont forget they also might have a boss version or bullit or mach 1 version mid range of the 5.0 coyote which might be 450hp+ and we havent seen the 2011+ roush and saleens :) so its a good year for ford


and if you read the magazine article they admitted they did build this motor with " forced induction in mind" they said we will see either a supercharged version of this engine and or a twin turbo ecoboost version, which is where the new shelby gt 350 comes in its a supercharged coyote motor, and you kno saleen and roush will supercharge the motor, and you might get that road runner 5.0 liter twin turbo in the next gen cobras ;) and prob a super snake version of 2011, so you can have ur pick @ horsepower and trim models from anywhere from base 300hp up to 500-700hp top of the line :)
 
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Formula51

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with all this talk about whose motors are best and which is better stock, which responds to mods better, etc. the coyote isn't even out yet. and the current modulars have shown they can be beasts.

I thought it was interesting to see that Hennessey, one of the most respected aftermarket modders and tuners for the LS engine, took a Camaro and threw its engine away as it was useless to do what they needed to. Decided to use the blown 6.2L ZR1 engine and mod it out to make 724 HP in their most powerful configuration.

The current Shelby on the other hand, has a Super Snake edition which pounds the ground with 725 ponies. and it's only a 5.4L. So 1 MORE HP from .8L Less displacement. Pretty good stuff. and you get the Ford factory warranty to boot.

The Hennessey:
724 HP Hennessey HPE700 Camaro Screams Around Texas Track - hpe700 - Jalopnik

The King of the Road:
Shelby Announces 725hp "Super Snake" Package for 2010 Mustang GT500 - Wide Open Throttle - Motor Trend Magazine

Something tells me the 5.0 and its offspring are going to throw some serious surprises into the mix.

ROTFL! Haha, oh my god, make is stop seriously, my side hurts.

Did you really just say Hennessey is one of the most.....I cant even type the words.....of the LS engine! Really! That man has ZERO credibility and respect from anyone, especially LS engine guys. ZERO. Plus he's not even know for tunning LS engines. hahahahaha. Thank you for that laugh.

Now, to get to your point there, even Hennessey (zero respect and all) was able to build an aftermarket Camaro using a supercharged LS3 which dominated the Super Snake in the latest comparison that Car and Driver did, in handling and straightline. It made more torque across the rpm range, considerably more down low, and did a better job of putting the power to the ground.

Don't know what else to tell you. Lots of aftermarket tuners, even SLP, are offering very similar cars. Pretty much a supercharged LS3 Camaro with suspension improvments and wheels/tires. Straight forward and effective.
 
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mustangmanjeff

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The numbers are in this months issue of car and driver


base v6 car
3.7 v6
3500lbs
305hp
0-60 5.0 sec
1/4 13.6

GT
5.0 v8
412hp
3500-3700lbs
0-60 4.5 sec
1/4 12.8


woohoo!a base model v8 gt going 4.5 sec 0-60 and running 12's stock is deff a good day :)


and they mentioned its 300+lbs lighter then the camaro and said about a supercharged version coming up and to wait and see in 2012 they will be doing even more improvments :)
 
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9secondko

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The numbers are in this months issue of car and driver


base v6 car
3.7 v6
3500lbs
305hp
0-60 5.0 sec
1/4 13.6

GT
5.0 v8
412hp
3500-3700lbs
0-60 4.5 sec
1/4 12.8


woohoo!a base model v8 gt going 4.5 sec 0-60 and running 12's stock is deff a good day :)


and they mentioned its 300+lbs lighter then the camaro and said about a supercharged version coming up and to wait and see in 2012 they will be doing even more improvments :)


Dang! those are stock Terminator numbers. Wow. and much faster than the Camaro already. LS guys are going to be pulling their hair out.
Camaro at 13.3 1/4 mile. Mustang 1t 12.8. Wow - especially since the mustang is faster than the Camaro in 06-60 by only .1 second.

N/A the Mustang humbles the Camaro. S/C the Mustang will humble the Camaro. It seems that the Mustang is in it to win it with a world class powerplant. Curious to see a production Mustang GT throw down on a dyno. It has to be making serious poewr
 
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mebetter

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The numbers are in this months issue of car and driver


base v6 car
3.7 v6
3500lbs
305hp
0-60 5.0 sec
1/4 13.6

GT
5.0 v8
412hp
3500-3700lbs
0-60 4.5 sec
1/4 12.8


woohoo!a base model v8 gt going 4.5 sec 0-60 and running 12's stock is deff a good day :)


and they mentioned its 300+lbs lighter then the camaro and said about a supercharged version coming up and to wait and see in 2012 they will be doing even more improvments :)

Those are good numbers. I think Caranddriver.com has the camaro rated @ 13.0 @ 111. So being 300 lbs lighter, smaller wheels, and more gear I can see the mustang being 2 tenths quicker.
 

S8ER01Z

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The numbers are in this months issue of car and driver


base v6 car
3.7 v6
3500lbs
305hp
0-60 5.0 sec
1/4 13.6

GT
5.0 v8
412hp
3500-3700lbs
0-60 4.5 sec
1/4 12.8


woohoo!a base model v8 gt going 4.5 sec 0-60 and running 12's stock is deff a good day :)


and they mentioned its 300+lbs lighter then the camaro and said about a supercharged version coming up and to wait and see in 2012 they will be doing even more improvments :)

Unless I just have trouble reading... I believe those are currently estimates from C/D.... I don't think they are off by much if they are but I say we wait and see what they do when rubber meets the road because stirring up the Camaro guys. :beer:
 
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ChiSVT

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Those are good numbers. I think Caranddriver.com has the camaro rated @ 13.0 @ 111. So being 300 lbs lighter, smaller wheels, and more gear I can see the mustang being 2 tenths quicker.

It was motor trend that claimed a 13.0@111mph, but they used a GPS. Every other mag has it running 13.3-13.5s at a real track.

Unless I just have trouble reading... I believe those are currently estimates from C/D.... I don't think they are off by much if they are but I say we wait and see what they do when rubber meets the road because stirring up the Camaro guys. :beer:

I agree, lets wait and see the actual numbers. :beer:
 

mustangmanjeff

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yeah its just a guess in march issue this( months new issue) car& driver

I agree I think 13.6 is a fast guess for the v6 and the 12.8 is a lil slower / average times, I can see the v6 doing 13.6-14.0 and the gt v8 matching 03 cobra times 12.4-12.8 slower or faster depending driver and tire/traction
 
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GTSpartan

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It was motor trend that claimed a 13.0@111mph, but they used a GPS. Every other mag has it running 13.3-13.5s at a real track.


Car & Driver 2010 SS = 13.0 @ 111, 2010 GT = 13.5 @ 105

http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/original/application/114d79cf1e48eb897dd0ee650bbb926b.pdf

Edmunds 2010 SS = 13.0 @ 110.9 on a public road

http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/camaro/2010/2010-chevrolet-camaro-ss-full-test-and-video.html

I would say it's a solid bottom 13 sec car, with some getting in the 12's.
 
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whipplecharged0

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ive personally seen the 2010 camaro ss run at the track. several of them. the best time i have seen the average driver get is 14.4 and KEY WORDS in my post is THE AVERAGE DRIVER..
 
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ChiSVT

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Car & Driver 2010 SS = 13.0 @ 111, 2010 GT = 13.5 @ 105

http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/original/application/114d79cf1e48eb897dd0ee650bbb926b.pdf

Edmunds 2010 SS = 13.0 @ 110.9 on a public road

2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS Full Test and Video on Inside Line

I would say it's a solid bottom 13 sec car, with some getting in the 12's.

Those are all GPS recorded times and I believe C&D used MTs test result which was from a GPS.

I'd like to wait and see, but I agree it's a bottom 13 second car with a great driver in good conditions. The mags usually underrate a car, but the ETs they listed for the Camaro are above average, (unless you're in like -2000DA conditions), and the trap speed is faster than I've ever seen at an actual track.

Stock for stock I think with a 300lb advantage it will be noticeably quicker on AVERAGE. It's kind of hard to compare them since the car isn't even out though.

1. Pave1 - 12.86 @ 107.70 mph, (L99, A6)
2. speedy6963 - 12.87 @ 109.08, (LS3,M6)
3. NineBall - 13.07 @ 109.07 mph, (LS3, M6)
4. Matt (tunetime) - 13.25 @ 106. 42 mph, (L99, A6)
5. Foglin - 13.28 @ 106.8 mph, (LS3, M6)
6. Scottywheels - 13.28 @ 106.43 mph, (L99, A6)
7. Amwellls1 - 13.31 @ 107.0 mph, (LS3, M6)
8. HDDAN - 13.38 @ 105.65 mph, (L99, A6)
9. PwrTrip - 13.41 @ 105.01 mph, (L99, A6)
10. Will69Camaro - 13.42 @ 108.41 mph, (LS3, M6) - DA 2171 ft.
11. 8ty8ls1 - 13.47 @ 105.90 mph (L99, A6) - DA 555 ft.
12. SS/RS - 13.54 @ 107.44 mph (LS3, M6) - DA 1187 ft.
13. BLT4SPD - 13.58 @ 96.34 mph, (L99,A6)
14. PatrickfromMD - 13.59 @ 104.55 mph, (L99,A6)
15. Cmurf_SS - 13.60 @106 mph, (LS3,M6)
16. KoolWhip - 13.71 @ 106.03 mph, (LS3,M6)
17. I Am Legend - 13.82 @ 106.91 mph, (LS3,M6)
18. Toehead93 - 13.86 @ 102.66 mph, (L99,A6)
19. Pharmd - 13.90 @ 102.3 mph, ( L99, A6)
20. AntiVnm - 13.93 @ 103.38 mph, (L99 A6), - DA 2498 ft.

I think there are more 12 second ones now this list is about a month old. However, look at the traps, none of them trapped 111mph and these are good drivers.
 
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mrlrd1

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Kind of like Chevy realized that they were at their limits with the LS7 so dropping down in displacement and boost the LS3 was the solution. Throwing a blower at that problem seemed to work pretty well for the ZR1 just like having a blower on the 4.6 worked very well for the 03-04 Cobra.

GM put the blower on the Vette to compete with the worlds elite supercars. Ford needed a blower to run with a $25K Camaro. Yeah, I see the parallel there :lol1: :kaboom:

The LS7 is not anywhere near it's limits, even as a warrantied stock engine. Not like it's measly 505HP had any competition from the Ford camp anyway.
 
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