That actual part had a run of failures last year. All leaked at the seam. I had a stack of 6 or 7 that leaked out of the box for one wholesale customer. I usually recommend Mishimoto to customers that want one better than stock.
"Genuine Ford" part= trash. A rant
- Thread starter RedVenom48
- Start date
Same issue with my wife's '14 Focus. I'm on tank number 3. The first two cracked at the same place both times, front left corner area. The first two were OEM, this last one I think I got it from rock auto so we'll see.
Very nice quality
OP, sounds like you can't deal with vehicle repairs. You just just buy new...if you can find one lol.
God forbid there was a bad batch of parts. And lets be realistic, it's not "Ford" that made the tank...
Aftermarket aluminum tank it is!
God forbid there was a bad batch of parts. And lets be realistic, it's not "Ford" that made the tank...
Aftermarket aluminum tank it is!
If you think getting a Suburban will end your misery......think again.
I've had nothing but issues with them and I've been buying them for 25 years.
Still love 'em though. Wouldn't call them reliable by any sense of the word.
I've had nothing but issues with them and I've been buying them for 25 years.
Still love 'em though. Wouldn't call them reliable by any sense of the word.
if new vehicles didnt fail just as much as used ones.. warranties wouldn’t exist …
Man we would get our ass beat if we didn't design for those kind of conditions plus margin. Not to say it doesn't happen at certain OEMs, but rule of thumb is it's usually designed for above and beyond what it will see. Plus the surge tank is on the cold side of the radiator, and ECT is measured at engine out. Radiator out is usually 10-15F cooler than reported ECT.
It has to be pressurized as that's critical to its function. That volume of air in there acts as a spring and keeps a more constant pressure on the water pump inlet, preventing cavitation.
It's a pretty common thing in the industry- victims of a "cost reduction" project. Either someone is looking to get noticed by management or they even get solicited directly by a Chinese supplier that says they can make it at a fraction of the cost. Everything goes well for the couple prototype units they furnish. Patting each other's backs over the cost savings. And then a year or so later they wonder why there's dozens upon dozens of failures in the field.
That's one of the reasons I seldom buy OEM. If you buy from their tier I supplier, it's usually a little better- less likely to be cost reduced and without the insane markup that happens internally to pad every divisions margins. And of course, you can usually go with something more robust than the OEM design for the same price. OEMs aren't infallible.
Warranties exists because of government mandates.
Used vehicles depending on milage and age fail at a much higher rate than a new vehicle. Parts naturally deteriorate with age and mileage.
Its hard to say exactly if it was a complete part failure or if there are underlying issues. Essentially we have no data other than the OP rant of being upset. Hopefully it really if just a bad batch of tanks. But id still be interested in actual engine temps along with coolant temps.
Our old 14 Focus did the same. Now it is my daughter's problem
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Sent from my SM-G988U using the svtperformance.com mobile app
Lol, I have a legit complaint about 2 OEM "factory" Degas tanks having the exact same failure in the same spot within 2 months. A failure that could cause head gaskets to go poof.... Add to it other members here having similar and worse issues with the same part.. That apparently means my 15 years of repairing vehicles professionally have been voided and I need to stop driving used vehicles because repairing them myself is too much for me to handle. .... Got it.
Also, to your part about FoMoCo not directly producing this or the vast majority of parts on their cars brings this to mind: No Shit. But luckily for Ford, it came in their box, from their dealer with their "warranty" so FoMoCo produced or not, its their issue.
I dont have an IDS tool, and Im not going to chart digital readouts from Forscan. But consider I had zero issues with overheating the last 3 years Ive owned this truck in this climate and blast furnace for summer temps. This issue free experience was with a failing tank. My troubles began after I replaced as preventative maintenance a legit failed degas tank with a faulty Ford Genuine degas tank. Replaced it with another, began to overheat and had the same failure.
If there is further mechanical failure after this (ie head gaskets are blown) Im going to use my professional experience and knowledge to form an opinion that the bad, out-of-the-box Ford Genuine tanks contributed to the failure. Not the other way around.
Wow... I cant imagine that customer being particularly happy. Literally my failure on these two tanks. Napa has some degas tanks, probably made by the the same Motorad dipshits...
That Mishimoto is nice. Too much to ask for the factory replacement to function right? lol
Im going to try NAPA I think. Trying to get a parts warranty on an over the counter part from Ford is proving to be total pain in the ****ing ass. If the NAPA part fails, its like Amazon. Bring it in for the next one as long as you have the receipt.
I think the design is ok, even the manufacturing process of the original, factory installed tanks was clearly ok. What probably happened is what youre alluding to: Ford found a way to cut corners in the manufacturing side of the part. Probably took their molds to a different company from the original supplier and said make it cheaper.
Either the tank halves are chemically bonded together and some step of that process isnt thorough enough. Or the halves are essentially melted together and the machine thats responsible is missing that corner or its not getting hot enough.
Whatever the case, a literal stack of these prematurely failed tanks should have gotten someone at Ford warranty to raise an eyebrow. There is clearly ZERO quality control after the part is made before its thrown in the box. Maybe Ford's agreement is 100% payout of the claim by the manufacturer, in exchange for sole sourcing by Ford and others for this and possibly other replacement parts.
I look forward to see if the Napa part fixes your issue.
Off hand if your factory tank was still good why didn't you just put it back in?
It had a hairline crack developing on top of the tank, and there was juuuust enough escaping coolant vapor starting to leave crusty residue the length of it. As far as pressure loss, it was probably 1/16th of the leak rate of these new tanks when I caught it.
My fear was I'd have a tank rupture and have rapid pressure loss while towing. I may splurge on the Mishimoto... we'll see if the units from NAPA fair better.
Make sense. Hopefully the Napa unit fixes the issue. If not and you still believe a quality issue it might be time to upgrade to the well built tanks.
A couple of the many points to consider:
1) You do not inspect "quality" into a component/assembly. It must be built into it. It must be robust. How robust? See #2.
2) Almost all business decisions are based on $, like it or not.
3) Even if these parts successfully completed a level 5 PPAP, would this defect have been found/identified?
4) Would the defect be identified under the current manufacturing and inspection processes, even if it's being made?
5) Is the defect created during manufacturing, or during handling after inspection and lot acceptance is completed?
6) It appears this part has a history of field failures and was never recalled. Were the failures even communicated to Ford? Did Ford drop the ball or the tier 1, tier 2, or even tier 3 supplier?
7) Was the defect caused by the design, process, material, or combination of the three?
1) You do not inspect "quality" into a component/assembly. It must be built into it. It must be robust. How robust? See #2.
2) Almost all business decisions are based on $, like it or not.
3) Even if these parts successfully completed a level 5 PPAP, would this defect have been found/identified?
4) Would the defect be identified under the current manufacturing and inspection processes, even if it's being made?
5) Is the defect created during manufacturing, or during handling after inspection and lot acceptance is completed?
6) It appears this part has a history of field failures and was never recalled. Were the failures even communicated to Ford? Did Ford drop the ball or the tier 1, tier 2, or even tier 3 supplier?
7) Was the defect caused by the design, process, material, or combination of the three?
All excellent points. My expectation as a consumer is that there is a quality check done. Real world l, I'd expect every batch produced to have 1 randomly chosen for a pressure check to verify the part was produced correctly to specification, and verify that the manufacturing process doesn't need to be amended.
It's clear that money is an over riding factor as this rate of failure could not have been present when these vehicles were being produced new. So, the question now is when did Ford switch suppliers, or instruct it's long time supplier to cheapen it up.
Unfortunately, Fords track record for doubling down on stupid doesn't give them any slack here. See The Focus/Fiesta Powershift DCT as a glaring example.
No manufacturer is immune. I know this. But any cooling system component that's pressurized should be considered a critical part, worthy of proper manufacture.
The issue with new vehicles is electronics. At least older vehicles can be fixed mainly by a wrench and cursing.
New vehicles? Electronics and computer's everywhere. Have issues with your screen and transmission shifts? We'll send an update that might fix it lol. If only I didn't enjoy fancy new gadgets and newer comfortable rides, I would've sticked to older cars. Unfortunately, im a sucker for new stuff FML
If that degas bottle is the same as the 7.3's, then yeah it's a known problem. I've replaced mine twice, both times for aesthetics over the past couple hundred thousand miles on my 99 PSD. Both times I had no leaks, but word on the street is that there is a HIGH infant mortality rate.
As far as overheating, if you haven't replaced the radiator, you probably should at this point. Make sure your fan clutch is functioning properly first. I replaced my radiator at 275k miles and it made a huge difference. It's back to 100% functionality.
As far as overheating, if you haven't replaced the radiator, you probably should at this point. Make sure your fan clutch is functioning properly first. I replaced my radiator at 275k miles and it made a huge difference. It's back to 100% functionality.
So as the consumer, you had 1 of the 3 customer satisfactions missed, it was defective (quality). The part was available (on time), and it was within your price range you were willing to spend for it (cost).
So, at the minimum, it appears that this is a known issue and Ford has not performed their due diligence and recalled the parts.
Could Ford recall the parts and test for that defect?
Is it one of the key characteristics inspected at the mfr?
Did Ford even give the mfr a list of key characteristics to inspect?
Are the current parts manufactured with this same defect?
Are their multiple suppliers/molds? Some good, some defective?
Are these manufactured in chyna?
If so, how's the communication with them?
I feel you pain.
I'm long-winded, I know, I'll stop - lol. Good luck finding a quality replacement.
Plans are now to replace radiator, water pump, fan clutch and do another complete flush, and tank. If the radiator is clogged, then hopefully it's got most of the debris in it.
Going NAPA for these parts unless anyone has had major quality issues with them?
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