Termy has bad Cylinder #6 - Options?

SuperG

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Brought the '03 to a shop where a buddy of mine just started working (THE only mechanic I actually trust) and they performed a compression test showing Cylinder #6 having next to no compression...They are recommending starting with removing the heads and having them checked...a rebuild quoted at $3100-$3800. Shop to do the work will be Scroggin's Machine Shop here in Houston...

If those are not the problem, then we're looking at an engine build...they quoted being as high as $7700.

Is it possible for a cylinder to just fail without warning?

Any comments or suggestions from you guys would be greatly appreciated!
 
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SuperG

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It sounds like it's running on 6 cylinders...I tried the plugs, messed with coils, replaced the FRPS (Code 0193), messed with the injectors...so I gave up and sent it to someone with way more knowhow than myself...
 

vr4_007

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I cant find a diagram that list the numbers for the cylinders?
How can you tell what a cylnders firing order is.
 

69gt4speed

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Sell what is good, and put that toward an Aluminator!!! I am considering selling my perfectly good long block and doing the same instead of spray.

I'd go with that if no compression and confirmed damage. See if ya can get a bore scope and look in cylinder and top of piston. Mo than likely it isn't the heads. Leak down tester is another good test also. That will show if bad valves, cracked piston, rings, etc. Most times when I had bad sudden engine failure it boiled down to bad gas, too much timing, too lean. Broke a piston, burnt a hole in piston due to detonation.
 

forcefedcobra

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Sell what is good, and put that toward an Aluminator!!! I am considering selling my perfectly good long block and doing the same instead of spray.

I thought about that too but ford racing says its good for 700 hp and since I was already putting almost 600 on the ground with full fuel setup and more boost waiting in the garage that rating from ford will be pressed. I'm looking at a built stroker thats good for almost 1k hp instead.
 

wjurls

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Brought the '03 to a shop where a buddy of mine just started working (THE only mechanic I actually trust) and they performed a compression test showing Cylinder #6 having next to no compression...They are recommending starting with removing the heads and having them checked...a rebuild quoted at $3100-$3800. Shop to do the work will be Scroggin's Machine Shop here in Houston...

If those are not the problem, then we're looking at an engine build...they quoted being as high as $7700.

Is it possible for a cylinder to just fail without warning?

Any comments or suggestions from you guys would be greatly appreciated!

The shop should have done a proper leak down test right after the compression test in order to more closely pinpoint where your problem is coming from. Any reputable shop would do a leak down. They can indeed tell you if it's top or bottom end as a result. I would get a second opinion elsewhere. BTW #6 is the second cylinder in (counting from the front of the car) on the drivers side and the drivers head is notorious for valve problems. I had problems on 5, 7, and 8 on my 03' and I did a leakdown test myself and confirmed that I needed a new head before I tore into it.
 

piss&vinegar

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The shop should have done a proper leak down test right after the compression test in order to more closely pinpoint where your problem is coming from. Any reputable shop would do a leak down. They can indeed tell you if it's top or bottom end as a result. I would get a second opinion elsewhere. BTW #6 is the second cylinder in (counting from the front of the car) on the drivers side and the drivers head is notorious for valve problems. I had problems on 5, 7, and 8 on my 03' and I did a leakdown test myself and confirmed that I needed a new head before I tore into it.

+1, I would have figured they would have performed a cylinder leakage test first! Kill two birds with one stone.:rockon:
 

SuperG

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Thanks guys...that's exactly what they will be doing next.

Let's say if the leakdown holds...does that mean it's a cylinder or piston problem vs. head problem? Is that something a bore-scope will help to determine?
 

wjurls

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Even a healthy cylinder won't hold completely. A low compression cylinder will show a leakage of greater than 20%. How it works (the short version) is you thread the tester into the spark plug hole and set the cylinder to TDC of the compression stroke. Then you connect a compressed air source to the leakdown tester and that will show a leakage percentage on the the gauge. More than 20% on a cold engine is cause for alarm. Even less is a concern on a warm engine. While the cylinder is charged with air you can then listen for the leakage through the intake, the exhaust pipe, or the crancase to determine where it is originating from. Mine was bad valves and I actually heard the leakage into adjacent cylinders and not through the tailpipe or intake oddly enough.
 

forcefedcobra

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I'd just rather have a new Aluminator. Once you take an engine down, especially one that has been damaged it seems as if they are never the same.

guess you really have a thing for the new aluminator? Maybe my reply to your first post stating your love for the aluminator might make you think a little differently. I would only love it if I dont plan on doing much more than some extra boost on a heaton or low boost on a twin screw.
 

Tractionless1

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Yes the "new" aluminator. I just think it is the best bang for the buck especialy with 700hp and a warranty. If you are going to spend $3500 to rebuild you might as well throw that coin at something new and with a warranty. Add the part out $$$ from the old motor and you are damn near there!!

Forcefed,
I agree if you are after 1k you probably don't want the Aluminator and should rebuild what you have. I don't think that is what the thread author is after.
 
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SuperG

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Well, certainly my questions have gotten people thinking about their own possible situations...I am looking into what it costs to have the Terminator engine rebuilt, or the heads if that's the case. Then again...at 80k miles, perhaps it is time to have everything refreshed? On the other hand, how long is one of these engines good for (when tuned properly - as I doubt mine was)?
 

forcefedcobra

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Yes the "new" aluminator. I just think it is the best bang for the buck especialy with 700hp and a warranty. If you are going to spend $3500 to rebuild you might as well throw that coin at something new and with a warranty. Add the part out $$$ from the old motor and you are damn near there!!

Forcefed,
I agree if you are after 1k you probably don't want the Aluminator and should rebuild what you have. I don't think that is what the thread author is after.

I'm not shooting for 1k. I was just trying to state that if you plan on running a twin screw with 15-17 psi or even a ported eaton with a little spray the "aluminator" isnt rated to hold that. You'd be better off and cheaper getting a built aluminum block from mmr, vt, al papito, SHM, or other modular engine builders.

I was dead set on the aluminator for about a day. After that I had done some reading and woke up to realize it just wasnt worth it.
 

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