Down on power, no CEL

[SD_GT]

09 GT500 - JLT 123, Kooks long tubes, catless x-pipe, 2.3 TVS with 2.4 pulley, dual BAP, 56lb injectors, VMP 3x H/E, 91/93oct tune, Manley rods and pistons, 5k miles on rebuilt motor. 570whp on a mustang dyno. VMP twin 67mm being installed soon.

It doesn’t have that initial hit anymore and feels like it’s down quite a bit of power across the board. For reference, I got absolutely dogged by an HCI C6Z and ran neck and neck with a stock C7Z.

Any tips on what to check or replace? I’m not throwing any codes. I’m actively looking to replace my clutch although it doesn’t seem to be slipping. Fuel filter’s been replaced, spark plugs have 5k on them.

I was going to run a 60-130 and or 1/4 mile via dragy but I don’t have a reference for what kind of numbers the car should be running.

TIA.

 

[SCGallo2]

The intercooler pump is a usual suspect when down on power with no other symptoms. If you can datalog IAT2 or downstream air temps, it will be obvious. Anything over 130*F on pump gas should be pulling timing under WOT to save your engine. Burping the intercooler/heat exchanger coolant circuit can resolve the issue if you have air in the lines.

To check for clutch slip, shift to 4th gear and accelerate to 3,000 RPM then floor it. If your clutch is slipping, RPMs will quickly rise without corresponding speed, and you might even get a whiff of burnt clutch if it is really bad.

 

[SD_GT]

Cl

The intercooler pump is a usual suspect when down on power with no other symptoms. If you can datalog IAT2 or downstream air temps, it will be obvious. Anything over 130*F on pump gas should be pulling timing under WOT to save your engine. Burping the intercooler/heat exchanger coolant circuit can resolve the issue if you have air in the lines.

To check for clutch slip, shift to 4th gear and accelerate to 3,000 RPM then floor it. If your clutch is slipping, RPMs will quickly rise without corresponding speed, and you might even get a whiff of burnt clutch if it is really bad.

The Clutch doesn’t seem to be slipping and the IC pump seems to be working as soon as the car is turned on. I took some videos this morning for reference sake. What do you think? I’m at a loss right now

 

[SCGallo2]

Stock intercooler pumps can and do fail intermittently, mine did and IAT2 temps would soar to 150-180*F while cruising, as monitored on my AeroForce Interceptor. I knew not to go WOT.

Looks like you have really good coolant flow... I am guessing you have an aftermarket intercooler pump? Aeration in the reservoir at operating temp might be an issue. Datalogging pedal position, throttle position, spark, rpm, and IAT2 or downstream air temp at a minimum would be helpful.

Any recent work performed on your car, or was everything fine for a while and now it feels down on power?

 

[SD_GT]

Stock intercooler pumps can and do fail intermittently, mine did and IAT2 temps would soar to 150-180*F while cruising, as monitored on my AeroForce Interceptor. I knew not to go WOT.

Looks like you have really good coolant flow... I am guessing you have an aftermarket intercooler pump? Aeration in the reservoir at operating temp might be an issue. Datalogging pedal position, throttle position, spark, rpm, and IAT2 or downstream air temp at a minimum would be helpful.

Any recent work performed on your car, or was everything fine for a while and now it feels down on power?

Yes, it’s a Bosch unit that was installed during the rebuild last summer/fall. I actually just paid for a datalog review from @VNMOUS1 and I’m hoping he can see something that I’m not catching. He seems to be the guru for these cars based on the FB groups so I’ve got my fingers crossed. I plan to switch all tuning over to them as well if he can get this sorted!

I do have prior logs but I’m not sure what numbers you’d like to see specifically. I’d be happy to post a screenshot.

Car felt fine up until a month or two ago and now it feels dead. For reference, I would put a couple car lengths on stock C7Z’s and now I’m losing to the same cars from before by half a car.

I’ve got a good amount of cash tied up in this thing already so I’m hoping it’s nothing major. I can’t see the engine builder being willing to help too much since it’s been a couple thousand miles since the build.

How does the IC pump and clutch slip look in the videos I posted?

 

[SCGallo2]

Cool... BJ will get your issue figured out.

Here are the PIDs and DMRs I normally datalog for general health monitoring (I have wideband O2 and MAP sensors):

Your IC system flow looks great, and I don't detect any clutch slip during that short pull; the engine sounds fully loaded... though in the future you may want to stay on the gas to at least 5000 rpm if safe to do so.

 

[LS WUT]

IC pump went out for me, it did the same shit

 

[SD_GT]

IC pump went out for me, it did the same shit

That's what I keep reading but every time I pull the cap off my reservoir I see fluid moving around as it should. BUT, I did see IAT2's up to 160+ today so I guess it's a possibility that the new IC pump went out with less than 5k miles on it. Either way, I have a feeling those high IAT2 numbers are contributing to the slow feeling the car's giving me lately.

 

[LS WUT]

That's what I keep reading but every time I pull the cap off my reservoir I see fluid moving around as it should. BUT, I did see IAT2's up to 160+ today so I guess it's a possibility that the new IC pump went out with less than 5k miles on it. Either way, I have a feeling those high IAT2 numbers are contributing to the slow feeling the car's giving me lately.

Check the wiring. My plug burnt out.

 

[SHIFTYBUSINESS]

Check the wiring. My plug burnt out.

I know someone else who had the same issue, burnt plug. This was on a 13/14 can remember which year exactly.

 

[LS WUT]

I know someone else who had the same issue, burnt plug. This was on a 13/14 can remember which year exactly.

Yes sir mine is a 2013. I’ve gone thru 3 pumps and 2 harnesses. I’m gonna do a switch for a hardwire next time.

 

[2003RedfireVert]

Yes sir mine is a 2013. I’ve gone thru 3 pumps and 2 harnesses. I’m gonna do a switch for a hardwire next time.

Do you know if the pump crapping out makes the harness burn up…or of the pump needs bigger wires to handle the load of the pump? Combination of both? Interesting that it has happened twice now on your car….

 

[SHIFTYBUSINESS]

Yes sir mine is a 2013. I’ve gone thru 3 pumps and 2 harnesses. I’m gonna do a switch for a hardwire next time.

They just did the harness as well.

 

[SHIFTYBUSINESS]

Do you know if the pump crapping out makes the harness burn up…or of the pump needs bigger wires to handle the load of the pump? Combination of both? Interesting that it has happened twice now on your car….

Pretty sure the problem is the gauge of the wire.

 

[LS WUT]

Do you know if the pump crapping out makes the harness burn up…or of the pump needs bigger wires to handle the load of the pump? Combination of both? Interesting that it has happened twice now on your car….

So it’s similar to the alternator on the 03/04 cobras. It’s all driven by heat. The harness is right next to the heads, so it heats up really quick. Especially in places such as Arizona, Florida, Etc. Common issue that Ford didn’t address. I’ve even went as far as to heat wrap the harness to try and protect it the best I could.

 

[LS WUT]

Hard to explain, but the pump is down towards the driver side head and the harness follows it, and the burnt out plug is on the CAI for IAT. Pain in the butt honestly.

 

[SD_GT]

Yes sir mine is a 2013. I’ve gone thru 3 pumps and 2 harnesses. I’m gonna do a switch for a hardwire next time.

I had the car out for about 30min a couple minutes ago and pulled the lid off the IC reservoir and it still seemed to be functioning. I’m wondering if my H/E isn’t working properly.

Had a new M4 wanting to play on the interstate and had to brush him off because I’m worried I might be out a motor if I get on it too much right now.

 

[SD_GT]

Updating this to keep track for myself and anyone in the future who might have the same problems. Drove the car around for an hour tonight. Temp was 80 degrees and IAT2's at cruise were between 110-115 degrees. Did one 2nd gear pull and saw them go up into the mid 130's, let it cool off and did a 3-4 pull and saw them go to 169 degrees. Temps eventually came back down in the 1-teens and stayed there.

Heat exchanger is working for sure. IC pump has been working every time I've pulled over and opened the reservoir lid to check for flow. IC pump relay is working as well.

Still stumped.

 

[01yellercobra]

Judging by the jump in IAT2 temps I'd say your pump is going out or as mentioned the wiring is bad. It's probably affected by the heat and by the time you stop to check it everything is cooled off enough to work.

 

[SD_GT]

Judging by the jump in IAT2 temps I'd say your pump is going out or as mentioned the wiring is bad. It's probably affected by the heat and by the time you stop to check it everything is cooled off enough to work.

It actually ended up being air in the system interrupting the coolant flow through the IC brick at WOT. Huge shoutout to @SCGallo2 for all of his help. He went out of his way to help me fix this. Solid guy.