Bilstein or Koni

[Fast99Snake]

i did a search on this and I didnt find much even though i think its been discussed before

so does anyone on here run koni's, i know a lot of guys run the bilsteins and have good luck with them but I kind of like the idea of adjustability, and I've read some not so good things about tokico so I don't think I'll be buying a set of those
What kind of coilover rates do people run with koni yellow DAs and SAs,
is there really that big of a difference between the doubles and singles, as I won't be tuning the suspension dynamics to any outrageous degree for awhile and the double adjustability seems like overdoing it for me.
otherwise i was considering bilstein oe cobra r or possibly going the a set of race valved bilsteins. I will be doing coilovers and many other suspensions mods this winter and thought i should start looking around now and maybe pick up a set of lightly used shocks/struts.

thanks

btw this is a hard driven street car that will see the track probly 3-4 times a year, but that may grow to a larger number as my car turns into more of a track car as I can afford it (only 17 rite now) :-D

 

[ShelbyGuy]

i have an absolute blast on the track and my suspension is stock except for the caster/camber plates. check out any of my videos posted on the modular fords video section.


its more fun when you're not spending tons and tons of money to do this activity. heck you'll find that just keeping up with the brake pads and fuel costs are hard enough sometimes.

start small and work your way up. its cheaper (and more fun) that way. the more you modify the car, the more you risk being one of those guys who shows up at a track event and spends the entire weekend in the paddock working on his car. that blows.

 

[Fast99Snake]

u have stock suspension shelbyguy

wtf
for some reason i thought ur suspension was super modified and your car was really built

well maybe i will deal with the excessive body roll, but i think the stock gt seats are going to have to go as i have to hold on around any corner that i go around with any speed

 

[ShelbyGuy]

well, every time i tried the "racing" parts on my car when i was first starting out, it just made things worse. i had to work my way up to needing a racing brake pad. i had to work my way up to needing an r-compound tire. i've had to work my way up to wanting stiffer springs and fatter antiroll bars.

i'd like stiffer springs, but changing springs at this point will have no bearing whether or not i have fun on the track. i'll get to it eventually.

my take on it is: there's always someone going quicker with less modficiations. i want to be that guy.

when i was autocrossing with midwestern council, there was a guy who ran sticky tires on an otherwise stock terminator (ralph) and he'd wipe the track with me because he is ten times the driver. with this activity, its not really about the parts as such. its about driver confidence.



everyone gets something a little different out of the racetrack experience. for me, i'm trying to be technically proficient at the grand prix driving technique. im not trying to set the fastest lap of the weekend every lap of every session.

i always feel like i could have braked less and scrubbed off less speed (thus turning in with more speed)
i always feel like i could have turned in just a little later
i always feel like i could have apexed later
i always feel like i could have gotten on the gas just a little sooner, or gotten on the gas more smoothly

i always feel like i could be smoother if i just practiced more. oh darn its sunday at 5 and the corner workers want to go home. cant i just run one more session? please?

 

[Fast99Snake]

good way to think about it

good advice too

i think it is inspiring me to save some of my money

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

well, every time i tried the "racing" parts on my car when i was first starting out, it just made things worse. i had to work my way up to needing a racing brake pad. i had to work my way up to needing an r-compound tire. i've had to work my way up to wanting stiffer springs and fatter antiroll bars.

i'd like stiffer springs, but changing springs at this point will have no bearing whether or not i have fun on the track. i'll get to it eventually.

my take on it is: there's always someone going quicker with less modficiations. i want to be that guy.

when i was autocrossing with midwestern council, there was a guy who ran sticky tires on an otherwise stock terminator (ralph) and he'd wipe the track with me because he is ten times the driver. with this activity, its not really about the parts as such. its about driver confidence.



everyone gets something a little different out of the racetrack experience. for me, i'm trying to be technically proficient at the grand prix driving technique. im not trying to set the fastest lap of the weekend every lap of every session.

i always feel like i could have braked less and scrubbed off less speed (thus turning in with more speed)
i always feel like i could have turned in just a little later
i always feel like i could have apexed later
i always feel like i could have gotten on the gas just a little sooner, or gotten on the gas more smoothly

i always feel like i could be smoother if i just practiced more. oh darn its sunday at 5 and the corner workers want to go home. cant i just run one more session? please?

WOW!!!

ShelbyGuy I assumed you had gone the coil over route.... long ago :shrug:

I'm inspired! :rockon:
My only mods are brake cooling hoses, K&N drop in, Global West SFCs and a fans on early flash tune................. Oh and some guages. Hence the "still excruciatingly stock" sig. Seriously... that's it! No catback, No CAI, no pulley, no camber plates, no springs or sway bars, no H/E..... all of them stock!!!

How is it working out???
The fun factor has been through the roof!! :rockon:

Shelby guy is right ... the absolute best return for your open track addiction...

Is more track time... and whatever it takes to keep you there, IE: fresh tires, pads, brake fluid and fuel.
When you are out there you are out there to make yourself a better driver... not to beat the other guy. If you have that attitude there will be plenty of point bys from cars with mods out the wazoo!
There are a ton of things I'd love to do to my car too... but I can't let it take money away from my FUN!!

Just being there doing it is more important than who I'm faster than.

You'll see... ;-)

 

[Mr. Mysti]

Once you start modding it's hard to stop. I've primarily focused on suspension mods vs. the engine mods. I guess what Kenny said stuck in my head, "There's more speed in the suspension than in the engine."

Working your way up to better parts is always fun, like brake pads, springs, etc., but the cooling problems suck.

I was tempted to do coilover's until I found out the true cost of doing them front/back + the appropiate shocks/struts. For now I will tough it out w/ 1000 Lb/In springs and try and drive it that way. If I keep the car after this season I will probaly do the coilover's.

I belive Kenny Brown was using the Koni DA's. If you can afford it, it might be a nice winter mod. MM did suggest the Bilsteins over the Koni's to me. There thinking was that it takes a lot of setup to get the Koni's dialed in, whereas the Bilsteins you have no choice but to run them the way they are.

 

[ON D BIT]

btw this is a hard driven street car that will see the track probly 3-4 times a year, but that may grow to a larger number as my car turns into more of a track car as I can afford it (only 17 rite now) :-D

the guys at griggs racing live and die on the adjustable koni coilovers. but mostly they just win races on the nasa series racing circuit. so koni would be my first choice.

i believe with all the big manufacturers they will make the cheap stuff and the good stuff. just make sure you buy the best regardless of your choice if your racing at any level higher than autocross. :beer:

 

[ShelbyGuy]

springs just make the car soft anyway (a corrolary to bruce's law on brakes?)

when you're on the bump stops the spring rate is infinity

 

[TTA89]

My car still has a stock shift nob.

If you are new to going left and right I totally agree to just go get seat time the way it is. The car isn't going to go any faster if you can't drive it any faster. My local club had an Auto X this weekend and one of the regular guys has an 04 Cobra that he just did Coilovers, CCs, Subs etc and was running on pretty good tires.

He came over and asked to go for a ride with me, actually I was driving TroyV's Blue 03. We went out for a run and when we came back he said he didn't understand whats wrong with his car, its just not fast out there. I asked him if he wanted me to go with him or have him ride shotgun and I'll drive it and see if can tell whats wrong. So he brought the car around and asked me to drive. We went around and came in with a 1:33, his best of the day to that point was a 1:48. I actually ran 1 second faster in his car than in the other borrowed car I was driving. lol

Anyways, point of the story is like everyone else is saying go get experience before you start changing things around. Mods do nothing if you haven't learned to drive yet.

Also as mentioned most of us are doing drivers schools and HPDE days, yeah you shouldn't be paying attention to who you are faster than but come on guys... Tell me you don't smile when the higher end cars point you by. :bs:

And just my 2 cents, I have read some bad experiences people had with getting Koni's rebuilt but no 1st hand experience. If you do want to go coil-over I totally love my MM front and rears and wouldn't even look elsewhere if I did it again. They are silent and the car rides nice on the street with 375/550 springs. For around $150 bucks plus shipping you can send the front struts off to Bilstien and they will revalve and dyno them for whatever spring rates you want to run.

I'm getting ready to try 425/600s but need to get the struts revalved 1st.

http://www.bilstein.com/services.php

 

[LargeOrangeFont]

Once you start modding it's hard to stop. I've primarily focused on suspension mods vs. the engine mods. I guess what Kenny said stuck in my head, "There's more speed in the suspension than in the engine."

Working your way up to better parts is always fun, like brake pads, springs, etc., but the cooling problems suck.

I was tempted to do coilover's until I found out the true cost of doing them front/back + the appropiate shocks/struts. For now I will tough it out w/ 1000 Lb/In springs and try and drive it that way. If I keep the car after this season I will probaly do the coilover's.

I belive Kenny Brown was using the Koni DA's. If you can afford it, it mightbe a nice winter mod. MM did suggest the Bilsteins over the Koni's to me. There thinking was that it takes a lot of setup to get the Koni's dialed in, whereas the Bilsteins you have no choice but to run them the way they are.

I agree that most people wont need the Konis.

You can go up to 375\600 springs on the stock coupe Bilsteins with MM coilovers. The front kit, rear kit and CC plates are about $900 if you shop around.

I have 375\600 with Cobra R rear shocks. I have $1100 in the coilovers.

Ashley

 

[Fast99Snake]

yeah i just have the stock coupe bilsteins on my car and i already have the CC plates,
i had been looking into buying some new struts and shocks because mr mysti is selling his in november and lives not far from me and i thought it might be the perfect oppurtunity, but now i might just stick with the setup i have now and just get a good alignment and drive the hell out of it

use the money to get out on the track more

my first driving school is one week from today so that will determine what i want to do with this car

also great advice shelbyguy :thumbsup:

 

[ShelbyGuy]

hrmmm driving school within driving distance of the chicago burbs and on a monday....sounds like the cgi motorsports school at gingerman. dont forget about the time zone change