Couple of Dumb Questions

[Jaysin]

I've been fighting my car for awhile, so I will try to keep this short and to the point. I'm having starting issues, I can get it to run, but after about 10 mins or so it will die, and won't crank back up. Initially it would be fine, but after it shut down, the fuel pump wouldn't kick on when the ignition is turned on like it should, but the fans would turn on.

I personally think it's the PATS system and it needs to be disabled. Others have agreed, and others think it might be the CCRM. I have taken the CCRM off, and planned on buying a new one, but haven't as of yet.

Now, I got the car last May, and it was modded, basic bolt ons, 4.30s, a complete nitrous set up complete with a window switch, and a Diablosport chip. The gears weren't installed correctly and ended up grenading, and I swapped to 4.10s.

While the car was down for the gears, my friend and I removed the nitrous and everything associated with it, including the window switch. When the car was completely put back together is when the whole starting issue started. It's had about 20 miles put on it since.

Being honest, i'm not too familiar with window switches, and nitrous set-ups in general, and was wondering if maybe we messed something up during removal? The window switch was in the glove box, we removed the actual unit, but there is a chip on the back side of the glove box with a few wires running through the back of the dash.

I'm also not too familiar with the DSP chips either. Is it possible that removing all that stuff affected the tune, or messing with the window switch affected it? Maybe the pcm acting as if a different tune is loaded and it's causing the car to shut down?

I'm sure it's dumb reading this, but I'm trying to figure out and understand why it's having issues after removing this stuff, as it was totally fine beforehand and it's been a big headache ever since.

I've contacted a shop about them just shutting off the PATS and see if that's the issue, but they use SCT and they said they would have to re-tune the car and that would cost me around $700 or so all said and done, and to be honest I'm not sure if there isn't a simpler and/or cheaper way to get this resolved.

What would you guys do in this situation? Please help!

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

I've been fighting my car for awhile, so I will try to keep this short and to the point. I'm having starting issues, I can get it to run, but after about 10 mins or so it will die, and won't crank back up. Initially it would be fine, but after it shut down, the fuel pump wouldn't kick on when the ignition is turned on like it should, but the fans would turn on.

I personally think it's the PATS system and it needs to be disabled. Others have agreed, and others think it might be the CCRM. I have taken the CCRM off, and planned on buying a new one, but haven't as of yet.

Now, I got the car last May, and it was modded, basic bolt ons, 4.30s, a complete nitrous set up complete with a window switch, and a Diablosport chip. The gears weren't installed correctly and ended up grenading, and I swapped to 4.10s.

While the car was down for the gears, my friend and I removed the nitrous and everything associated with it, including the window switch. When the car was completely put back together is when the whole starting issue started. It's had about 20 miles put on it since.

Being honest, i'm not too familiar with window switches, and nitrous set-ups in general, and was wondering if maybe we messed something up during removal? The window switch was in the glove box, we removed the actual unit, but there is a chip on the back side of the glove box with a few wires running through the back of the dash.

I'm also not too familiar with the DSP chips either. Is it possible that removing all that stuff affected the tune, or messing with the window switch affected it? Maybe the pcm acting as if a different tune is loaded and it's causing the car to shut down?

I'm sure it's dumb reading this, but I'm trying to figure out and understand why it's having issues after removing this stuff, as it was totally fine beforehand and it's been a big headache ever since.

I've contacted a shop about them just shutting off the PATS and see if that's the issue, but they use SCT and they said they would have to re-tune the car and that would cost me around $700 or so all said and done, and to be honest I'm not sure if there isn't a simpler and/or cheaper way to get this resolved.

What would you guys do in this situation? Please help!

When describing starting issues:

Cranking = starter and engine turning over only
fire up = engine starting up

Do you have spark?
Do you have fuel?

Do you know how to test for those things?

It is not uncommon to damage the PCM when removing a chip.

 

[Slowerthnyou99]

As for removing the window switch, as far as I can remember, there was nothing tapped into that would have effected any of your symptoms. Its basically wired in with a relay between the battery, arming switches and the solenoids. You have one wire that is used for tach signal but it should have just been piggybacked onto it and a wire running to the WOT switch.

Good luck!!

 

[01yellercobra]

So you're not running the chip anymore? What MAF and injectors does the car have?

 

[Jaysin]

The chip is still in, the injectors and maf are stock to my knowledge.

 

[Jaysin]

I've been thinking, could it be the fuel pump? If it were the PATS, I wouldn't have been able to start the car at all correct? After the gears were installed, nitrous was removed, and the car was put back together, I was going to drive it home and it wouldn't even try to turn over. We tried jumping the battery, checked fuses, starter, and everything was fine. Next day it fired up and I was able to get it home.

After driving it about 10 miles or so within the next two days, it would hesitate a bit before firing up, it would take maybe 4 or 5 seconds until it fired. It did this until it wouldn't turn over at all. I flipped the key back and forth from on to off about 7 times and it fired up, drove about 2 miles to the gas station, got gas, it fired up at the pump, but with slight hesitation, was on the way back home and it died while I was on the highway. I pulled over, flipped the ignition back and forth, gave it a little gas, got it to fire up, hauled ass to the house, and it died right when I pulled into the driveway and hasn't fired up since. This was a good 3 or 4 months ago now.

 

[01yellercobra]

Checking the fuel pressure wouldn't be a bad idea. A neighbor was having a similar issue in her 6er until it finally died on the freeway. I swapped the pump and it's been fine since. If the MAF and injectors are stock I would also pull the chip and see how it acts.

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[Jaysin]

How would I check to see if it's the pump that went bad? The car has cams, ported intake mani, intake, longtubes, etc. Wouldn't pulling the chip potentially harm the motor?

 

[01yellercobra]

You need a pressure gauge to check the fuel pressure. It won't run 100% with those mods. But it'll tell you if the chip is causing your issues.

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[Jaysin]

If it is the pump, what should I replace it with, just another stock unit or maybe a focus pump or something else?

 

[01yellercobra]

The way I look at things is if I'm replacing it, it's time to upgrade.

 

[Jaysin]

I figured I'd bump this up instead of making a new thread.

I decided to put the CCRM back in the other day and see if I couldn't figure this situation out. I reinstalled the CCRM, car fired right up, then died about 45 seconds later, and wouldn't even attempt to crank or turn over again. I can push the clutch in, turn the key and nothing happens. The fuel pump is priming like it should. I removed the chip, and still no change.

I have noticed that when the car fires up and is running, it takes a good 10-15 seconds until the gauge cluster cycles on, when before it would come on as soon as the car started. Not sure what else to do.

 

[Jaysin]

Anyone?

 

[01yellercobra]

So you put the old CCRM back in or a new one? In my experience when the gauges act up it's a power issue. Either the battery is going or possibly a bad ground somewhere. Did you ever check the fuel pressure with a gauge?

 

[Jaysin]

Put the old one back in, never checked with a gauge.

I did install a new cd player, which my friend wired up for me. I also noticed my Traction control button doesn't light up like it should, but it's plugged in the back.

Also, for what it's worth, after installing the new cd player the sound is pretty horrible. It had an aftermarket unit in it initially, and it sounded like a normal stock 460 should sound. This new player just sounds awful, like the speakers aren't getting enough power or something, I know the stock components aren't anything great to begin with, but i'm talking a noticeable difference in quality. Anything over half volume starts to crackle, and there is virtually no bass, almost sounds like all the speakers are busted. Didn't think much of it.

 

[Jaysin]

Bumping again.