Trying to go return system - please help

[MalcolmV8]

Well in anticipation of a twin screw some day I installed a Fore hat with twin GT pumps, dual FPDM and wiring upgrade. Now I've got a 2.9 Whipple Crusher and from what I'm reading on the forums my GT pumps are not going to cut it.

So I'd like to go return without completely destroying my wallet (the 2.9 crusher already did that for me lol).

1) Can I swap out my GT pumps and put the dual walbros 400 lph pumps in there? Such as these:
Walbro 400 LPH DCSS Twin Turbine High Pressure Fuel Pump [F90000262] : Lethal Performance, Performance parts for Ford Mustangs

2) Can I keep my stock fuel rails like in this lethal kit?
Lethal Performance 99-04 4V Budget Return Style Fuel System [LP-9904BUDGETRETURN-4V] : Lethal Performance, Performance parts for Ford Mustangs

I'm thinking if I can replace my fuel pumps reusing my existing fore hat, run some -8 supply line, -6 return, install a fuel pressure regulator and a -AN fuel filter I could go return without breaking the bank. What do you guys think?

Thanks
Malcolm

 

[cbr repsol]

Im not 100 % but I think the fore hat wont fit the twin 400 pumps. Go tripple walboro gs342 u also need the rails to go return unless their kit has some kind of adapters.everyo.e else ive seen has fore or div x rails.If u wanna save some money u can use the stock feed line as your return and just add dash 8 line for feed. Dont forget to buy your fuel filter and regulator. u can still vet fore stuff, I think its foreinnovations.com

 

[MalcolmV8]

Im not 100 % but I think the fore hat wont fit the twin 400 pumps. Go tripple walboro gs342 u also need the rails to go return unless their kit has some kind of adapters.everyo.e else ive seen has fore or div x rails.If u wanna save some money u can use the stock feed line as your return and just add dash 8 line for feed. Dont forget to buy your fuel filter and regulator. u can still vet fore stuff, I think its foreinnovations.com

You say I have to get rails to go return but the link I provided in #2 in my post shows a kit lethal sells that says you don't have to have to rails. If the stock rails will work fine and the fore or division X are just for looks then I'd rather stay with the stock ones. Plus I like having the fuel rail pressure sending unit there to assist with tuning (I know it's not absolutely required).

Why do you suggest triple gs342 when just two dcss-405 pumps support 1200 hp. If I did go the triple pump route what hat is available now days? I don't see a triple available by Fore any more and Division X doesn't seem to have one either.

Also another concern I have is when I removed the passenger's side fender well I see the fuel line doesn't go straight to the fuel rail. There's other stuff going under there. Any idea what all that stuff is?

 

[Robertp]

What's the power goals? Depending on this is wether I'd get rails or not

Robert

 

[MalcolmV8]

Power goals? humm as much power as a 2.9 crusher can make on 91 pump gas. Then I'll probably have a torco tune as well. My car already has a full nitrous setup now so I'll probably spray the whipple too later down the road.
I'm not against rails. Just want to make sure I really need them and not throwing money away.

 

[MalcolmV8]

I was just looking at these Fore fuel rails. Pretty damn sweet, has provision for factory fuel rail pressure sensor and two 1/8th NTP fittings for nitrous and or fuel pressure gauge. I use all three.

Fuel Rails - SN95 4V

What I don't understand is Lethal doesn't carry Fore stuff any more and when I spoke to them they said they went out of business about 8 months ago. So is the foreinnovations just an old website? or can we still get their stuff?

 

[MalcolmV8]

What I don't understand is Lethal doesn't carry Fore stuff any more and when I spoke to them they said they went out of business about 8 months ago. So is the foreinnovations just an old website? or can we still get their stuff?

Ah I see on their facebook page it says Fore Innovations is picking up where Fore Precision left off. Not sure if the purchased out their company or what the deal is. Bottom line is you can still get the stuff it appears. Sounds good.

 

[Robertp]

Yes Justin is still part of fore I bought some big pumps from him, id go fuel rails if I were you

 

[MalcolmV8]

I just emailed Fore Innovations to see if their fuel rails fit with the 2.9 Whipple Crusher.
Guess I'll need their fuel rails, pressure regulator, pair of DCSS-405 pumps, some -8AN line, AN style fuel filter, and a bunch of AN fittings to make this work.

 

[Robertp]

Yes there rails clear the crusher easy much better than the stock inlet

 

[cbr repsol]

You say I have to get rails to go return but the link I provided in #2 in my post shows a kit lethal sells that says you don't have to have to rails. If the stock rails will work fine and the fore or division X are just for looks then I'd rather stay with the stock ones. Plus I like having the fuel rail pressure sending unit there to assist with tuning (I know it's not absolutely required).

Why do you suggest triple gs342 when just two dcss-405 pumps support 1200 hp. If I did go the triple pump route what hat is available now days? I don't see a triple available by Fore any more and Division X doesn't seem to have one either.

Also another concern I have is when I removed the passenger's side fender well I see the fuel line doesn't go straight to the fuel rail. There's other stuff going under there. Any idea what all that stuff is?

I didnt get a chance to fully look at your link but I knew it was a budget kit. They must have some sort of adapter if u can retain the stock rails. Sounds like your cheaping out on me buddie? U just got crusher and dont wanna spend 300 for rails?reason I mentioned the 342 pumps is u mentioned u had a fore hat already. Im not positive that the twin 400s will fit in their hat. I know the tripple 342s do and are well proven. A friend of mine has them in e85 at over 800rwhp no issues. I know the div x hat can fit twin 400s but I think thats it. From what I heard a third wont fit. Lastly fore went out of buiss due to him and her getting divorce. He restarted under new name most likely because trademark stuff.

 

[cbr repsol]

I was just looking at these Fore fuel rails. Pretty damn sweet, has provision for factory fuel rail pressure sensor and two 1/8th NTP fittings for nitrous and or fuel pressure gauge. I use all three.

Fuel Rails - SN95 4V

What I don't understand is Lethal doesn't carry Fore stuff any more and when I spoke to them they said they went out of business about 8 months ago. So is the foreinnovations just an old website? or can we still get their stuff?

U have the correct sight . When they Announced fore was no more im sure the guys at lethal blew a headgasket. I hear fuel systems are like 75 to 80 % of their buss. Big monney loss so the came out with new stuff called div x. To me looks just like fore units so im not sure if there was a patent on tne design or not?

 

[black 10th vert]

U have the correct sight . When they Announced fore was no more im sure the guys at lethal blew a headgasket. I hear fuel systems are like 75 to 80 % of their buss. Big monney loss so the came out with new stuff called div x. To me looks just like fore units so im not sure if there was a patent on tne design or not?

Their Div X line is basically copies of the stuff Fore designed, and when he went out of business because of marital problems, it left a massive void in the market, which is why Lethal had to step up and make their own version of the products. I don't believe their was any patents involved, but they may have had to do some sort of cash settlement to Justin's wife (who apparently owned the company) for the rights to produce the stuff. That is just speculation on my part, not sure how that part went down. They no longer carry Fore stuff, even though Justin is now back in the game with Fore Innovatons because the products would be in direct competition with their Div X line, so that wouldn't be advantageous for them at all.

OP, you don't really have to use the rails if you go with their budget setup (it has a rail adapted regulator to feed the return line), but running the aftermarket rails is a much cleaner way to set it up, as well as having extra ports for pressure gauge, nitrous, etc. Since you have a Fore hat, I would contact Justin directly, because he may sell you just the new basket/pump carrier part so that you can use the dual Walbros with your existing hat. That should be cheaper to do, than replacing the whole unit, unless you want to run those new 400 pumps, in which case, I'm not sure if other dimensions changed.

 

[03DSGMach1]

Fore Precision Works was dissolved because of the divorce between Justin and his wife. This led to Lethal having to create their own line to fill the void and Division X was born. The rails appear to be very similar to the Fore rails. Fire innovations was formed by Justin to pick up where his old company left off.

The Lethal budget kit reuses the stock rails and it does include an adaptor to make it all work. The kit from what I recall is good to about 800hp, if your comfortable with that then the kit is a great choice. My thought behind fuel systems is to overbuild it as it'll give me room to grow and piece of mind.

IIRC, the Walboro 400lph pumps will not fit the old style Fore hats. However, as an alternative you could use the Division X Stryker pumps that flow 340lph which is still plenty and will fit the old hats. The reason you don't see triple pump hats is likely because the new pumps flow do much more you can get by running just two. I plan on reusing my current Fore hat and running the Stryker pumps when I decide to go return.

 

[MalcolmV8]

Thanks for all the info guys. To the one poster above, I'm not trying to be cheap on rails its just that I see plenty of 2.9 whipple cobras on the forum all running stock fuel rails. What's special about mine that I need aftermarket?

Anyways since there's so much doubt and uncertainty I'll probably just order some Fore fuel rails to be on the safe side since this is already my second time around doing the fuel system and I don't feel like doing it a third time.

It's amazing how quickly things change. I remember a few years ago when the GT pumps became popular and I installed them in my car with a Fore hat I thought it was the shit. I figured I had more fuel system than I'd ever use and yet here we are lol.

That's why I'm going with the dual DCSS-405 pumps. No point in putting in any lesser of a pump and having to do it again. Hopefully they fit in my existing Fore hat with little to no mods, if not I'm sure someone will want to purchase a Fore hat with twin GT pumps.

Do I need to upgrade my fuel supply line too or is just running a return line all I need? What HP level does the factory supply line run out at?
Someone mentioned using the factory supply line as my new return line. Cool idea but what about when it gets to where the fuel filter used to be? are there parts to adapt to that easily?

Also no one has made mention of the other items you see in line of the factory supply fuel line inside of the passenger's fender well. Do we just bypass that stuff? what is it even?

 

[black03]

Thanks for all the info guys. To the one poster above, I'm not trying to be cheap on rails its just that I see plenty of 2.9 whipple cobras on the forum all running stock fuel rails. What's special about mine that I need aftermarket?

Anyways since there's so much doubt and uncertainty I'll probably just order some Fore fuel rails to be on the safe side since this is already my second time around doing the fuel system and I don't feel like doing it a third time.

It's amazing how quickly things change. I remember a few years ago when the GT pumps became popular and I installed them in my car with a Fore hat I thought it was the shit. I figured I had more fuel system than I'd ever use and yet here we are lol.

That's why I'm going with the dual DCSS-405 pumps. No point in putting in any lesser of a pump and having to do it again. Hopefully they fit in my existing Fore hat with little to no mods, if not I'm sure someone will want to purchase a Fore hat with twin GT pumps.

Do I need to upgrade my fuel supply line too or is just running a return line all I need? What HP level does the factory supply line run out at?
Someone mentioned using the factory supply line as my new return line. Cool idea but what about when it gets to where the fuel filter used to be? are there parts to adapt to that easily?

Also no one has made mention of the other items you see in line of the factory supply fuel line inside of the passenger's fender well. Do we just bypass that stuff? what is it even?

Malcolm,
Since you're going to do rails and the 400lph pumps your best bet would be to do the entire system. Our 1200rwhp system comes with the hat, 400lph pumps, rails (which do fit the 2.9l crusher), regulator, filter, fittings, lines, wiring harness and everything else you need to make it work. The 400lph pumps will not fit older model fore hats but will fit the newest DX model hat.

Remember as well that we've got a big Black Friday/cyber Monday sale which starts tomorrow. You'd save quite a bit of money ordering the system that way.

Happy Thanksgiving and let us know if you have any other questions.

Thanks,
Jared

 

[MalcolmV8]

Malcolm,
Since you're going to do rails and the 400lph pumps your best bet would be to do the entire system. Our 1200rwhp system comes with the hat, 400lph pumps, rails (which do fit the 2.9l crusher), regulator, filter, fittings, lines, wiring harness and everything else you need to make it work. The 400lph pumps will not fit older model fore hats but will fit the newest DX model hat.

Remember as well that we've got a big Black Friday/cyber Monday sale which starts tomorrow. You'd save quite a bit of money ordering the system that way.

Happy Thanksgiving and let us know if you have any other questions.

Thanks,
Jared

Jared,

Do you break apart those kits at all? For example I already have the wiring upgrade in place and don't need that wiring. Also I want to get the Fore fuel rails and would not need the DX ones as I need the 1/8th NTP ports on the Fore rails for my nitrous and fuel pressure gauge. The Fore rails also have provisions for the factory fuel rail pressure sending unit which provides valuable info when data logging and tuning.

Also just for my understanding of the value, why is the 4 port fuel pressure regulator used in this kit? what do all the ports connect to? And also why is there a Y block in there? is that to split the fuel supply at the back of the fuel rails? I assume more efficient than using a tee.

Does the sale last through the end of Monday? So Tuesday the sale will be gone right?

Thanks
Malcolm

 

[Zacharyx]

will the 340lph pumps fit into the fore hat?? that may be an option

 

[black03]

will the 340lph pumps fit into the fore hat?? that may be an option

If its the fore hat designed for the dual walbros then yes. If its the one designed for the ford gt pumps then no they will not fit without a conversion kit.

Jared

 

[MalcolmV8]

If its the fore hat designed for the dual walbros then yes. If its the one designed for the ford gt pumps then no they will not fit without a conversion kit.

Jared

Is there a conversion kit to make the original Fore hat accept the walbro DCSS-405 pumps?