Home
What's new
Latest activity
Authors
Store
Latest reviews
Search products
Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New listings
New products
New profile posts
Latest activity
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
Cart
Cart
Loading…
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Search titles only
By:
Menu
Log in
Register
Navigation
Install the app
Install
More options
Change style
Contact us
Close Menu
Forums
Cobra Forums
The Terminator
Terminator Talk
2.3 Gen 2 VMP vs 3.0 Gen 5 whipple (driving experience)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Justin@VMP" data-source="post: 16890005" data-attributes="member: 18468"><p>I could read this thread a lot of different ways but I'll try to go from very general to very specific to cover everyone's needs....</p><p></p><p>A lot of Cobra guys were really happy with the original VMP 2.3 L. That blower has done some really awesome things. I think we've pushed our competitors to innovate and generally moved the supercharging scene forward over the past 12 years. Where do we go from here? The Cobra is a tough market to design for because the engine is extremely small displacement at only 4.6 L. You have people wanting to make only 600 rwhp on pump, and then those wanting to make 1100rwhp all-out on E85. Asking a blower to cover that big of a map is very difficult. We trended toward offering the latest/greatest as we do for all of our other lines such as GT500 and Coyote. </p><p></p><p>About 5 years ago our Cobra offering got an upgrade to the new 2.65 L rotors. Those rotors are extremely good at covering a wide range of horsepower needs, and the ability to fine-tune the port gives us even more coverage. </p><p></p><p>Why do we only offer a 2.65 L? It came up in the comments earlier that our blower was easiest to install and work on. We cast an entire supercharger housing just for the Cobra. This is different than our competitors that use a 3 piece housing with adapter plate, rotor housing (pick from any one of their offerings), and inlet casting. While this makes it a lot easier to work on, with the minimums for castings and the inventory holds it does not equate to us offering more than one option for such a small market.</p><p></p><p>How does the VMP 2.65 L cover our customers needs? On pump gas it should be turned down to the bare minimum with a 3.3" upper pulley. This is a big difference compare to the 2.3 L that could run pump with anywhere from a 3.0" down to a 2.8". And this is where the proof is really in the pudding/data/boost whatever you want to call it. The 2.3 was a great blower, but it worked really hard to do what it did. The torque hit was great because you got everything it had right from the start. The 2.65 L rotors while only 15% larger actually behave like they are 25% larger due to improved L/D and profile. We chose to discontinue the 2.3 L because of the trend toward high boost E85 setups on both stock motors and built motors, and the fact that there were approximately 500 2.3 Ls out there. With so many mild Cobra builds still going on I wish we could bring back the 2.3 L, but manufacturing and sourcing has only gotten worse since COVID. Small runs at low costs are a thing of the past. The strength of the 2.65 L rotors and our current Gen3R offering is the incredible efficiency. What you loose in low-end hit vs a 2.3 L is made up with high end power. I notice this more than most because I drive the full range of cars with our supercharger systems, its most noticeable with the high-revving coyote, but still applies to the Cobra and original GT500. When you look at the data, boost curves, knock tolerance, etc, the 2.3 comes on really strong and is actually prone to knock in the mid-range peak torque area. The 2.65 L is milder there so it takes a tad more timing and then keeps building due to its extremely efficient rotor set. On a pull where you are hitting peak RPM multiple times as you row through the gears the 2.65 is building a lot less heat and taking less power to drive from the crankshaft. All good things when it comes to duration of power vs instant hit. That's a lot to digest, in the end, its your car and build and you can choose based on the available info.</p><p></p><p>We are making some big advances in intercooling technology right now. I believe that this may up-end the traditional blower selection criteria, especially when it comes to max boost vs octane. The stock cobra intercooler is so bad, and what we have developed being so much better, I think there are gains to be had all over the spectrum.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Justin@VMP, post: 16890005, member: 18468"] I could read this thread a lot of different ways but I'll try to go from very general to very specific to cover everyone's needs.... A lot of Cobra guys were really happy with the original VMP 2.3 L. That blower has done some really awesome things. I think we've pushed our competitors to innovate and generally moved the supercharging scene forward over the past 12 years. Where do we go from here? The Cobra is a tough market to design for because the engine is extremely small displacement at only 4.6 L. You have people wanting to make only 600 rwhp on pump, and then those wanting to make 1100rwhp all-out on E85. Asking a blower to cover that big of a map is very difficult. We trended toward offering the latest/greatest as we do for all of our other lines such as GT500 and Coyote. About 5 years ago our Cobra offering got an upgrade to the new 2.65 L rotors. Those rotors are extremely good at covering a wide range of horsepower needs, and the ability to fine-tune the port gives us even more coverage. Why do we only offer a 2.65 L? It came up in the comments earlier that our blower was easiest to install and work on. We cast an entire supercharger housing just for the Cobra. This is different than our competitors that use a 3 piece housing with adapter plate, rotor housing (pick from any one of their offerings), and inlet casting. While this makes it a lot easier to work on, with the minimums for castings and the inventory holds it does not equate to us offering more than one option for such a small market. How does the VMP 2.65 L cover our customers needs? On pump gas it should be turned down to the bare minimum with a 3.3" upper pulley. This is a big difference compare to the 2.3 L that could run pump with anywhere from a 3.0" down to a 2.8". And this is where the proof is really in the pudding/data/boost whatever you want to call it. The 2.3 was a great blower, but it worked really hard to do what it did. The torque hit was great because you got everything it had right from the start. The 2.65 L rotors while only 15% larger actually behave like they are 25% larger due to improved L/D and profile. We chose to discontinue the 2.3 L because of the trend toward high boost E85 setups on both stock motors and built motors, and the fact that there were approximately 500 2.3 Ls out there. With so many mild Cobra builds still going on I wish we could bring back the 2.3 L, but manufacturing and sourcing has only gotten worse since COVID. Small runs at low costs are a thing of the past. The strength of the 2.65 L rotors and our current Gen3R offering is the incredible efficiency. What you loose in low-end hit vs a 2.3 L is made up with high end power. I notice this more than most because I drive the full range of cars with our supercharger systems, its most noticeable with the high-revving coyote, but still applies to the Cobra and original GT500. When you look at the data, boost curves, knock tolerance, etc, the 2.3 comes on really strong and is actually prone to knock in the mid-range peak torque area. The 2.65 L is milder there so it takes a tad more timing and then keeps building due to its extremely efficient rotor set. On a pull where you are hitting peak RPM multiple times as you row through the gears the 2.65 is building a lot less heat and taking less power to drive from the crankshaft. All good things when it comes to duration of power vs instant hit. That's a lot to digest, in the end, its your car and build and you can choose based on the available info. We are making some big advances in intercooling technology right now. I believe that this may up-end the traditional blower selection criteria, especially when it comes to max boost vs octane. The stock cobra intercooler is so bad, and what we have developed being so much better, I think there are gains to be had all over the spectrum. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
Cobra Forums
The Terminator
Terminator Talk
2.3 Gen 2 VMP vs 3.0 Gen 5 whipple (driving experience)
Top