Need Advice from Whipple/KB Guys

[Cooter9250]

In the next couple weeks i plan to purchase a 2nd Gen 2.3 Whipple or 2.6H Kenne Bell. I am looking for advice on what supporting mods i will need to achieve my goals. I am looking for 550 rwhp on pump gas. I would like to keep the boost in the 16-17 psi range if possible. My car currently has a JLT CAI, Afo dual pass heat exchanger, bassani O/R X-pipe, and stingers. I also have an xcal-II for the project.

My assumption is that i will need the following:

2.3 or 2.6 (obviously)
BAP
60 Lb injectors
MAF

Are my goals reasonable and are there any other suppoting mods i should consider?

I want to keep the car streetable and i don't want to tear the motor up. I have done that before and it isn't worth the extra HP, in my opionion.

Any advice is welcomed and appreciated.

 

[BO TY KLR]

Yes a BAP, 60's and mafia will do you for 550-600 easily.

 

[EvilBlack]

Easy. I am similar with 2.6 and am at 580 or so. You can easily drive the car normally staying mostly out of boost and it is just like any other N/A Mustang.

 

[Wayneo]

This topic has been covered thousands of times!!! For only 550rwhp as stated above 60lb injectors, mafia, kb bap and probably a pprv delete but not that important, will be enough. You'll probably hit closer to 600rwhp then 550 depending on your tune.

 

[vladSVT]

In the next couple weeks i plan to purchase a 2nd Gen 2.3 Whipple or 2.6H Kenne Bell. I am looking for advice on what supporting mods i will need to achieve my goals. I am looking for 550 rwhp on pump gas. I would like to keep the boost in the 16-17 psi range if possible. My car currently has a JLT CAI, Afo dual pass heat exchanger, bassani O/R X-pipe, and stingers. I also have an xcal-II for the project.

My assumption is that i will need the following:

2.3 or 2.6 (obviously)
BAP
60 Lb injectors
MAF

Are my goals reasonable and are there any other suppoting mods i should consider?

I want to keep the car streetable and i don't want to tear the motor up. I have done that before and it isn't worth the extra HP, in my opionion.

Any advice is welcomed and appreciated.

Boost a pump, 60 pounders, MAF, aftermarket tb, thats about it if you dont want to go crazy

I'd do some suspension/chassis mods as well to be safe like irs brace, subframes, and bushings if you have the $.

 

[Wayneo]

Also should do the head cooling mod and bigger intercooler tank while your in there. Just my .02 cents

 

[EvilBlack]

Well, this is beyond what you asked but IMHO you should do some brake and FTBR upgrades. Really makes the handling and braking match the power mods.

 

[unit213]

Personally, I wouldn't even consider buying a 2.6 KB. It'll make good power, but you'd might as well buy either a 2.9L Whipple or a 2.8H KB so you have room to grow if you should choose to. People will tell you that you really need to spin these blowers hard, but you can run moderate boost and make plenty of power...and you have more blower left if you want to turn up the boost. Make sure you get a blower with a plenum designed for a single blade throttle body.

**Before the 2.3L Whipple guys get upset - they are great blowers. No doubt about that.**

Here's a mod list of the basics that you'll need (realistically):

Fuel Mods

- 80lb injectors (60's are plenty, but 80's are cheap and easy to tune - room to grow)
- Boost-a-pump

Exhuast Mods

- Stock manifolds are fine for 620rwhp and less (IMO)
- You'll need an x-pipe (brand of your choice).
- You'll need a catback (brand of your choice).

Intake Mods

- Throttle body - get a good single blade throttle body (i.e. Dragon TB).
- JLT CAI (or another brand of your choice / JLT is a quality kit that looks good).

Drivetrain / Misc Mods

- IRS brace from Doug @ Billetflow
- Clutch of your choice
- Clutch quadrant & firewall adjuster (use the search button for tech info)
- Gear shifter (MGW or shifter or your choice) - not required, but you'll thank me.
- SCT MAF or MAFia (you can run the stock MAF, but it will be pegged. You can tune around it...but BAD idea).

Tires

- Depends what you want to do with your car.
- Drag radials for dry weather (search button for details on tires)

Spark Plugs

- You'll need NGK TR6's gapped to about 0.032 (other plugs are fine too - search)

Pulleys / Belt

- Either Metco or Billetflow idler pulleys
- Gates or Gatorback belt (your choice - search for the size)


You can slap a blower on and you'll have yourself a dyno queen...or you can do some more mods and build a car that can actually run a number.
People tend to think that you can install a twin screw and you're automatically making 600+rwhp for $3K. Those people couldn't be more wrong.

 

[03Snake04]

if you go whipple 2.3 you would need an aftermarket 3.2" or 3.25" whipple pulley to make 16-17lbs ... a 3" upper would get you to around 18" (why not consider a 3" and shoot for 600rwhp?) .. it can be reached with the exact same mods you need for the 550rwhp 16-17lb setup

you are on the top of your game with the mods needed..

bap will get you to 600rwhp or a hair over in most cases, you will def need the bap for your goals
60# injectors will be plenty for your goals
and the mafia or sct maf meter will be needed also

with a sbtb and a 16-17lb setup you will easily be at, or over, 550rwhp... 575 will be obtainable as well depending on your tune .. but if you have the upper snub idler to easily run a 3" upper and reduce the risk of belt slip then i would suggest going that way ... you'd see around 18#s but its still a streetable boost level and can be tuned on 93 and you would be closer to around 590ish

 

[03Snake04]

keeping your timing under 20* and a/f ratio around 11.5 and you will not have an issue with your new setup ... it will pull like a freight train and you will :banana: :burnout:

...nice color choice btw :beer:

 

[Cooter9250]

Thanks to everyone for all the input. I have a few additional questions that i am sure you all can shed some light on. Unit213 mentioned going which a larger supercharger and this is something i have been toying with. The price difference isn't much so i'm not too worried about that. The way i see it is the 2.3/2.6H will easily give me wht i want at this point. The 2.8H/2.9 will give me what i want with room to grow if i decide to in the future. From what i have read i can expect lower under hood temps and a little less torque if i go with one of the larger twin screws and run it at the same boost as the 2.3/2.6H (16-18 psi). Is this correct?

My current plans for the car are 95% street. I will being running pump gas most of the time and i am not concerned with a race gas tune. I read about other cars with a 2.9 making 650ish on pump gas and 700+ on race fuel. Obviously that car had a return style fuel system as well as other supporting mods. My questions is this - at what hp level does the car start to wear out (for lack of a better term)? When do you start to break things constantly?

I previously had a fox body with a supercharged 331 and it was alot of fun. I invested alot of time money and effort into that car and it got to a point where i almost couldn't drive it on the street. That is not what i want from this car. I want an efficient, reliable, street car and if i decide to go further in the future than i have what i need.

Thoughts?????

Thanks in advance for all your ideas!

p.s. I thought i would tell you all a few things i will never do to the car to give you all a better idea of the direction i am going.

I will never....

have a solid axle
lower the ride height
cut the hood
install long tubes
use slicks

This is a street car and that's the way i want to keep it....

 

[Cooter9250]

Oh i forgot to mention - I have a set of Hans Racecraft subframes that will be installed. What brand does everyone use for the following:

Bushings
IRS brace
Spark plugs (Denso or NGK)
Injectors

 

[vladSVT]

I'd say around 700rwhp or more you have to be more careful than usual. Especially with IRS, however if you avoid digs then it will last :banana:

As far as mods go, good clutch and 26spline input shaft! Don't forget to get those as well. I have centerforce dfx and its amazing.

As far as brands Billetflow irs is good, siemens injectors, and ngk plugs. Bushings I'd go with Full tilt boogie kit.
Also don't forget about tires if you are going above 650, its gonna be hard to hook without some good ass tires (hoosiers ftw hint hint :rockon

 

[Cooter9250]

Are these the right ones?

Siemens Deka 60 LB High Impedance Fuel Injectors

What is EV6?

IS the SCT Big Air BA-2600 MAF the correct pairing for the 60lb injectors?

 

[03Snake04]

sct-2400 ... sct-2600 ... or sct-3000 will all work in your stock maf location to give you the air reading you will need for 600rwhp

the 2400 model will run out of room not far past 600 tho so going with a larger one will be benefitial if you plan to go higher in rwhp one day(keep you from having to buy the 2600 or 3000 later on)

.... or you could just get the mafia and it plugs directly inline with your stock maf meter and works just as well(cheaper route as well)

 

[03Snake04]

siemen deka makes a great and reliable injector .. that is a brand that most of us go with .. and yes you will need the 60# ones

ev6 is the connection type ... ev6 is the type you will need... if you purchase ev1 style injectors then you will need the adapting harness to connect the ev1 style plugs with the cars ev6 style wiring connector

ev6 plugs right in ... ev1 WITH harness plugs right in ... hope this helps(and the harness' are like 3 inches long each and it works just fine too .. if you dont want the slightly extra wiring... then get the ev6 style

 

[hiimdrummer03]

I have a 2.6 an i like it very well.
I dont know whats being mentioned above if you need room to grow dont waste money on a 2.6 .
On KBs website they say unless your going to start into the motor the 2.6 is better for 95% street cars on the road.
Also you can run 24psi with a 2.6

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/engine-tuning-214/763031-2-3-whipple-748-770-e85.html

Build for the end game, determine what that is NOW. You do not want to be buying this stuff twice.

a 2.3 Whipple is not exactly settling for a POS.

Keep the car from getting over heated.
http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...ostat-cooling-system-reische-performance.html

http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...ystem-upgrade-options-what-you-need-know.html

 

[Cooter9250]

Thanks for the input and links to the other threads. I am definitley not implying a 2.3 is a POS. Just interested if knowing if others think the 2.9 is worth the extra $ even though my immediate plans don't come close to exceeding the 2.3's limits.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

Thanks for the input and links to the other threads. I am definitley not implying a 2.3 is a POS. Just interested if knowing if others think the 2.9 is worth the extra $ even though my immediate plans don't come close to exceeding the 2.3's limits.

Of course they think it is worth the extra dough. Look at how many 2.9 threads there are.

I am waiting to see how many of them actually end up in the 800s.

It's the latest and greatest, all the kids are getting them. Quite a few 3.4s too.:shrug:

If they end up making more than high 600s then good for them, it's not a total waste then.

93 octane will only tolerate just so much boost before detonation. There is not a huge difference between the 2.3 and the 2.9 at 93 octane boost levels.
Some yes, huge? No. I guess for about 300 dollars more, they figure why not.