5 or 6 pt harnesses, and stock Cobra Seats..

I have been using a Schroth rally 4 point harness for the autocross side of my addiction. The more I use it the more frustrated I get with it riding up. I really want a belt that will stay down, and I am considering a 5 or 6 point to take advantage of the anti-sub strap. The tricky part is, how do I mount the anti-sub with the stock seat?

I have seen some just use a 6 pt, and mount to the lap belt anchor points, and then run the straps up onto the seat, and under the legs....similar to a climbing harness, and I have seen some mount a 5 pt or 6 pt and run the strap under the seat, and around the front of the cushion.

Is anyone here using either of these methods that can comment on their effectivity?

Reminder: This is just for keeping the harness fast during an autocross, not for track events..

I would think the 6 point would be the way to go, but I did not do enough research before purchasing, and did not know about them.

03 Cobra Toy(David) and myself are running 5 points through modified stock seats. He paid a trim guy to do his.

I took my seats apart and took the seat cushion cover separately to a friend who has a trim shop, just for the leather work.

The threads were removed from the center of the front seam and a leather sleeve sewn in that matches the side bolsters.
The rest I did myself.

I made brackets to extend the length of the seat belt and added a brace to prevent puckering of the cover material when the belt was pulled tight.(the seat belt pulls back on it when pulled tight)

The belt(and brackets) is anchored to the back portion of the seat frame, which is where the OEM seat belt buckle anchors also.

The seat still functions normally with no belt interference, and you can shove the buckle down through the slot out of the way if it bothers you.

I was a bit of work, but I think it turned out great. It feels immensely better on track having the lap belt held down where it is supposed to be.

I'm sure the seat cover is a standard over-the-counter item too

Jimmy, ya got part numbers for the covers for the cushion and backrest? I know I'm going to need a driver's side backrest cover; that little wing on the outside takes a beating. My driver's cushion cover has pilled up pretty bad too.

Modern seats are a breeze to work on (I learned on springs and hog rings, now its all molded foam and clip-on covers) so I could write a how-to. Been a long time since I wrote a how-to thread...

ShelbyGuy said:

I'm sure the seat cover is a standard over-the-counter item too

Jimmy, ya got part numbers for the covers for the cushion and backrest? I know I'm going to need a driver's side backrest cover; that little wing on the outside takes a beating. My driver's cushion cover has pilled up pretty bad too.

Modern seats are a breeze to work on (I learned on springs and hog rings, now its all molded foam and clip-on covers) so I could write a how-to. Been a long time since I wrote a how-to thread...

Click to expand...

My seat covers are pretty expensive so I was careful not to cut them , just the threads in case I want to put them back to stock.

If you PM me your VIN and tell me exactly which ones you are looking for I can PM you back the correct part #s and current availability.

Trim stuff is the first stuff to go obsolete, as I'm sure you know.
Is Steve at Tousley still doing the SVTP 10% over thing? Is that very far from the Chi-town area?(I bought my Whipple from him, GREAT GUY!)
Or do you have another local parts hook up?

Aren't you running a 6 point John?

Troy, before getting the seats I have, I used my 6 point (G-Force) with my stock seats. I had the sub-belts mounted to the same points as the lap belts, and did the climbers harness routing. It felt secure, but I never crash tested it.

I don't like the idea of mounting any part of the harness to the seat itself.

I have a 5-point and stock seats but when I replace the harnesses, I'm going 6-point. SO much easier and effective to mount in a car with stock seats.

Thanks,

Now that I look at it, the 6pt under the legs route does seem to make more sense as I can mount the anti sub to the lap belt anchor points as opposed to the seat.

MFE said:

I don't like the idea of mounting any part of the harness to the seat itself.

I have a 5-point and stock seats but when I replace the harnesses, I'm going 6-point. SO much easier and effective to mount in a car with stock seats.

Click to expand...

I agree. My lap belts mount to the floor.

I use 5 points in the race car, but did use a 5 point with my old stock FoxGT seats. I just ran the extra strap behind the thigh bolster. My crotch strap is mounted to the floor in a straight line from my chest to the floor. You REALLY want to have all the straps in as straight a pull as you can. That's when they are strongest. I agree, 6 point, mount behind seat and sit on them, knowing you don't want to use them on the street without a rollbar minimum. In a roll your top CAN come down even with the window sill. Not good if you are being held bolt up right in the seat.

doh

Pffft!

Is there an echo in here?

Hi David. It's obvious the site was having problems when you posted this. The dreaded "quad" post has happened to me many times as well.....on to business

Jimmy, on a side note, I noticed you were using the more traditional clasp on your harness. Do you prefer that over the twist cam-lock type?

I was driving a C6 Z-06 at an autocross event recently, and the way I was using the steering wheel was making for a situation when I could very easily undo the latch. It was a G-force harness with the twist cam-lock type latch. It happened on two separate occasions on the same day. I realize it could have just been my seating position, but I think I'd rather have a clasp that isn't affected by that movement.

Yeah, that was interesting.
On camlock Vs duckbill.
Years ago while driving a formula ford, I had an engine misfire and die.
As I pulled over smoke just bellowed over the cockpit. I had Willans belts with camlock. I could not get it to release as I was trying to get out. Took sitting back and trying a second time to release. Turned, just wouldn't release. Of course, I was kinda in a hurry and might have bound it up in the rush. Still..... I've used duck bill ever since. Also different companies put the release on different sides. I like the G-Force belts, but my SafeQuip I have now go the other way and just seem awkward to flip. Always work, but just different. (flip to left to open- used to pulling to right to open. I'm right handed.)
No wait. Old belts flipped up with right hand so that is to the left. New ones I have to reach across and pull to right.
I could switch around, but then the printing would be upside down. May change this weekend, anyway.

TroyV said:

Hi David. It's obvious the site was having problems when you posted this. The dreaded "quad" post has happened to me many times as well.....on to business

Jimmy, on a side note, I noticed you were using the more traditional clasp on your harness. Do you prefer that over the twist cam-lock type?

I was driving a C6 Z-06 at an autocross event recently, and the way I was using the steering wheel was making for a situation when I could very easily undo the latch. It was a G-force harness with the twist cam-lock type latch. It happened on two separate occasions on the same day. I realize it could have just been my seating position, but I think I'd rather have a clasp that isn't affected by that movement.

Click to expand...

That shot with the old style clasp is my passenger seat, instructors very rarely sit there anymore(but every now and again I like to get input).

My belts have the cam locks. I find them a bit difficult to hook up but they seem to release just fine.
I am much more comfortable with the old style belts because that is what I am used to. That's what I used to run in my 1978 Ford Fiesta Ice Car. (D stock)

Just a quick question. Regardless of what kind of seats you choose to use, you do have a roll bar or cage with 4, 5, or 6 point harness, correct?

SKMCOBRA said:

Just a quick question. Regardless of what kind of seats you choose to use, you do have a roll bar or cage with 4, 5, or 6 point harness, correct?

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I looked at Troy's pics in his sig link and I didn't spot one.
Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

Real race belts should be accompanied by at least a 4 point bolt in bar like I have. a DOT shoulder belt allows you to move to the side and down some if the roof caves in on a roll over, race belts don't.

:lol1: ^ ^
Ok There IS an echo in here. ;-)
What Jimmy said. Bar 1st then belts. Even for track days.
Autocrossing... maybe, if you keep stock belts for drive home. Although Erik Strelnieks managed a roll over in a BMW years ago. 1st reaction was stick his arm out the window to catch himself.... I think he wore a cast several months.
Poop happens.

David Hester said:

:lol1: ^ ^
Ok There IS an echo in here. ;-)
What Jimmy said. Bar 1st then belts. Even for track days.
Autocrossing... maybe, if you keep stock belts for drive home. Although Erik Strelnieks managed a roll over in a BMW years ago. 1st reaction was stick his arm out the window to catch himself.... I think he wore a cast several months.
Poop happens.

Click to expand...

OUCH! That sounds like something I'd do. :bash:

I see the videos of pro racers tucking into a ball when going inverted, and hope I have the presence of mind to do so if needed.
I hope to never find out.

Jimmysidecarr said:

I looked at Troy's pics in his sig link and I didn't spot one.
Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

Real race belts should be accompanied by at least a 4 point bolt in bar like I have. a DOT shoulder belt allows you to move to the side and down some if the roof caves in on a roll over, race belts don't.

Click to expand...

Bingo! There is a great thread regarding rollovers on corner-carvers. Completely convinced me to stay with a standard OEM belt until I decide to put a four point in. Also should not put a roll cage in if you ever plan on anyone riding in the back of your car.

gcassidy said:

OUCH! That sounds like something I'd do. :bash:

I see the videos of pro racers tucking into a ball when going inverted, and hope I have the presence of mind to do so if needed.
I hope to never find out.

Click to expand...

I've always been told that smart Nascar racers let go of the wheel once complete control of the car is lost and they head for the wall. I hear they are supposed to cross their arms across their chest and hang on. If not arms can get broken.