They look great, but I don't know if I can afford to do $450 connectors and then another $200 to weld em in. I'm looking for some connectors thats will be good enough for coil overs with some shock and strut tower braces. It's a street car that will see track and mountain road duty occasionally. I just want a really tight tied together feeling.
Chassis Stiffening ?'s
- Thread starter ABrown
- Start date
I'm still on stock springs and shocks because I like the street manners of this car. Yet I run Kumho 710s on track, which are fairly sticky and capable of over loading the springs in a really hard corner. It forces me to be EXTRA SMOOTH.
On the street with less grip you also will need less spring rate. Which is why I view coil overs as a MAX EFFORT mod. I know they can produce a nice ride if rates are chosen carefully, but they are expensive to buy and install correctly with corner weighting and bump steer corrections.
I guess we just have to pick our poison. :beer:
For me it's sticky tires, hard core brakes, Delrin, rigid chassis and a fairly soft suspension. Oh and a little extra power.
;-)
Going on year #4 driving VERY hard on track. And I can almost guarantee you you're not driving as hard as I am! ;-)
oke:FWIW
:thumbsup::coolman::beer:
Going on year #4 driving VERY hard on track. And I can almost guarantee you you're not driving as hard as I am! ;-)
FWIW
:thumbsup::coolman::beer:
I can almost guarentee no one else is either........i've seen your video's
What do you guys think of the Rear Shock Tower braces, such as the Hans, Steeda, and KB units? :shrug:
Also, would it be worth upgrading from MM Full Lengths to their 'XL' Full Length subs?
New!! The Maximum Motorsports XL Series Mustang Full-length Subframe Connectors are now available! We have improved on the original MM Full-length Subframe Connector design with these extra-long, extra-strong subframe connectors.
Maximum Motorsports created the first "Full-length" subframe connectors many years ago. This is yet another MM product that others have copied. Beware of the copycats—MM's are still the best quality. We have now improved on our original design by increasing the length and height of the connector tube. The resulting XL Series connector is much stiffer than any other subframe connector.
The MM Full-Length Connectors stiffen the chassis far more than our standard connectors. The taller tubing of the new XL Series creates a connector that is 95% stiffer than the standard subframe connector. The XL connector tubing is 53% stiffer than our previous Full-length subframe connectors. Beware of connectors from companies who lack the engineering expertise to design their own products. Some have copied our previous design. The new XL Series connectors are 53% stiffer than those copies.
The increased length, method of attachment, and stiffer tubing of the XL Series connector means there is no need for jacking rails. Because of the strength of our tubing; you can lift the car by placing a jack anywhere along the length of the connector tube!
The new XL Series Full-length Subframe Connectors extend from the rear lower control arm attachment point on the rear subframe all the way up to the firewall. This provides substantially more weld area between the connector and the chassis than other connectors. At 65", the extra length, increased number of attachment points, and extra height in the tubing make this the stiffest subframe connector available.
The XL Series Full-length Subframe Connectors are made of 1.5" x 2" x .083" wall thickness rectangular tubing. The thinner wall tubing is used to lessen the weight, while the taller dimension increases stiffness by 95% over our standard connectors.
We add reinforcing plates at each bend to prevent the flexing that would otherwise occur with the thinner wall tubing.
We seal the tubing by welding on end caps to prevent moisture from getting inside the connector and rusting them from the inside out.
Our connectors are custom shaped to hug the floor pan of your Mustang for maximum ground clearance.
The MM XL Series Full-Length Subframe Connectors have seat braces that are to be welded to the connector tube during installation. This customizes the fitment to match the car. This is the best method to account for variations in the floor pan.
Also, would it be worth upgrading from MM Full Lengths to their 'XL' Full Length subs?
New!! The Maximum Motorsports XL Series Mustang Full-length Subframe Connectors are now available! We have improved on the original MM Full-length Subframe Connector design with these extra-long, extra-strong subframe connectors.
Maximum Motorsports created the first "Full-length" subframe connectors many years ago. This is yet another MM product that others have copied. Beware of the copycats—MM's are still the best quality. We have now improved on our original design by increasing the length and height of the connector tube. The resulting XL Series connector is much stiffer than any other subframe connector.
The MM Full-Length Connectors stiffen the chassis far more than our standard connectors. The taller tubing of the new XL Series creates a connector that is 95% stiffer than the standard subframe connector. The XL connector tubing is 53% stiffer than our previous Full-length subframe connectors. Beware of connectors from companies who lack the engineering expertise to design their own products. Some have copied our previous design. The new XL Series connectors are 53% stiffer than those copies.
The increased length, method of attachment, and stiffer tubing of the XL Series connector means there is no need for jacking rails. Because of the strength of our tubing; you can lift the car by placing a jack anywhere along the length of the connector tube!
The new XL Series Full-length Subframe Connectors extend from the rear lower control arm attachment point on the rear subframe all the way up to the firewall. This provides substantially more weld area between the connector and the chassis than other connectors. At 65", the extra length, increased number of attachment points, and extra height in the tubing make this the stiffest subframe connector available.
The XL Series Full-length Subframe Connectors are made of 1.5" x 2" x .083" wall thickness rectangular tubing. The thinner wall tubing is used to lessen the weight, while the taller dimension increases stiffness by 95% over our standard connectors.
We add reinforcing plates at each bend to prevent the flexing that would otherwise occur with the thinner wall tubing.
We seal the tubing by welding on end caps to prevent moisture from getting inside the connector and rusting them from the inside out.
Our connectors are custom shaped to hug the floor pan of your Mustang for maximum ground clearance.
The MM XL Series Full-Length Subframe Connectors have seat braces that are to be welded to the connector tube during installation. This customizes the fitment to match the car. This is the best method to account for variations in the floor pan.
I don't think a rear shock tower brace will do too much even if your running coilovers. The bracing is perpendicular to the load. Most of the side loading is taken up by the upper and lower contror arms. I would take a "pass" on this.
You already have SFC welded in? Removing the exiting ones would get ugly. If you do get the Hans or the Global West subs
I'm adding the Hans rear brace to mine. My reasoning is that it theoretically will help to tie everything together, and help with twisting - essentially making the separate full length subs into a 1 piece unit, instead of separate entities. I figured that it can't hurt anyway...
I heard about this urban legend before, but was unable to find any proof. Do you have any proof?
Not sure what your getting at. Could you elaborate?
Why is it frightning? Do the shock tower fail?
They have. There was a big discussion of this on Cornercarvers.com. Lot's of smart people on there. This topic was of particular interest to me. Lots of discussion going back and forth complete with slide rule calculations. One guy stated his wife punched a hole thru his shock tower after she jumped a curve but that is an extreme example. The main thing to consider is fatigue. The shock towers on an SN95 are simply not designed to carry the weight of the car. You won't notice it but after a while the chassis will start to rattle and creak. Most people think they hang the car on coilovers and life is good. Meanwhile the thin mild sheet metal carrying the load held together at pinch points called spot welds (big stress riser) will work harden and start to micro fracture. After a while most people don't realize their car is not as tight as it was when new. It's a slow insidious process. The S197 was designed from the get go for coilovers. The SN95 is a different story. Nothing that can't be remedied but you have to know what your doing and even then it's no guarantee it won't loosen up on you. The front shock towers are more vulnerable then the rears.
I would agree the towers were not designed to carry the weight but i have never seen a shock tower fail. I also do understand that our cars are not very good at torsional stiffness. I go to the track about every other weekend. Most of the people who i have seen on track have coil-overs, most if not all the ai/aix racers have coil-over. I live 5 minutes from a 1/4 track and some/if not all of the 11 second mustangs have coil-overs.
Yea, If shock towers were failing even as a rarity companies would not be selling them for fear of liability. What I was getting at is how they could stress and fatigue the metal over time. I hate loose and rattley cars. That's why I would never by a convertible with the exception of a Miata or S2000.
Agreed, they are rock solid :thumbsup:
also , you may need to get a front and rear strut tower brace, since the coil over changes where the weight of the car is held from
I dunno about strut towers failing, but I thought I'd add my personal experience. I believe it was before I had coilovers, but after I had some 3 bolt UPR steel c/c plates put in, I nearly lost control on an on-ramp and jumped a small curb. It was only about 2-3 inches high, but I steered into it and when I hit, it blew a hole in the sidewall of my brand new tire and bent the c/c, damn near pulling it out of the strut tower. I didn't think of it at the time, but since they were only 3 bolt plates, if I had coilovers I bet the outcome would have been a lot worse for the strut tower. The holes weren't enlarged, but the top of the strut tower was bent and I had to hammer it back flat. Not pretty. Again, this is an extreme circumstance, but it could happen. In this case, I don't think a strut tower brace would have helped at all since most of them aren't bolted to the c/c plate bolts like they are on most cars.
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