The Death of 95 "R" #99- or I need to vent

So after learning a while back that my old #99 95R hit a tire wall at 135mph (owners statement not mine) and shifted the nose over by 14 inches (his only time out in the car before buying a Bondurant car to replace it with) I attempted to buy the car back. Countless emails went unanswered, then one day out of the blue (December 07) I get a call from the current owner of the car. He goes on to tell me how he is going to yank the drivetrain and build an AI racer as he has gotten pretty serious about hitting the professional race schedule next year (2008). I attempt to explain to him that he should buy a crate drivetrain and leave the original in the "R", thought I had gotten through to him on this one....Fast forward to yesterday afternoon when JM sends me the link to the following ad (Ad #1183347 on racing junk):

1995 Mustang AI Race Car (Never Raced) "Fresh tub delivered in late 2007, no expense spared, must be seen to appreciate. 1995 Cobra R motor, Tremec TKO 660 R Transmission, Alcon 6 Piston Calipers,too much to list here.

Price includes rolling chassis of rebuilt 1995 Cobra R, clean title and most of the original parts.

$55,000.00


Serious inquiries only."

I do realize that the owner can do with it what he wants as it is now his and no longer mine, but at the same time I wish I could un-ring the bell when I sold it to this guy as he seems to just have more money than brains when it comes to these cars in general. There was a lot more I said (or could say here) to JM yesterday when he called, but decorum prohibits me from posting it here. Although, let this post act as a warning that 1995 Cobra "R" #99 did receive a good hit to the nose which shifted both shock towers towards the passenger side of the car. Not sure of what the "A" Pillar looked like when they removed the right fender, but I'm sure that was tweaked just the same, let the buyer beware..........Thanks for listening as I am still pretty wound up about it and just needed to vent.................


Bill S.

Heard a rumor that the entire front clip is being replaced with a donor clip. How well it turns out is, of course, up to the guy doing the work.

mrmustang said:

1995 Mustang AI Race Car (Never Raced) "Fresh tub delivered in late 2007, no expense spared, must be seen to appreciate. 1995 Cobra R motor, Tremec TKO 660 R Transmission, Alcon 6 Piston Calipers,too much to list here.

Price includes rolling chassis of rebuilt 1995 Cobra R, clean title and most of the original parts.

$55,000.00."

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Bill,
Thanks for updating the history. I noted this in my 95R database.

Nonetheless, one can buy a competitive NASA-AI car for much much less than this. :-D I don't really think he'll get any offers at this price.

I thought NASA had originally disqualified R-models? Or was that just in NASA-CMC? I don't see how a well-built 351 could ever but keep from exceeding the NASA-AI power to weight restrictions?

I agree that he should have kept the original 351 engine in storage and simply purchased a crate engine to race with.

I can never understand the logic of cutting up a rare car. He should have bought a V6 car and hacked that up. The end result would have been the same.

:nonono:

Bill,

Sorry to get yer panties in such a twist over this.....

I know Bill was trying very deliberately to offer the guy a fair price for th 'remains' of ole #99, but he was heel bent on pulling the drive train for whatever stupid reason. Like doc said........ a crate moder or step above would suffice for the AI car, leave the R intact, but not in his game plan.

To compound matters, he offers a 'group purchase' on the racer with the R drivetrain and the R body minus said drivetrain. Kinda dumb in my book.
:dw::dw::dw:

I spoke w/Ed yesterday re the R only, (I'm sure not interested in a $50k AI car). The engine, I think, is all he stripped from the R to build his AI car. He has the R specific parts to go with the chassis. So there's still hope it can all be reassembled.

His Bondurant car is for sale along with the AI car as he and "the gang" from AutoBahn have all bought spec Miatas to play with, some 30 of them!

Did anyone keep the picture that was posted showing the crash damage.

93SVTCobra said:

Did anyone keep the picture that was posted showing the crash damage.

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I may have it on one of my systems at home. if so I'll post it later.


Bill S.

There are some 95R engine parts on eBay-is it the same car?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1995...017QQitemZ270230778048QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1995...017QQitemZ270230778833QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

Who puts used pistons from a diffrent engine in a rebuild :dw:

Does that come with rings too?

The Cobra R parts on Ebay are definitely from a different vehicle.

Honestly, I don,t think I would buy a cast crank if I needed to replace my original one anyway. If I need to replace something, it might as well be better.

As far as trying to bring the #99 car back to life, is this more of a sentimental thing than an actual original car issue? Would'nt being in the type of accident described earlier have greatly diminished the collectibility anyway?

1995COBRA-R said:

I thought NASA had originally disqualified R-models? Or was that just in NASA-CMC? I don't see how a well-built 351 could ever but keep from exceeding the NASA-AI power to weight restrictions?

Click to expand...

You must be thinking CMC, My 95 R has won races in AI with no issues.

In my opinion, a 95R is a poor choice for a AI car, it is nowhere close to being competitive.... The money that it would take to make it competive, could be spent wiser on a real race car.

Brian

Here is a shot of the car when it was wrecked and placed in storage

I take it that is the car in your sig :nonono:

SlowSVT said:

I take it that is the car in your sig :nonono:

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You mean my avatar, yup, one and the same:fm:

wheelhopper said:

As far as trying to bring the #99 car back to life, is this more of a sentimental thing than an actual original car issue? Would'nt being in the type of accident described earlier have greatly diminished the collectibility anyway?

Click to expand...

You hit the nail on the head. After this car was crashed the collectability of this car really deminished especially among those who post here. There are guys on this board who won't buy anything unless it is a low mileage garage queen.

Is the car worth 55K.. who knows? Guys have spent just as much for track toys and on just plain Jane Mustangs.
It looks like he did a great job on the rebuild/conversion to a REAL racecar and when all is said and done it is still an R model.
Has anybody ever taken a close look at the 65 R models and noticed they are far from original.

Sorry Bill I have to disagree with you on this one. You sold it and the new owners are under no obligation to sell it back to you.

I think there is a 95 R model out there with your name on it (literally) that might be yours someday.:rockon:

RD

Roger Davis said:

Y

Sorry Bill I have to disagree with you on this one. You sold it and the new owners are under no obligation to sell it back to you.

RD

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Roger,

The blue car in the pictures is the "AI" car which he transplanted the "R's" engine and ECU in to and nothing else. The Cobra "R" (my old car) roller is under cover in the background I believe. yes, the blue car looks great, but for the cost of a 351W/385hp Ford crate engine, it would be faster while allowing the new owner of the "R" to put the matching numbers engine back into the chassis and have someone with "R" experience fix it the right way and get it back to the track where it belongs :beer:


Bill S.

Roger Davis said:

Is the car worth 55K.. who knows? Guys have spent just as much for track toys and on just plain Jane Mustangs.
It looks like he did a great job on the rebuild/conversion to a REAL racecar and when all is said and done it is still an R model.
Has anybody ever taken a close look at the 65 R models and noticed they are far from original.

Click to expand...

Mr. Money-Bag,
OK, I forgot that Brian has been racing (and winning Championships) in NASA-AI with a CobraR. :-D

I'd agree that a car is worth what someone pays for it.

It's just that I would never pay $55K for a car that has really never been raced. I've seen championship NASA cars advertised on C-C and the NASA forums for much less.

And then one has to pass tech on the new NASA rules effective in June. So, one can pay $55K for the car, buy a recognized head/neck restraint system, and spend another $25K to race in the series.

Of course, most of those '65 R-models are fakes (except for a few guys that can afford to tear up a $800,000 car).

Most vintage racers build another car (a replica) and stick a fake Shelby i.d. number on it to replicate their real car that stays in their garage. The tech guys never know the difference since the racer shows up with a new copy of the Shelby recognition guide to prove that the car entered is, indeed, his actual Shelby.

Did not all early Mustangs have the exhaust exit within the body? :dw:
http://www.hsrrace.com/HSR/photogal.nsf/plinks/HSRP-7CLNL8

We all know that you can tuck a rear tire this big under a non-modified early Mustang?


His real Shelby was returned to storage last year. This new car has the same numbers on it. It's legal. ;-)

Cobra-R said:

...
In my opinion, a 95R is a poor choice for a AI car, it is nowhere close to being competitive.... The money that it would take to make it competive, could be spent wiser on a real race car.

Brian

Click to expand...

Of course, that depends on the modifications & the driver, now doesn't it?

Price notwithstanding, the R is a much better place to start building a race car than any other sn95 car in my opinion. The 351 is better for the class and is a savings too. If you are going all out, the S197 chassis is superior, no question.

Bruce