Okay, let's get the obvious stuff out of the way:
This is just a personal review of some publicly available information. Thanks to VMP for their coyote shootout. This wouldn't be possible without them.
I selected 3 manifolds to do This comparison. They include the unported 2018, GT350 and Cobra Jet manifolds. Some of you may ask why I did not select the ported 2018. The answer is quite simple; I wanted the analysis to reflect Manufacturing tolerance. I'm not sure if the 2018 manifold is hand ported or not, but either way I'm sure that there are differences from one retailer to the next if they come off of different CNC machines.
Vmp's comparison is with a generation 2 coyote motor. The motor does have exhaust and runs on pump gas. This being said, you will have some difference in output between all three generations of the coyote motor. This is due to Generation 1 having the smallest cam profile of the group. Generation 2 has the addition of c m c v plates in the intake manifold in addition to a larger camshaft. Generation 3 adds a point of compression and an additional five cubic inches of displacement. While the cam profile between generation two and three are identical, they are different camshafts and do not interchange.
Also make note that the analysis was made from the 5,000 to 7400 RPM range. The reason this range was selected was to display the top end differences of the manifolds. While the Cobra Jet and 350 manifolds could extend the Power Band, since this test was done with stock cams going Beyond this range was fruitless.
Something that became apparent very quickly was that the most horsepower that the stock cams what produce naturally aspirated was right at 460. These are 13 mm camshaft, which is around .512 inch lift. Ironically, this camshaft in the 2nd and 3rd Generation coyote 5.0 shares many similarities with the F 303 Ford Racing cam for Windsor Motors. To put things in perspective, technology has allowed us to take a 307 cubic inch motor and get 20 miles per gallon and 450 + horsepower. Some of us older guys remember those numbers were reserved for race cars or Big Cube street cars that sacrificed drivability and reliability. I remember a friend of mine in the 90's had a 408 stroker that made around these numbers and bragged that he got to keep his air conditioner. We've come a long way!
The 2018 manifold made a peak of 458 horsepower at 7100 RPMs. From 5000 to 7400 RPMs the motor average 424.14 horsepower. After 7100 RPM's, the numbers nosedives from 458 horsepower down to 438 in a matter of 300 RPMs. Ouch.
Next up is the GT350 intake manifold. Now there has been a lot of debate as to this manifold. Mainly, is it worth the cost versus the 2018 manifold. If you're strictly looking at Peak numbers, the answer is no. But if you are analyzing the data you get a bit of a different picture. While their Peak number is almost identical, the 350 manifold makes more average horsepower from that 5,000 to 7400 RPM range. It's not much at all coming in at 427.43. While it is just over a 3 horsepower difference, there are few things that stand out.
The first item is the loss of power past 7100 RPM. Both manifolds Peak at 7100 RPMs, which to me is an indicator that the camshafts are the limiting factor not only for more horsepower, but also for more engine range. The GT 350 manifold loses 5 horsepower from its 7100 RPM Peak to 7400 RPM. Basically if you're shifting at 7400 RPMs, the GT350 has a 15 horsepower advantage in that part of the band.
Using a 2015 GT as an example, once you view the data you can see that the GT350 equipped car is ahead of the 2018 manifold car at six of the seven data points. Translation the 2018 car shouldn't never beat the GT350 car. Using a 373 rear end equipped car as an example, gear changes at 7400 RPMs into second gear drops you to 4900 RPM, 3rd gear drops you to 5200; fourth to 5800.
Theoretically, that 2018 should never beat the gt350 in a 1/4 mile drag race.
Now, for the Cobra Jet. Let's go ahead and crown it the champ, because it is. Again, like the gt350, it beats the 2018 at 6 out of 7 data points. I feel this is due to the intake manifold (2018) and (stock) cams were designed for each other, and 5800 rpm point is it's sweet spot.
The Cobra Jet (CJ) averages 433.14 hp from 5000 to 7400 rpm. If you focus on the 6200 to 7400 range, the numbers are eye opening:
CJ @6200: +10
CJ @6600: +13
CJ @7000: +02
CJ @7400: +22
The CJ peaks at 6600 rpms, well below the 7750 peak it is designed for. I am of the opinion that this is due to the efficiency of the CJ AND the limitations of the stock cams. A set of cams that would give more intake lift and duration, and the 2018 would be cast aside like a leper.
So, from the look of things, the stock cams are good for 460 whp N/A and the 2018 Manifold limits become apparent at 7000 rpms. A motor with these characteristics (302 cid, 11 to 1 cr, .512 inch lift cams) need to make peak hp at 7700 rpms on pump gas to make 500 whp. A gen 3 motor makes it a bit easier. Either way, the data tells me stock cams and stock intake manifold simply won't do it. Of course, there are variances that I cannot account for, so it "could" be done, but I am confident in saying it is not the norm.
Is the 2018 agood great manifold for the money? Absolutely. But if you are doing a serious N/A build, not just headers, but a real build, with cams, you need to look at the CJ, GT350...even the Boss 302 over the 2018.
I would love to continue doing this if you guys have any interest. there was a lot more data, but this is long enough as it is. Let me know guys!
This is just a personal review of some publicly available information. Thanks to VMP for their coyote shootout. This wouldn't be possible without them.
I selected 3 manifolds to do This comparison. They include the unported 2018, GT350 and Cobra Jet manifolds. Some of you may ask why I did not select the ported 2018. The answer is quite simple; I wanted the analysis to reflect Manufacturing tolerance. I'm not sure if the 2018 manifold is hand ported or not, but either way I'm sure that there are differences from one retailer to the next if they come off of different CNC machines.
Vmp's comparison is with a generation 2 coyote motor. The motor does have exhaust and runs on pump gas. This being said, you will have some difference in output between all three generations of the coyote motor. This is due to Generation 1 having the smallest cam profile of the group. Generation 2 has the addition of c m c v plates in the intake manifold in addition to a larger camshaft. Generation 3 adds a point of compression and an additional five cubic inches of displacement. While the cam profile between generation two and three are identical, they are different camshafts and do not interchange.
Also make note that the analysis was made from the 5,000 to 7400 RPM range. The reason this range was selected was to display the top end differences of the manifolds. While the Cobra Jet and 350 manifolds could extend the Power Band, since this test was done with stock cams going Beyond this range was fruitless.
Something that became apparent very quickly was that the most horsepower that the stock cams what produce naturally aspirated was right at 460. These are 13 mm camshaft, which is around .512 inch lift. Ironically, this camshaft in the 2nd and 3rd Generation coyote 5.0 shares many similarities with the F 303 Ford Racing cam for Windsor Motors. To put things in perspective, technology has allowed us to take a 307 cubic inch motor and get 20 miles per gallon and 450 + horsepower. Some of us older guys remember those numbers were reserved for race cars or Big Cube street cars that sacrificed drivability and reliability. I remember a friend of mine in the 90's had a 408 stroker that made around these numbers and bragged that he got to keep his air conditioner. We've come a long way!
The 2018 manifold made a peak of 458 horsepower at 7100 RPMs. From 5000 to 7400 RPMs the motor average 424.14 horsepower. After 7100 RPM's, the numbers nosedives from 458 horsepower down to 438 in a matter of 300 RPMs. Ouch.
Next up is the GT350 intake manifold. Now there has been a lot of debate as to this manifold. Mainly, is it worth the cost versus the 2018 manifold. If you're strictly looking at Peak numbers, the answer is no. But if you are analyzing the data you get a bit of a different picture. While their Peak number is almost identical, the 350 manifold makes more average horsepower from that 5,000 to 7400 RPM range. It's not much at all coming in at 427.43. While it is just over a 3 horsepower difference, there are few things that stand out.
The first item is the loss of power past 7100 RPM. Both manifolds Peak at 7100 RPMs, which to me is an indicator that the camshafts are the limiting factor not only for more horsepower, but also for more engine range. The GT 350 manifold loses 5 horsepower from its 7100 RPM Peak to 7400 RPM. Basically if you're shifting at 7400 RPMs, the GT350 has a 15 horsepower advantage in that part of the band.
Using a 2015 GT as an example, once you view the data you can see that the GT350 equipped car is ahead of the 2018 manifold car at six of the seven data points. Translation the 2018 car shouldn't never beat the GT350 car. Using a 373 rear end equipped car as an example, gear changes at 7400 RPMs into second gear drops you to 4900 RPM, 3rd gear drops you to 5200; fourth to 5800.
Theoretically, that 2018 should never beat the gt350 in a 1/4 mile drag race.
Now, for the Cobra Jet. Let's go ahead and crown it the champ, because it is. Again, like the gt350, it beats the 2018 at 6 out of 7 data points. I feel this is due to the intake manifold (2018) and (stock) cams were designed for each other, and 5800 rpm point is it's sweet spot.
The Cobra Jet (CJ) averages 433.14 hp from 5000 to 7400 rpm. If you focus on the 6200 to 7400 range, the numbers are eye opening:
CJ @6200: +10
CJ @6600: +13
CJ @7000: +02
CJ @7400: +22
The CJ peaks at 6600 rpms, well below the 7750 peak it is designed for. I am of the opinion that this is due to the efficiency of the CJ AND the limitations of the stock cams. A set of cams that would give more intake lift and duration, and the 2018 would be cast aside like a leper.
So, from the look of things, the stock cams are good for 460 whp N/A and the 2018 Manifold limits become apparent at 7000 rpms. A motor with these characteristics (302 cid, 11 to 1 cr, .512 inch lift cams) need to make peak hp at 7700 rpms on pump gas to make 500 whp. A gen 3 motor makes it a bit easier. Either way, the data tells me stock cams and stock intake manifold simply won't do it. Of course, there are variances that I cannot account for, so it "could" be done, but I am confident in saying it is not the norm.
Is the 2018 a
I would love to continue doing this if you guys have any interest. there was a lot more data, but this is long enough as it is. Let me know guys!
