Stock location Meziere I/C pump bracket

[chrisheltra]

I have made a bracket to install a Meziere I/C pump in the stock location. A drawing with dimensions is below. You will have to remove the stock pump bracket in order to install the new bracket. The new bracket should be made from 3/8 aluminum or steel. It will install with the two screws that were removed to take the stock bracket out.

 

[FordFanStan]

Not to be an ass but some of your measurents don't add up exactly or there were some typos, .7" + 2" + .5" = 3.25 :nonono: oke: . I think it would be easier for most if all the measurments were measured and written as fractions, most people who would do this would be using a tape or ruler IMO to measure it out.

Very nice job graphing the bracket out, clean simple and legible.

I am anxious to hear your thoughts after you get it installed. Will you be doing any before and after datalogging with the ECT's/temp's? I'm curious if the coolant is going to be flowing too fast to properly cool? Only one true way to find out, and you are taking the steer by the horns. :rockon: :thumbsup: .

Also what are your existing coolant mods? T-stat, resevior, coolant type, etc... Stan

 

[chrisheltra]

Not to be an ass but some of your measurents don't add up exactly or there were some typos, .7" + 2" + .5" = 3.25
Im not sure what your refering to. :nonono: oke: .

I think it would be easier for most if all the measurments were measured and written as fractions, most people who would do this would be using a tape or ruler IMO to measure it out.
The only thing I had at the time at work was a scale that measures in tenths.

Very nice job graphing the bracket out, clean simple and legible.

I am anxious to hear your thoughts after you get it installed. Will you be doing any before and after datalogging with the ECT's/temp's? I'm curious if the coolant is going to be flowing too fast to properly cool? Only one true way to find out, and you are taking the steer by the horns. :rockon: :thumbsup: .
I installed it yesterday and it went very smooth. I have not yet had the time to datalog it but I do have before datalogs to compare it to.

Also what are your existing coolant mods? T-stat, resevior, coolant type, etc... Stan
Currently I have a JLP powercooler under the hood, stock t-stat ( my tuner told me to stick with that for now). Im using distilled water with a bottle of watter wetter in the I/C system. Future mods will include an Afco heat exchanger and a larger resi tank.

c

 

[FordFanStan]

See on the top of your bracket, the widest part it says total width is 8.25", yet it consists of three parts .9" + 8.14" + 1" ... that equals a total width of 10.04"??... Same with the bottom width...

None the less the bracket worked for you and thats is what matters. Again I wasn't trying to be a smartass, just letting you know in case you didnt see it...

Very cool that you have before datalogs to compare to. Definitely let us know if there is any difference. I was very interested in this when you first brought it up, I do not care for the stock intercooler pumps, but no company that I know of makes anything around the same flow rate with the same durability.

I do not recall now, but when you researched it what did Meziere say about is 100% duty cycle? And what was the flow rate idfference again, I think I recall you saying it flows approximately three times the stock pumps flow rate??? TIA, ... Stan

 

[chrisheltra]

See on the top of your bracket, the widest part it says total width is 8.25", yet it consists of three parts .9" + 8.14" + 1" ... that equals a total width of 10.04"??... Same with the bottom width...

Ok I see what your talking about on the top, and i fixed it and posted the new drawing. I still dont see the problem with the bottom. I guess thats why a second pair of eyes comes in handy.

None the less the bracket worked for you and thats is what matters. Again I wasn't trying to be a smartass, just letting you know in case you didnt see it...

:beer:

Very cool that you have before datalogs to compare to. Definitely let us know if there is any difference. I was very interested in this when you first brought it up, I do not care for the stock intercooler pumps, but no company that I know of makes anything around the same flow rate with the same durability.

I definatly will do some datalogging if not tonight for sure on Friday at the track. I will post up the results shortly after.

I do not recall now, but when you researched it what did Meziere say about is 100% duty cycle? And what was the flow rate idfference again, I think I recall you saying it flows approximately three times the stock pumps flow rate??? TIA, ... Stan

Yes the meziere flows 3.5 times the fluid making it a 20 gal/min pump. The stock pump has a 6 gal/min flow rate.

c

 

[Fade 2 Black]

What's the dealeo with the pump? Why are you changing? That is a HELLUVA increase in flow rate. That's over 4500 lph!

Can we use it as a fuel pump? :idea: J/K Keep us posted on the data. :beer:

 

[chrisheltra]

What's the dealeo with the pump? Why are you changing? That is a HELLUVA increase in flow rate. That's over 4500 lph!

Can we use it as a fuel pump? :idea: J/K Keep us posted on the data. :beer:

I changed the pump b/c the stocker was going out. I used the Meziere b/c of the cooling upgrades I have and also the ones I plan on getting. Increased flow for increased capacity.

 

[Fade 2 Black]

Gotcha, nothing wrong with that. Not trying to be a d1ck but are you sure it's not 20 gal/hour? Filling up a 55 gallon drum in 2.5 minutes just seems like a lot to me. :shrug:

 

[chrisheltra]

Nope it right

From meziere's website.

WP136
20 GPM flow rate
Single in Single out design (#12AN both sides)
Billet aluminum impeller
Adapter to #8 AN available for common replacement issues
4130 mounting bracket included

 

[Kryo-Genik]

What's the dealeo with the pump? Why are you changing? That is a HELLUVA increase in flow rate. That's over 4500 lph!

Can we use it as a fuel pump? :idea: J/K Keep us posted on the data. :beer:

Flow rate is king brother.
In theory the faster he slams coolant through that I/C the better his temps should be.
I may just switch to one of these for a new pump when the time comes

 

[ChrisNelson]

Flow rate is king brother.
In theory the faster he slams coolant through that I/C the better his temps should be.
I may just switch to one of these for a new pump when the time comes

I don't think that is necessarily the case. It needs to have a chance to release heat in the Heat Exchanger. If it passes through it too fast it may not be cooling down.

I am interested in installing one in my truck though. With my IC res in the bed that I pack with ice, this should be done.

Any link to where one could be purchased?

 

[chrisheltra]

You will need one of these http://store.summitracing.com/egnse...e&Ntk=KeywordSearch&DDS=1&N=700+115&x=23&y=13

and two of these http://store.summitracing.com/egnse...alse&Ntk=KeywordSearch&DDS=1&N=700+0&x=27&y=3

Its the cheapest place I could find it and with free shipping.

 

[Kryo-Genik]

I don't think that is necessarily the case. It needs to have a chance to release heat in the Heat Exchanger. If it passes through it too fast it may not be cooling down.

I am interested in installing one in my truck though. With my IC res in the bed that I pack with ice, this should be done.

Any link to where one could be purchased?

Believe it or not there are two schools of thought when it comes to this.
However you'll see better benefits when the temp difference is greater between the coolant, the rad and the air. I have a write up about it
should translate prefectly for our needs

 

[BlackBolt9]

Believe it or not there are two schools of thought when it comes to this.
However you'll see better benefits when the temp difference is greater between the coolant, the rad and the air. I have a write up about it
should translate prefectly for our needs

Which two schools? Harvard and MIT? How can you take two different approaches to a heat transfer problem? Heat from hot intake charge air is transferred (added) into the water through the intercooler (heat exchanger). The water is the moved to the radiator (heat exchanger) where the heat is then removed from the water so that when it returns to the intercooler it can once again take heat away from the air again. If you move the water too quickly it cannot lose enough heat energy in the radiator to remove a signifcant amount of heat from the air the next time through the intercooler.

Cooler ambient temperature does lead to a quicker rate of transfer of heat from the water. Also more air being moved through the radiator increases heat transfer as water can carry a higher thermal load than air by volume at standard atmospheric conditions.

 

[Kryo-Genik]

Which two schools? Harvard and MIT? How can you take two different approaches to a heat transfer problem? Heat from hot intake charge air is transferred (added) into the water through the intercooler (heat exchanger). The water is the moved to the radiator (heat exchanger) where the heat is then removed from the water so that when it returns to the intercooler it can once again take heat away from the air again. If you move the water too quickly it cannot lose enough heat energy in the radiator to remove a signifcant amount of heat from the air the next time through the intercooler.

Cooler ambient temperature does lead to a quicker rate of transfer of heat from the water. Also more air being moved through the radiator increases heat transfer as water can carry a higher thermal load than air by volume at standard atmospheric conditions.

if you move the water faster you are supplying whatever is giving off the heat with a constant source of "fresh" water. either way our system is closed loop and will eventually reach equilibrium, just with a faster flow yo uwill have a little more time before you reach that point.

The principal are the same just the application is different. As for the two schools...I meant higher flow versus slower flow.

 

[ChrisNelson]

^^ Mike, I think I understood what you meant. For someone like me, with an Ice tank, the faster that COLD water flows the better.

For most and for me on the street though : I think the faster through the IC the better, but slower through the HE the better.

 

[Kryo-Genik]

^^ Mike, I think I understood what you meant. For someone like me, with an Ice tank, the faster that COLD water flows the better.

For most and for me on the street though : I think the faster through the IC the better, but slower through the HE the better.

I remember you had the large (read..huge ass) res in your bed so your temps will stay lower longer by nature due to larger coolant capacity.
However even on the street the same will hold true as above but eventually ALL of the coolant will reach a single temp. Im horrid at examples so I will try and shy away from it. But in short, over time once all the coolant in your loop(s) reaches temp, your coolants temp will only fluctuate by a small amount. I hope that made sense. But read that thread those guys would smoke my ass when it comes to liquid cooling...I am NO expert and will never claim to be.

 

[BlackBolt9]

if you move the water faster you are supplying whatever is giving off the heat with a constant source of "fresh" water. either way our system is closed loop and will eventually reach equilibrium, just with a faster flow yo uwill have a little more time before you reach that point.

The principal are the same just the application is different. As for the two schools...I meant higher flow versus slower flow.

I was being a smartass about the school part;-) The only way to lower the system temperture (equilibrium temperature) is to further cool the water, which can be done with either colder ambient temperatures or with more radiator surface area.

Now as to flow rate, what good does it do to show the heat supply a constant source of "fresh" water if you are not cooling that "fresh" water enough before it is presented to the heat source? NONE

A high flow pump will cool things better as long as you don't exceed the cooling capacity of the radiator. Once you go beyond that point, the water no longer cools off enough before it gets back to the intercooler to remove the same amount of heat as it did the time before. In essence it is still carrying some of the heat from the previous time because it was moving too fast to drop off all the heat in the radiator. This could under extreme cases cause the equilibrium temperature of the system to increase as well.

A low volume pump will actually allow the water to cool more therfore creating more heat transfer into and out of the water. You just can't go too slow otherwise the water saturates with heat quickly and can't absorb anymore way before it exits the intercooler. So there is a balance between what is too much flow and what is too little flow.

I would think if the larger Meziere pump doesn't show much of an decrease it is flowing too much water for the thermal efficiency of the stock heat exchanger. Adding an aftermarket H/E would lower temps and maybe it would be capable of handling the amount of heat transfer needed to make the Meziere pump worth while. :shrug: Only one way to find out :thumbsup:

 

[Fade 2 Black]

I'd imagine that Ford's engineers spec'd out a pump for the flow rate they needed to work with the stock boost level and HE size they had. :idea: Since we all threw that out the window long ago, the only way to find out otherwise is to try.

Speculations aside, the only and ultimate tell of the tale will be the datalogs. I've added that stuff to my list at Summit, thanks!

I'm wondering how this would affect things along with the Icey Res I'm now running.

 

[Kryo-Genik]

I was being a smartass about the school part;-) The only way to lower the system temperture (equilibrium temperature) is to further cool the water, which can be done with either colder ambient temperatures or with more radiator surface area.

Now as to flow rate, what good does it do to show the heat supply a constant source of "fresh" water if you are not cooling that "fresh" water enough before it is presented to the heat source? NONE

A high flow pump will cool things better as long as you don't exceed the cooling capacity of the radiator. Once you go beyond that point, the water no longer cools off enough before it gets back to the intercooler to remove the same amount of heat as it did the time before. In essence it is still carrying some of the heat from the previous time because it was moving too fast to drop off all the heat in the radiator. This could under extreme cases cause the equilibrium temperature of the system to increase as well.

A low volume pump will actually allow the water to cool more therfore creating more heat transfer into and out of the water. You just can't go too slow otherwise the water saturates with heat quickly and can't absorb anymore way before it exits the intercooler. So there is a balance between what is too much flow and what is too little flow.

I would think if the larger Meziere pump doesn't show much of an decrease it is flowing too much water for the thermal efficiency of the stock heat exchanger. Adding an aftermarket H/E would lower temps and maybe it would be capable of handling the amount of heat transfer needed to make the Meziere pump worth while. :shrug: Only one way to find out :thumbsup:

Even with a larger rad or I/C you will still eventually hit equilibrium a larger rad will increase your fluid capacity as well. The equations to figure the stuff out is in that thread, also those guys could probably help shed some light on this for us. Like i said the principal is the same we use but the application is different...unless you look at it from a pure heat>water>air transfer.
But hell ill be more than willing to test out both ways...but I have no way to datalog the coolant temps. our stock pump could be slowed down just simply adding a variable resistor to the power supply....anyone up to trying?