4.0L whipple build, cont'd

[sicfast]

Long story short, started this build 3-4 years ago and lost my job. I'm now in the position to continue the project. Parts wise so far I have:
4.0 whipple crusher
Cp pistons
Oliver rods
Comp xe274bh
Kooks stepped hedders
Magnafuel pro star 625 return kit

On order is a completely new cooling system
ID1700's
Rails


Next plans:
Double key factory crank
Larger crank bolt
Top to bottom ARP hardware
T56 magnum

Other thoughts that have been going through my head:
Aftermarket ecu and which would be ideal?
Ditching the id1700 and going low impedance with an aftermarket ecu.

 

[badcobra]

I'd ditch the Whipple 4.0 and go turbo/auto. Custom cams, Holley EFI, gibtec pistons, teksid block etc. For the price of those injectors alone you could buy a complete Holley HP EFI system.

 

[sicfast]

You're basically telling me to sell everything I've purchased roughly 20k in parts so far turn around spend 30k in parts plus an additional 30k. Did you read what I have purchased, supporting mods about to be purchased and ideas?

 

[sicfast]

Plus I want the instant torque from the 4.0L maxed out.

 

[Nightmare302]

If you want to snap cranks and have zero traction and lose to turbo cars that's cool. After owning a big blower car I'll never go back.

Holley HP would be perfect if just want a street car that puts down a big dyno number.

 

[MalcolmV8]

I can't even imagine how hard you have to spin a 4.0 to get instant torque and power in the mid range.

I spun my 2.9 whipple crusher to 30 PSI with a 4 lb lower and 3.0 upper. Mid range torque on the hit finally felt good.

I then put a 2.3 TVS on with a 4 lb lower and a 2.8 upper and loan behold I had no idea what I was missing out on. Instant mid range torque just went up to a whole new level of fun.

To me it seems if instant hardcore torque is what you're after on the hit the biggest twin screw you can find is not the way to do it.

Not to mention my 2.9 setup broke about 5 or 6 lower pulley assemblies and custom welded up locking plates before I ditched it in fear of it finally taking my crank snout with it.

Here my 2.9 collection was just getting started

Notice one on the left got the threads snapped right off

 

[sicfast]

I can't even imagine how hard you have to spin a 4.0 to get instant torque and power in the mid range.

I spun my 2.9 whipple crusher to 30 PSI with a 4 lb lower and 3.0 upper. Mid range torque on the hit finally felt good.

I then put a 2.3 TVS on with a 4 lb lower and a 2.8 upper and loan behold I had no idea what I was missing out on. Instant mid range torque just went up to a whole new level of fun.

To me it seems if instant hardcore torque is what you're after on the hit the biggest twin screw you can find is not the way to do it.

Not to mention my 2.9 setup broke about 5 or 6 lower pulley assemblies and custom welded up locking plates before I ditched it in fear of it finally taking my crank snout with it.

Here my 2.9 collection was just getting started

Notice one on the left got the threads snapped right off

I will be double keying my crank and using an aftermarket dampener/pulley combo. I would think that should help as well as using a larger crank bolt and ARP hardware.

 

[stangfreak]

You're basically telling me to sell everything I've purchased roughly 20k in parts so far turn around spend 30k in parts plus an additional 30k. Did you read what I have purchased, supporting mods about to be purchased and ideas?

If you did your research before hand, you wouldnt have spent all that money. we are just giving you advice. Read up on how many people removed there 4.0 whipple. Including hardcore guys that race at the track all the time.

If you want BIG power, you need a turbo auto setup. If a 2.9 whipple, 2.8 kb mammoth, 2.3 tvs aren't good enough and you want more power, you then need a turbo. My shop doesnt even recommend 3.4 whipples anymore. They built snake bite. I even spoke to other guys on here who work at other shops across the states and they dont even recommend these blowers. Most will say after a 2.9 whipple, go turbo.

All these big blowers, need to be ran a high high boost. e85. The 3.4 whipple even runs hot. The 4.0 whipple? even hotter. when you read the internet, nobody tells you the horror stories of these setups. It looks GOOD on paper.

without tons of boost or a properly built motor, that instant hit, your not going to get it. My rule of thumb for any twinscrew is 18-19lbs on pump gas to make them run right. Instant hit. These are with the 2.2, 2.3, 2.4 liter blowers. can you get away with it on a 2.8H kb? sure. mammoth? waste of time. 2.8 and higher, I go straight to 20+lbs e85 or race gas. Then you get that violent hit and the car will run hard. My 2.9 is set at 23lbs. I will not run it any lower.

Iv owned a 2.2 kb, 2.3 whipple, 2.8 kb, 2.9 whipple, 3 different ported eatons with every single pulley combo you can think of. I know guys who were going to get FREE blowers and refused bc they didnt want to run big boost or race gas and told me it was pointless to run blower x on low boost and pump gas. The ported eaton got the job done. Just sayin

 

[sicfast]

I will be double keying my crank and using an aftermarket dampener/pulley combo. I would think that should help as well as using a larger crank bolt and ARP hardware.

Also this will be a track only car with very very limited street use.

 

[sicfast]

If you did your research before hand, you wouldnt have spent all that money. we are just giving you advice. Read up on how many people removed there 4.0 whipple. Including hardcore guys that race at the track all the time.

If you want BIG power, you need a turbo auto setup. If a 2.9 whipple, 2.8 kb mammoth, 2.3 tvs aren't good enough and you want more power, you then need a turbo. My shop doesnt even recommend 3.4 whipples anymore. They built snake bite. I even spoke to other guys on here who work at other shops across the states and they dont even recommend these blowers. Most will say after a 2.9 whipple, go turbo.

All these big blowers, need to be ran a high high boost. e85. The 3.4 whipple even runs hot. The 4.0 whipple? even hotter. when you read the internet, nobody tells you the horror stories of these setups. It looks GOOD on paper.

without tons of boost or a properly built motor, that instant hit, your not going to get it. My rule of thumb for any twinscrew is 18-19lbs on pump gas to make them run right. Instant hit. These are with the 2.2, 2.3, 2.4 liter blowers. can you get away with it on a 2.8H kb? sure. mammoth? waste of time. 2.8 and higher, I go straight to 20+lbs e85 or race gas. Then you get that violent hit and the car will run hard. My 2.9 is set at 23lbs. I will not run it any lower.

Iv owned a 2.2 kb, 2.3 whipple, 2.8 kb, 2.9 whipple, 3 different ported eatons with every single pulley combo you can think of. I know guys who were going to get FREE blowers and refused bc they didnt want to run big boost or race gas and told me it was pointless to run blower x on low boost and pump gas. The ported eaton got the job done. Just sayin

It will only be ran on 110 and e98 when it's available.

 

[MalcolmV8]

I will be double keying my crank and using an aftermarket dampener/pulley combo. I would think that should help as well as using a larger crank bolt and ARP hardware.

I run the Innovator West damper myself with the Metco ring on it. I'm in the process of having my crank studded right now to prevent future failures. I suggest you do the same.
I also had my crank and damper double keyed a few years ago.

 

[ctgreddy]

stud the crank, double keyways and do the IW you'll be fine.

for injectors if you wanna do something a little cheaper than ID 1700's you can get dw 1500's or 2000's. both are 1550. Or do like you said, get a set of holley 160lbers and run aftermarket ecu. I've been looking into the ms3 pro which is pretty cheap compared to holley or pro efi with what looks like a lot of the same features.

 

[Weather Man]

Stock terminator intercooler is just hopelessly over matched by the bigger blowers. If you insist on keeping the 4.0 whipple, get the mod malcolm is doing to improve coolant flow through the intercooler.

 

[Nightmare302]

stud the crank, double keyways and do the IW you'll be fine.

for injectors if you wanna do something a little cheaper than ID 1700's you can get dw 1500's or 2000's. both are 1550. Or do like you said, get a set of holley 160lbers and run aftermarket ecu. I've been looking into the ms3 pro which is pretty cheap compared to holley or pro efi with what looks like a lot of the same features.

To be perfectly 100 percent honest. I've known more cars break their cranks than live with a 3.4 or larger pullied down. A less than 50% chance of surviving is not "fine".

 

[im-1]

I run the Innovator West damper myself with the Metco ring on it. I'm in the process of having my crank studded right now to prevent future failures. I suggest you do the same.
I also had my crank and damper double keyed a few years ago.

I'm running double key ati balancer with custom metco hub .
I hope I can safely push the 3.2 kb to its limit

 

[GodStang]

Awesome build. I went through the same hate when I Was building my 3.6L. If you are not building a TVS they will tell you that you are wrong. Good luck and happy building!

 

[im-1]

this is a Photo of the setup if any one interesting

 

[im-1]

Awesome build. I went through the same hate when I Was building my 3.6L. If you are not building a TVS they will tell you that you are wrong. Good luck and happy building!

Did you tuned it ?

 

[stangfreak]

Awesome build. I went through the same hate when I Was building my 3.6L. If you are not building a TVS they will tell you that you are wrong. Good luck and happy building!

I agree with you on the tvs thing. I had my fair share of arguements on here. But the 4.0 is just more of a problem. You have to admit it too. But, its not my car or anyone elses. im sure you remember jakes car what he had to do to make it work. and steves friend who removed his. These are guys that race there cars all the time lol. There the experts. There is a reason why they dont have it anymore.