Bit of a dilemma ...

[V3C1AN]

So I have a dilemma ... Just had an Anderson B21 cam in stalled in my S/C'ed Cobra and hit a little over 400 at the wheels on about 8 lbs. Problem is after the tune a head gasket blew. Now for the dilemma ... Replace both of the old gaskets and reuse the stock GT40 heads or upgrade to some Trick Flows? Generally a no brainer, but I'm unsure on the limit for the block and internals. Keep reading different estimates. I know for the most part it's going to come down to the tune and driving style, but if there's a general numerical limit I should try to remain under please advise. :beer:

 

[buddha93]

Fel Pro 9333-PT-1 Fel-Pro Cylinder Head Gaskets

Great gasket. Don't let the price fool you.

Let me guess, passenger side, right?

 

[V3C1AN]

You got it lol

 

[SLOW5L]

Are you making 400 at the tires with 8 pounds of boost and a stock longblock minus the cam? What blower are you running cause i'm considering keeping my gt40's

 

[buddha93]

Whoops, I actually meant drivers side.......long day at the PC. Generally that's the side that goes lean. Is the head OK?

Anyway, just depends on what way you want to go with the car, your current fuel setup, money, etc. You can safely toss more power up to around 500rwhp, but I personally wouldn't go past that.

 

[V3C1AN]

Are you making 400 at the tires with 8 pounds of boost and a stock longblock minus the cam? What blower are you running cause i'm considering keeping my gt40's

Minus full exhaust, injectors, and a tune yeah. It's a Powerdyne unit. Came on the car when purchased.

Whoops, I actually meant drivers side.......long day at the PC. Generally that's the side that goes lean. Is the head OK?

Anyway, just depends on what way you want to go with the car, your current fuel setup, money, etc. You can safely toss more power up to around 500rwhp, but I personally wouldn't go past that.

Minus the injectors it's still a stock fuel system. I'd like to just do the internals as well, but pulling the motor isn't an option money wise. Just figured swapping the heads, upper and lower intake manifolds, and throwing on an intercooler will be than sufficient for a Sunday funday car for the time being. Provided the bottom end will permit.

 

[buddha93]

The bottom end will hold assuming the tune is good.

Buddy of mine makes a bit shy of 500rwhp with a TFS H/I setup and a Si making about 10psi.

If your going to stay around your current boost level, I wouldn't mess with an intercooler. Slap on the heads, make sure you've got enough pump/injector, and get it retuned.

 

[1slohawk]

I agree with buddha the 9333 gaskets are a great gasket for the money. As for using the stock heads or going to a trickflow I hate putting stock parts back on cars. If it comes off it normally get upgraded. Just make sure you have a safe tune.

 

[V3C1AN]

The bottom end will hold assuming the tune is good.

Buddy of mine makes a bit shy of 500rwhp with a TFS H/I setup and a Si making about 10psi.

If your going to stay around your current boost level, I wouldn't mess with an intercooler. Slap on the heads, make sure you've got enough pump/injector, and get it retuned.

No? Think it'll push it too close to the breaking point or won't make much of a difference with the boost being so low?

I agree with buddha the 9333 gaskets are a great gasket for the money. As for using the stock heads or going to a trickflow I hate putting stock parts back on cars. If it comes off it normally get upgraded. Just make sure you have a safe tune.

I hear ya. Though I didn't expect to be upgrading the top end after having a new k-member, a-arms, steering shaft, and swaybar installed lol. Oh well, guess that's what OT is for.

 

[fivestangs]

Put a 255lph in-tank pump in it while the car is down for new head gaskets (+/- new heads).

 

[buddha93]

No? Think it'll push it too close to the breaking point or won't make much of a difference with the boost being so low?

It's a fine line. There a tons of cars running around with non-forged pistons, boosted, and surviving. So long as the supporting mods and the tune is solid, you should be fine. A set of standard TFS heads will bump you up around 450 rwhp I would think, which shouldn't be too hard to manage. What/who are you tuning with?

If you think about it, you're not in the boost 99% of the time anyway. Mostly crusing, with a WOT blast here and there.

 

[V3C1AN]

Was thinking the intercooler would assist in reducing the chance of detonation.

 

[93Cobra#2771]

I would be more concerned with what caused the HG to fail. Bad tune? Fuel system wigging out?

If you don't figure out what caused the HG to die in the first place, you may get to see it again.

 

[V3C1AN]

When i brought the vehicle in i was advised once the cam was installed it began to see approximately 3+ more lbs. of boost and a little over 400 at the ground. They stated they changed the tune and brought it to about 390 at the ground whereupon they found the engine was getting a little hot before the gasket failed. I'm simply assuming the issue was caused from a minor detonation due to excessive heat and added lbs. of boost on 20 year old weak gaskets. An intercooler was suggested to help reduce the temp.

 

[93Cobra#2771]

What kind of cooling setup do you have? If it was getting hot, an intercooler will only doctor the problem.

Was the a/f in pretty good shape?

 

[V3C1AN]

No aftermarket cooling system. Unsure of the a/f. Wasn't able to be there for the tune due to work.

 

[93Cobra#2771]

Your dyno sheet should have the a/f logged. If not, I would be very careful until you can do another run with a/f logged. A/f log will tell a lot of things during the tune.

If the car looks like it has the original rad, I would highly suggest upgrading or at the very least checking the system out.

Cooling was marginal on these cars when stock, let alone with the HP levels you are putting out.

If it has an efan on it, it is very likely it isn't moving enough air. Most efans simply can't move enough air. There are exceptions, of course.

 

[buddha93]

When i brought the vehicle in i was advised once the cam was installed it began to see approximately 3+ more lbs. of boost and a little over 400 at the ground. They stated they changed the tune and brought it to about 390 at the ground whereupon they found the engine was getting a little hot before the gasket failed. I'm simply assuming the issue was caused from a minor detonation due to excessive heat and added lbs. of boost on 20 year old weak gaskets. An intercooler was suggested to help reduce the temp.

I disagree with that adivse in many ways. To Richards's point, why was it getting hot? 8psi will create some heat, but nothing that can't be managed with an OEM cooling system.

Intercoolers are great, but at that boost level, not really needed. It's possible you had some detenation, which caused the gasket to fail, but if the tune is right, you shouldn't be experiencing that.

 

[93Cobra#2771]

Bingo

If your previous cam had a TON of overlap, you could pick up some boost, it's all dependant on the timing events, of course.

I'm betting you had some detonation (which, btw, will cause the temp spikes) and that is what the HG failure came from.

My biggest concern is that you don't go through the trouble of putting new HG on and then getting on it first time and dropping another HG.

I HIGHLY suggest getting the HG on, then going straight to a shop that will log a/f and MAKE SURE that you aren't running out of fuel and to also make sure you don't have too much timing.

 

[V3C1AN]

Don't have the car or dyno sheet atm as it is still at the shop. The shop just informed me the car was actually at 10 lbs. when the temp. in the intake spiked above 200 (more than likely causing the detonation). A heat exchanger was suggested.

The car does still have the stock radiator and fan.