At a crossroads with my Cobra. Its a mostly stock 98. Looking for 360-400whp NA. Needs to be reliable and withstand track days as well as traffic jams on the way. I figured a used F150 coyote swap would run me $6k ish doing the work myself. I do already have an f150 motor here. So do I bite the bullet and do it or keep the 4.6 4v and build it? I dont need any more than 400whp. Driveability and service-ability are BIG for me. A/C is a must. The PBH accesory kit looks kind of janky to me. I hate working on homemade engine swaps with ratty wiring and inaccesible service parts! Can the Coyote FRPP control pack offer 100% OEM level driveability? Thanks
Coyote swap Vs. NA 4.6
- Thread starter Brandnelson
- Start date
I guess I could add 5.4 4v in too. More torque and less revs would be nice, as well having a mostly OEM install. I have a Navi motor, was my original plan before I realized what a PITA the intakes are and adding 100lbs of motor doesnt seem like a great idea on an already front heavy car. Help a brother out! Experience is the best teacher and I have none with Mod motors. My last track car was 2800lbs and 380whp and this 3400lb Cobra feels like a slug!
Search this thread, there is at least a coulee of Coyote swaps and 1 Gt500 swap (5.4, 4v). That will give you some idea of what to expect. There is also a member here you should seek ou, NASVT. He is good at getting that kind of power out of your current motor.
To me, I would mod the 4.6 for more power (NA).
Here is a 5.4 swap. http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?1003340-94-Cobra-07-GT500
Here is a Coyote swap from a guy who road races...http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?1012783-American-Iron-Coyote-Cobra-Swap&highlight=Coyote
There is more, just search!
To me, I would mod the 4.6 for more power (NA).
Here is a 5.4 swap. http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?1003340-94-Cobra-07-GT500
Here is a Coyote swap from a guy who road races...http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?1012783-American-Iron-Coyote-Cobra-Swap&highlight=Coyote
There is more, just search!
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For $6,000 for a Coyote swap I'd much rather swap some 03/04 cylinder heads and a set of cams into a 4.6 and be like $3,500 ahead after its all said and done. That will get you to your desired power level and you won't have to mess with the "janky" accessory drive setups or wiring issues.
Thanks fellas! Trust me ive read and searched for weeks. I read mystic's thread, the entire 4v na dyno thread.. I see few guys getting in the high 300s na, especially with the b head. Is it possible or is a head swap neccesary? If I need to do a stroker and a head/intake swap to 03/04s I think id be better off just swapping the Coyote. Maybe someone can chime in that has a 400whp na 4.6? Nasvt seems to be the expert at least on the forums, maybe give me an idea of what a 400whp 4.6 looks like?
Something interesting I saw at the Roush museum last summer
Had b heads judging from the casting numbers. Also had 8 Escort throttles, injectors spraying 90 degrees to the intake path, and supposedly 600hp@8250rpm. Had smarter looking headers in the dyno photograph, I wouldn't read too much into the ones in the pic.
Had b heads judging from the casting numbers. Also had 8 Escort throttles, injectors spraying 90 degrees to the intake path, and supposedly 600hp@8250rpm. Had smarter looking headers in the dyno photograph, I wouldn't read too much into the ones in the pic.
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I went from 467whp from a vortech 4.6 to coyote swap and I don't regret it a single minute. Way better power feel, reliability, room to grow. Nothing about the control pack is janky, it's not a hard swap and it's going to raise the value of your car unlike a bolt on 4.6 will
Do the factory gauges work? How much hacking of the wiring was needed if any?
Good point on the resale value, I could sell the 4.6 for a couple bucks too. Did you keep your AC?
Edit: Nevermind. I read your swap thread. Stock pan too, cool!
Edit: Nevermind. I read your swap thread. Stock pan too, cool!
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Yep all gauges work and are accurate. The swap really isnt that bad, Did it all in a friends garage without a lift. There are obviously some things you will run into that you have to figure out how to make work but it's really not that hard. Took our time and it took around 6-8 weeks from start to finish. That was the suspension, rear end etc too.
Yep I used the stock pan, I read too much crap with the aftermarket ones that I didn't like and I talked to a few friends who run coyote stock and they have to use the stock pan and it was much more simple to get it to work than the aftermarket pan. A/C is there, never unhooked it or PS. But I have to finish the wiring on the A/C, It is wired like factory so it doesn't know the engine is running, so I need to tie it into the new PCM just haven't worried about it since it's not really hot here
As far as "how much wire hacking"... I would say that it is up to you. The control pack will run the engine stand alone with just a connection to the existing ignition switch, fuel pump, tach and vehicle speed wiring.
I wanted to integrate the new with the old wiring more than was strictly necessary, for things like the check oil and low coolant lights, cooling fan control, fuel pump control and some other things, so I spent more time with the wiring that some.
I have to get the A/C line made that runs between the condenser and evap, but after that the A/C *should* work with the factory wiring after I remove the WAC input from the CCRM.
I wouldn't call the PBH brackets "janky" at all.
I wanted to integrate the new with the old wiring more than was strictly necessary, for things like the check oil and low coolant lights, cooling fan control, fuel pump control and some other things, so I spent more time with the wiring that some.
I have to get the A/C line made that runs between the condenser and evap, but after that the A/C *should* work with the factory wiring after I remove the WAC input from the CCRM.
I wouldn't call the PBH brackets "janky" at all.
How are you planning on wiring the A/C up? That's my issue, I never unhooked the A/c, but I left the factory wiring, but the issue is the A/C won't turn on because it doesn't realize that the engine is running so it won't kick on. I'm assuming I'll need to tie it into the new control pack wiring?
My vote is Coyote swap.
You could get a Coyote Truck engine from a junkyard, a stock intake for about free, and the PBH Kit for starters.
The cool thing about the Coyote swap is that it will add much more value to your car if it is done nicely. That will heavily outweigh the initial cost of entry.
You could get a Coyote Truck engine from a junkyard, a stock intake for about free, and the PBH Kit for starters.
The cool thing about the Coyote swap is that it will add much more value to your car if it is done nicely. That will heavily outweigh the initial cost of entry.
My A/C wiring remains just as it did from the factory. I plan to disconnect the WOT A/C cutoff wire from the CCRM (which is pin 22 on my 96 CCRM). I have tested this without the engine running and the A/C clutch coil energizes with the A/C selector knob in the appropriate positions, and cycles with the pressure switches appropriately. Of course, the A/C will operate regardless of the throttle position, engine overheating, etc with this arrangement. I still have not made the A/C line I need, so I cannot confirm that it will operate 100% acceptably.
According to the Ford Racing tech I spoke with, all of the A/C wiring and circuitry in the FRPP control pack is just a ruse, a holdover from other applications that share the PDB and harness that the Coyote control pack uses. So, it appears that it would take some doing to get WOT A/C cutout functionality.
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