High boost TVS guys in here please

[c6zhombre]

Scenario A is if you have an aftermarket built motor.....and are going to run E85 near 100% of the time.....bump the compression from the factory 8.5/1. That way you can spin the blower lower rpm in it's efficiency range and still make insane power/tq.

Now the one nice thing about spinning the blower really hard....sound. The blower sound of mine going from 17psi to 22psi is gigantic. It just screams at 22....it's really quiet 17. Doesn't make the same sound at all.

 

[Black02GT]

Scenario A is if you have an aftermarket built motor.....and are going to run E85 near 100% of the time.....bump the compression from the factory 8.5/1. That way you can spin the blower lower rpm in it's efficiency range and still make insane power/tq.

Now the one nice thing about spinning the blower really hard....sound. The blower sound of mine going from 17psi to 22psi is gigantic. It just screams at 22....it's really quiet 17. Doesn't make the same sound at all.

Yeah, I went from 8.5 to 9.5. I wanted more but I was worried if the E85 became more scarce I'd have to run Torco, Race Gas or be limited to ~15 psi on 93.

If you look of ModFords someone has a nice write up on boost vs compression and IIRC going from 8.5-9.5 only nets the about 1 psi worth of power increase but limits you on max boost which isn't a big deal on E85. Although you can run less boost and have lower IAT you still have high cylinder temperatures.

 

[Soap]

I know in summer time while cruising down the highway 120 degree IAT2s are common with temps in the 90's. I don't drag race and usually just burst through a gear or two so I'm not a good example to give what IAT2's are for a long sustained pull. I've messaged my buddy to comment on this thread as he has a tvs 3.0 upper 4lb lower and has done some drag racing this summer.

Malcolmv8 is running a 4lb lower with a 2.8 upper and knows a lot about IAT2's so he's another good source. I know Malcolm had insane heat from his 2.9 Crusher which I believed would produce less heat because its a more efficient blower when spun faster. You also hear of 3.4 and 4.0 guys complaining of insane heat which has kind of lead me to believe that all the blowers are going to make a ton of heat. Its just part of it.

Thanks for the info. I sent WaffleMan a message but haven't heard back form him, maybe he will chime in.

I speak to Malcolm rather often but I don't think his car is even up and running right now so no info to share.

I am running a 3" upper and 2# lower (like 20psi) on E-85 and I have Justins IC mod. About the only thing I could do any better right now is get a GT500 sized heat exchanger (like Malcolm did).

--Joe

 

[94slowbra1]

i love reading malcolms post. hes always using new tech and constantly documenting all the changes. but im not sure his car can be used for comparison to us "common folk". built motor, big cams, custom computer ect...

soap: how do you like justins i/c set up? what parts are you using (pump, tank, h/e ect...) any before and after numbers?

 

[cj428mach]

Thanks for the info. I sent WaffleMan a message but haven't heard back form him, maybe he will chime in.

I speak to Malcolm rather often but I don't think his car is even up and running right now so no info to share.

I am running a 3" upper and 2# lower (like 20psi) on E-85 and I have Justins IC mod. About the only thing I could do any better right now is get a GT500 sized heat exchanger (like Malcolm did).

--Joe

Malcolm was running his TVS on his car for a while before tearing it down for a rebuild. At that time he had a more stockish intercooler system.

 

[Soap]

soap: how do you like justins i/c set up? what parts are you using (pump, tank, h/e ect...) any before and after numbers?

I do not have before and after numbers. I did the intercooler system the same time I did the TVS swap.......this is why I am wondering what the typical IAT2's are for people and how mine compare.

I have a trunk mounted tank with dual pass HE and all 1" lines and only 1 fitting in the whole system. I was using a Davies Craig pump but just switched to a modded EMP.

--Joe

 

[c6zhombre]

It gets to over 100+ degrees here with lots of humidity during the summer.

I know in summer time while cruising down the highway 120 degree IAT2s are common with temps in the 90's. I don't drag race and usually just burst through a gear or two so I'm not a good example to give what IAT2's are for a long sustained pull..

I'm very surprised you don't have anymore data than this. 120 cruise IAT2 is all you have? Where's the WOT 3rd and 4th gear pull logs so you can tune?

 

[Black02GT]

I do not have before and after numbers. I did the intercooler system the same time I did the TVS swap.......this is why I am wondering what the typical IAT2's are for people and how mine compare.

I have a trunk mounted tank with dual pass HE and all 1" lines and only 1 fitting in the whole system. I was using a Davies Craig pump but just switched to a modded EMP.

--Joe

So what kind of numbers are you seeing?

 

[whitedevil95]

So what kind of numbers are you seeing?

I wanna know too ^^^

I wish I could help more but im just a KC guy.

 

[MalcolmV8]

Joe your cooling is definitely much better than I was seeing with the TVS but I understand it's not as cool as you were wanting.
I assume that last log you sent me the car was just warmed up and not heat soaked yet as the IAT2 started out at 90 cruising, 100F on the hit and was 118 at the top of the pull.
Those are pretty amazing numbers but I'd say drive around a bit, perhaps 15 ~ 20 minutes stop and go driving etc. then do another pull and lets see what those IAT2s look like. Also try shutting the car off for 10 minutes and then come back and try again. The heat soak makes a big difference.

My prior TVS combo was 2.8/4 lb setup on a 10.5 CR motor and my IAT2s were around 140F all the time, cruising down the roads, making pulls etc. If I'd hammer on it hard and rip through the gears a few times back to back without giving it a break it should shoot to 160F + real quick. That was with a stock intercooler setup, LFP heat exchanger, stock pump, True Forged reservoir and a killer chiller.

I noticed the 2.9 and 3.4 Whipple cars I've tuned on Justin's cooler mod seem to run lower IAT2 temps at WOT than the TVS. I have no idea why as my 2.9 Whipple Crusher setup put out more heat WOT than the TVS but less heat in cruise. The 2.9 crusher was on a 3.0 / 4 lb pulley combo. One theory I have is possible placement of the IAT2 sensor on the TVS and it heat soaking? I'm really not sure yet. More testing is needed.

My current setup is a 12.0 CR motor, TVS 2.8/4 lb and Justin's intercooler mod, AFCO GT500 heat exchanger with 1" bungs welded on, trunk tank, 1" ID lines, EMP pump at 25 amps. I'd love to see how it cools but I hurt my back a few months ago and not playing with car till I get better.

 

[cj428mach]

I'm very surprised you don't have anymore data than this. 120 cruise IAT2 is all you have? Where's the WOT 3rd and 4th gear pull logs so you can tune?

Honestly I could care less about IAT2 most of the time.

They are what they are and with e85 its not a real concern. I rarely beat on my car during summer because of the loss in performance so if I do its just a quick hit and done.

I also feel its pointless to look at IAT2's unless you've been cruising for a long time to get maximum cooling before making a hit. To me thats the only way to test any real gain. I can tell you that a quick hit through a gear usually jumps IAT2's about 6-8 degrees but then it immediately begins to start coming down as the cooler fluid is working back into the system.

 

[cj428mach]

One theory I have is possible placement of the IAT2 sensor on the TVS and it heat soaking? I'm really not sure yet. More testing is needed.

Always full of interesting ideas/theories. Definitely something I wouldn't have thought of and something to be considered.

 

[c6zhombre]

Honestly I could care less about IAT2 most of the time.

They are what they are and with e85 its not a real concern. I rarely beat on my car during summer because of the loss in performance so if I do its just a quick hit and done.

I also feel its pointless to look at IAT2's unless you've been cruising for a long time to get maximum cooling before making a hit. To me thats the only way to test any real gain. I can tell you that a quick hit through a gear usually jumps IAT2's about 6-8 degrees but then it immediately begins to start coming down as the cooler fluid is working back into the system.

Hmmm....I'd say it's pretty important to see it, even with E85, and 99.99% of owners/tuners will be interested in it since it's such an easy pid to log. I never start logging until well into a drive, at least 6-7 miles. And that has nothing to do with IAT2, I'm more concerned with all the fluids, particularly oil, to be up to temp before I hammer a 3rd and 4th to redline. Maybe you've just never taken 4th to redline before. It's not easy to do that on public roads lol...it's a lot easier in mexico

 

[Soap]

So what kind of numbers are you seeing?

I wanna know too ^^^

Sorry, not trying to be secretive here, was just busy earlier. As Malcolm said most of my pulls I get a 30* rise in temps from the hit until I let off. Haven't made a full pass yet as we are still working on the tune. I absolutely will report back as soon as I go to the track.

--Joe

 

[Soap]

I assume that last log you sent me the car was just warmed up and not heat soaked yet as the IAT2 started out at 90 cruising, 100F on the hit and was 118 at the top of the pull.
Those are pretty amazing numbers but I'd say drive around a bit, perhaps 15 ~ 20 minutes stop and go driving etc. then do another pull and lets see what those IAT2s look like. Also try shutting the car off for 10 minutes and then come back and try again. The heat soak makes a big difference.

That is correct, I didn't have time to go for a long ride so that log was after only a 10 minute drive, so no heatsoak, just got that info once the thermostat opened.

I did some logging last night with full heat soak and my IAT2's were starting in the 120* range (it was 82* out). This was after a 30 mile drive, then sat idling for a while, then went back out. Got home and my infrared gun said the blower case was over 240*.

--Joe

 

[94slowbra1]

So your saying that your iat1 is around 120 and after a pull you are at around 150? And this is with the cooling mods?

 

[Soap]

So your saying that your iat1 is around 120 and after a pull you are at around 150? And this is with the cooling mods?

If my car is not heat soaked and I make a pull I will see a 20-30* rise in IAT2 (depends on other factors). With the car heatsoaked (like last night when IAT2 was 120* at idle) I made a pull and it only rose 20* to 140*.

I just got back from datalogging and my IAT2's went from 106* to 122* during a WOT log.

--Joe

 

[c6zhombre]

If my car is not heat soaked and I make a pull I will see a 20-30* rise in IAT2 (depends on other factors). With the car heatsoaked (like last night when IAT2 was 120* at idle) I made a pull and it only rose 20* to 140*.

I just got back from datalogging and my IAT2's went from 106* to 122* during a WOT log.

--Joe

Well, without any before data under similar weather conditions, there's no way to tell if the new ic improvements are making a big difference or not. However....just looking at your current data it looks damn good and I'd say you have zero issues to worry about as far as your IAT2. What would be a real test is to see the data at a drag strip after a few consecutive passes and little cool down time....that will test the system for sure. If you never climb over 150 IAT2 on consecutive runs, I'd be seriously impressed.

 

[MalcolmV8]

If my car is not heat soaked and I make a pull I will see a 20-30* rise in IAT2 (depends on other factors). With the car heatsoaked (like last night when IAT2 was 120* at idle) I made a pull and it only rose 20* to 140*.

I just got back from datalogging and my IAT2's went from 106* to 122* during a WOT log.

Those numbers seem really good but the reason Joe's digging into this for those that don't know typically with Justin's intercooler mod you see temps lower during a pull and not go up. Yes you read that right.
I'll see IAT2 temps around 130 ish on a heat soaked car cruising and when they go WOT it'll instantly drop to around 112 ~ 114 and then drop another 2 ~ 8F through a pull. It's very impressive. All the logs though I've seen and worked with were 2.9/3.4 whipple cars. Joe's is the first TVS car I've seen with this mod and unsure why he's not seeing the same results.

 

[c6zhombre]

Those numbers seem really good but the reason Joe's digging into this for those that don't know typically with Justin's intercooler mod you see temps lower during a pull and not go up. Yes you read that right.
I'll see IAT2 temps around 130 ish on a heat soaked car cruising and when they go WOT it'll instantly drop to around 112 ~ 114 and then drop another 2 ~ 8F through a pull. It's very impressive. All the logs though I've seen and worked with were 2.9/3.4 whipple cars. Joe's is the first TVS car I've seen with this mod and unsure why he's not seeing the same results.

wow, thats crazy, i've never heard of that. Interested to see why Joe's isn't reacting the same....but I'd like to look into this Justin IC mod regardless