legal advice

[2004 REDFIRE]

I have a legal question and if this is the wrong section to post it, I apologize and please move to proper place. The question I have is: Am I legally obligated to pay the body shop for work being done to my car?

This is the story.... I dented my car awhile back. I took it to a body shop I used in the past. The damage wasn't too much over my deductible so I decided to just pay for all off it myself and not involve insurance company. Well I set up appt with shop for April 9th. Got there that day and owner said he was swamped and couldn't get to the car til later in the week. I offered to just come back on April 16th if that would be better for him. He said it would be great if I would do that. So I just came back on 16th. He said he needed for the week (be done Friday night or Saturday morning). Today is currently the 34th straight day he's had it. he has offered several excuses as to why its not done and was always told "another day or two". I always said "you don't need to explain anything to me, you know your job way better than I do." I never acted like it was a problem because this was a cash transaction and i knew customer service for these types of deals aren't gonna be excellent. But the final price would be better. He always stated my car would be covered and cared for. I stopped by a couple of weeks go to get my garage door opener out of car. My car was not covered, dust and dirt was all over my floor and drivers seat and they had a filthy sponge laying on deck lid, oozing something all over it. I didnt say much except "I guarantee the car will be spotless when its done."

I asked a few times for an estimate for doing the work (fix the dent, repaint both bumpers, hood and side skirts). (I drive a lot on interstate so the rock chips are killing my paint). He has always said "he hasn't gotten a chance to put numbers together and he'd call me back later that day with some figures, but he'd do me right." This has never happened. So I was told last Monday May 7th, the car would be finished by Thursday and he failed to meet that deadline again. I never set any of these deadlines, never did I demand to be his number one priority. I called on Monday of this week, cause I never heard from him last week telling me it was finished. I called his cell and business phone. He wouldn't answer ither so I left a message stating " Tom, its been a month to do a five day job. Just bolt my car back together. Ill be there tomorrow morning after work around 9:30." He never called back but, he sent me a text... "Slow down, I'm painting it now. It'll be done in a day or two." I replied "ill wait a couple more days." So now its Friday and no car. I do plan on paying him something but legally do I have to pay what he's asking? I thought I'd give him half of it. I never got an estimate or signed a work order. I do feel money is owed but something must be deducted for not making my car somewhat of a priority when it was agreed it would be a 5 day process and it has taken (if done today) 7 times longer than he claimed it would take.

Sorry for it being this long and if you made it this far, thank you in advance. I want to do the right thing as far as paying my debt but what is really acceptable on both sides?

 

[svtcop]

You're obligated to pay for services/work provided.

If it's still not finished just pay for the work done up to this point and send a tow for your car. Have another shop finish it.

Don't go back and don't refer anyone to that place.

Next time you should have an estimate properly done and the work scheduled with a reputable shop. You short cutting is what got you into this mess in the first place.

Lesson learned? Move on

 

[2004 REDFIRE]

You're obligated to pay for services/work provided.

If it's still not finished just pay for the work done up to this point and send a tow for your car. Have another shop finish it.

Don't go back and don't refer anyone to that place.

Next time you should have an estimate properly done and the work scheduled with a reputable shop. You short cutting is what got you into this mess in the first place.

Lesson learned? Move on

So how exactly is the work preformed thus far calculated? And I send Cooter, the tow truck driver, to pick up a car that is in pieces and haul to another body shop? I stated above Ive used this gentleman in the past, with no problems. So how did you come to the assumption he was unreputable? And SVTCOP you've always paid full retail/union wages for all things ? This was not a short cut. Ive used him in the past. This was cash vs. insurance rate increase transaction. Thank you for your input SVTCOP but, please never post again in this thread as you added nothing except....yeah. Nothing. Have a wonderful day doing what you do.

 

[FordSVTFan]

You're obligated to pay for services/work provided.

If it's still not finished just pay for the work done up to this point and send a tow for your car. Have another shop finish it.

Don't go back and don't refer anyone to that place.

Next time you should have an estimate properly done and the work scheduled with a reputable shop. You short cutting is what got you into this mess in the first place.

Lesson learned? Move on

Exactly.

So how exactly is the work preformed thus far calculated? And I send Cooter, the tow truck driver, to pick up a car that is in pieces and haul to another body shop? I stated above Ive used this gentleman in the past, with no problems. So how did you come to the assumption he was unreputable? And SVTCOP you've always paid full retail/union wages for all things ? This was not a short cut. Ive used him in the past. This was cash vs. insurance rate increase transaction. Thank you for your input SVTCOP but, please never post again in this thread as you added nothing except....yeah. Nothing. Have a wonderful day doing what you do.

He is not reputable based on his current actions and that is why you should never refer someone to him nor use him yourself.

In general you can have things: fast, cheap, or good. Pick any two.

It is a short cut not going through your insurance company who would protect you and make sure your car was treated properly, plus it would give you a solid avenue of recourse.

Lastly, If you dont want input from members here you shouldnt post here.

Just because you dont like his answer doesnt mean it isnt spot on.

BTW, whatever he says you owe is what you owe since you didnt get a written estimate. If you take the vehicle without paying in full you can be charged criminally for theft of services. If he isnt willing to negotiate your only option is to pay his bill and then take him to court. That is your free legal advice of the day.

 

[2004 REDFIRE]

Pick any 2? I had all 3 throughout my previous transaction with said body shop. How is not have an insurance company pony up $200 and me $1000 a short cut? I own my cars. They cut me a check on the spot for damages. (Minus deductible) My question was am I legally responsible to pay a body shop who I have no written/signed agreed with the full asking price when they took 7 times longer than agreed? The answer I received was I was obligated to pay for work thus far completed. That still doesn't answer how do we come to that said amount? I paid for 2 days of work that took 34? I asked what I was legal for with no written contract. Svtcop gave me lesson learned? I've used him in past with zero problems. Great work and delivered my suv to my door when finished. I'm not here to argue but he gave no good advice. He gave .......fordsvtfan....your last paragraph was legal advice that I do appreciate. Opinions and assumptions are completely worthless. Thank you for the last paragraph. That was the legal obligation I was looking for. No written contract=he can charge whatever cause I didn't put a cap on it.

 

[FordSVTFan]

Pick any 2? I had all 3 throughout my previous transaction with said body shop. How is not have an insurance company pony up $200 and me $1000 a short cut? I own my cars. They cut me a check on the spot for damages. (Minus deductible) My question was am I legally responsible to pay a body shop who I have no written/signed agreed with the full asking price when they took 7 times longer than agreed? The answer I received was I was obligated to pay for work thus far completed. That still doesn't answer how do we come to that said amount? I paid for 2 days of work that took 34? I asked what I was legal for with no written contract. Svtcop gave me lesson learned? I've used him in past with zero problems. Great work and delivered my suv to my door when finished. I'm not here to argue but he gave no good advice. He gave .......fordsvtfan....your last paragraph was legal advice that I do appreciate. Opinions and assumptions are completely worthless. Thank you for the last paragraph. That was the legal obligation I was looking for. No written contract=he can charge whatever cause I didn't put a cap on it.

He can charge you basically whatever he wants and you cant take the vehicle without paying or without a court order. If you do, you can be charged criminally. If you dont like his price, pay him and take the vehicle and then take him to court. Or dont pay and let the vehicle stay there and take him to court.

You clearly do not care to objective evaluate the information given to you because you dont want to consider your actions wrong. But you were wrong for not getting a written estimate. You were wrong for not affording yourself the protections of going through your insurance company. You were wrong for not protecting yourself.

Lesson learned. :shrug:

 

[2004 REDFIRE]

I think a few are confused on the question. What he charges isnt the problem. So an estimate is irrelevant. I asked can i legal pay less than he's asking for not completely the job anywhere close to the time we agreed on? If i must pay that cost to legally take back my car, OK. I will pay the man his final price if an agreeable lower amount can not be reached. I asked what my legal obligations were with the given information? That was the original question I was hoping to get answered from LEOs on this forum. Most of what was posted had nothing to do with the legality of a verbal agreement that had gone south. I asked for legal consequences of not paying in full. To the "then don't ask for input" statement, how much of what you've read was actual legal obligation? And how much was derogatory "shame on you" comments? All legal obligation input was desired and all non-legal obligation input was not solicited or necessary.

 

[DaleM]

Legal advice? Get a legal expert. I know them as lawyers but some lawyers take umbrage to the term and prefer attorney.

 

[megameGT500]

OP,
I think what you are asking for is what a judge would be able to answer while viewing evidence from both sides. No one here can give you the answer you are LOOKING for but svtcop (a LEO) and FordSVTFan (a smart guy with MANY law credentials) are giving you the answer you need to keeping yourself out of jail / bad situation worse and to fight this with you in the best light possible. I'm just being the disinterested third party to try to keep you from getting frustrated with the answers you're receiving. They're the best you're going to get and as pointed out, no cost.

I think a few are confused on the question. What he charges isnt the problem. So an estimate is irrelevant. I asked can i legal pay less than he's asking for not completely the job anywhere close to the time we agreed on? If i must pay that cost to legally take back my car, OK. I will pay the man his final price if an agreeable lower amount can not be reached. I asked what my legal obligations were with the given information? That was the original question I was hoping to get answered from LEOs on this forum. Most of what was posted had nothing to do with the legality of a verbal agreement that had gone south. I asked for legal consequences of not paying in full. To the "then don't ask for input" statement, how much of what you've read was actual legal obligation? And how much was derogatory "shame on you" comments? All legal obligation input was desired and all non-legal obligation input was not solicited or necessary.

 

[COBRA_ESQ]

Am I legally obligated to pay the body shop for work being done to my car?

it was agreed it would be a 5 day process and it has taken (if done today) 7 times longer than he claimed it would take.

I never set any of these deadlines.....It'll be done in a day or two." I replied "ill wait a couple more days."

I asked can i legal pay less than he's asking for not completely the job anywhere close to the time we agreed on?

I asked for legal consequences of not paying in full. All legal obligation input was desired.

Assuming you can prove the "5 day process" was agreed upon, I suspect he will differ and it will be your word against his, you renegotiated the time when you agreed, about a month later that "ill wait a couple of more days". And further assuming that he agreed that he would get it done in a "couple of days (what ever that means) and not another 5, 7, 10 ....days, you might have a case.

Then there is the question of damages. It could be found that an extra 10? days is not overly significant compared to the 30+ days that was eventually agreed. Still you may be able to collect your actual out of pocket costs to rent a car for the days beyond the extended agreed upon delivery date. Unless you drove another car you owned or one you borrowed, then it would appear you have no damages.

Pay the bill, get the car back and write it off to experience.

If the work is not complete and you pay more than work is worth to get the car back, read the prior responses to your post, the information given is helpful and not irrelevant especially since "All legal obligation input was desired" and your post raised many legal issues which members here were kind enough to identify and address.
.

 

[2004 REDFIRE]

I do thank all of you for your input/advice. I was hoping maybe one of you had run into these sort of situations personally/professionally. The cost of damage was barely over deductible according to dealer estimate. I only went to dealer to get an idea of cost. I went to this body shop due to prior great transactions with him. He had said he would do it for less than the amount dealer wanted. Hence the insurance company had no obligation for work performed totaling less than my deductible. I have no doubts his work is good and price will be fair. I was only asking if I am legally able to pay less if he admits to saying he only needed it for 5 days and yet it was 35? I believe that since we had prior interactions he took me as a friend type customer and not a business type customer. But again thank you. And sometimes you get what you pay for as far as free advice is concerned.:beer: