Legal precedence for resisting unlawful arrest?

[Zinc03Cobra]

heh... this thread wins.

Can we get a CopBlock forum in Smackdown?

 

[mc01svt]

In this particular case it was telling her to put out her cigarette. She escalates from there by not following his lawful orders.

This is where you're wrong. Legal experts on both sides of the fence have all agreed that the officer doesn't have power to tell you put a cigarette out, stop cursing, stop scratching your balls, stop frowning, stand on one leg..etc just for the sake of exerting control over an individual. :read:

In addition, it is also not legal for an officer to remove a person from their vehicle without REASONABLE cause. And within reason doesn't mean during a routine traffic stop where the individual's license/tag/insurance are valid and up to date, no outstanding warrants and no perceivable threat exist.

the principal issue here is whether not being "nice" is grounds for a strictly retaliatory arrest. People aren't "nice" to me at my job everyday but that doesn't mean i have the right to harass them for spite or rough them up abit. :smmon:

 

[roushed50]

That cop was a complete asshole

 

[roushed50]

I'm going to light you up

 

[01cobravortech]

What was outrageous? Making someone exit their vehicle who was belligerent and non-compliant? That entire, tiresome video shows a real bitch whose actions look to have escalated what should have been a rather uneventful traffic stop into something much worse. As someone who dislikes cops I've been pulled over a few times and still have zero tickets in 22 yrs of driving and I can assure you it wasn't thanks to calling the cop Sir (because I refuse to do that)but rather because we both acted like normal adults. He records as do I and I also realize the side of the road isn't a courtroom.

Its interesting how you refer to that woman. A real bitch huh? Big deal she doesn't want to put out her cigarette and a 'failure to signal' is grounds for removing someone from their vehicle?

Yea you dislike cops alright. You also seem to dislike BLACKS a whole lot too. In fact, you seem to like to rush to the aid of whites being 'victimized' but maybe when its one of these 'black bitches' or 'black ghetto people', they somehow have less importance to you.

Police don't have a right to abuse people on the side of the road because the motorist doesn't sound like a groveling imbecile, terrified of their orders.


Maybe the officers involved in this case, should expend that energy towards real criminals that pose a danger to the local citizens in that jurisdiction.

She shouldn't have acted like a jackass in the first place.
She already broke the law once with the failure to signal. That is probable cause to allow the cop to do whatever else he deems necessary to protect himself and others. In this particular case it was telling her to put out her cigarette. She escalates from there by not following his lawful orders. This unlawful conduct continues until she is cuffed and stuffed for resisting arrest and assault on an officer. All this escalation means she's already NOT doing what 99.9% of any normal person would do, which is simply to comply with the officer's demands.

At what point did she screw up? Right when she failed to signal. Everything from there is on her for her unwillingness to comply and escalation of the situation AFTER she had already broken the law. She is at fault, no ifs, ands, or buts. That was a good arrest in my book.

Of course the media stirs up the idiocratic majority in this country and the next thing you know we have "OMG she was arrested for failing to signal!", and "the cops killed her in jail all because of failure to signal!".

Yes Robbie those 'failure to signal' people are rather dangerous. Thankfully one of the boys in blue took that woman into custody. And thankfully the miscreants that he works with, helped her check out of this world, with some half baked justification on their end why they needed to kill her. Because people HAVE NO RIGHT ANYMORE, to even answer back to a police officer right?


I see people all the time run stop signs and red lights. Have even seen cops sit on the side of the road and not make a move. Drop the 'failed to signal' argument. Some cops simply have a big problem with people that are black or that don't look 'American' or as a 'law abiding citizen' as they perceive those phrases. And what really is important here is the type of response being INITIATED by police because they don't like how US CITIZENS, respond to them at a traffic stop. Citizens in this country have rights. I think maybe you seem to forget that. Its what has always made America a special place to live in. You know, not like all those '3rd world, hell holes' like so many of us like to quip about like its a fact.


A woman ends up dead over a stop that results from a 'failure to signal.'


Please you are a lot smarter than you are pretending to be. Its outrageous in this country, that someone could mysteriously end up dead over a minor traffic infraction as that.

Its even more comical considering we have people on this site, who openly talk about cops pulling them over doing +100mph, and they walk away with a warning. They don't even get the same treatment as Ms. Failure to Signal. LMAO

 

[Deceptive]

Its interesting how you refer to that woman. A real bitch huh? Big deal she doesn't want to put out her cigarette and a 'failure to signal' is grounds for removing someone from their vehicle?

Yea you dislike cops alright. You also seem to dislike BLACKS a whole lot too. In fact, you seem to like to rush to the aid of whites being 'victimized' but maybe when its one of these 'black bitches' or 'black ghetto people', they somehow have less importance to you.

Police don't have a right to abuse people on the side of the road because the motorist doesn't sound like a groveling imbecile, terrified of their orders.


Maybe the officers involved in this case, should expend that energy towards real criminals that pose a danger to the local citizens in that jurisdiction.




Yes Robbie those 'failure to signal' people are rather dangerous. Thankfully one of the boys in blue took that woman into custody. And thankfully the miscreants that he works with, helped her check out of this world, with some half baked justification on their end why they needed to kill her. Because people HAVE NO RIGHT ANYMORE, to even answer back to a police officer right?


I see people all the time run stop signs and red lights. Have even seen cops sit on the side of the road and not make a move. Dropped the 'failed to signal' argument. Some cops simply have a big problem with people that are black or that don't look 'American' or as a 'law abiding citizen' as they perceive those phrases.


A woman ends up dead over a stop that results from a 'failure to signal.'


Please you are a lot smarter than you are pretending to be. Its outrageous in this country, that someone could mysteriously end up dead over a minor traffic infraction as that.

Its even more comical considering we have people on this site, who openly talk about cops pulling them over doing +100mph, and they walk away with a warning. They don't even get the same treatment as Ms. Failure to Signal. LMAO

Yay! More SVTP race baiting.

People kill themselves for little or no reason at all every single day. It is reported that Bland had a history of suicidal thoughts and the autopsy backed the report that she committed suicide and that there was no signs of foul play.

Again, a person wanting to be a martyr! What a ****ing shocker. Most likely another weak individual that had a worthless life and wanted her 15 minutes of fame. To think that an individual would not act in the manner she did to provoke the officer and in turn commit suicide to spark more protests and racial divide is a joke. Now, I am not saying she did but, this certainly has to be an explorable avenue to explain this thanks to the liberal medias desire to demonize police and white people.

 

[zerocool]

Its interesting how you refer to that woman. A real bitch huh? Big deal she doesn't want to put out her cigarette and a 'failure to signal' is grounds for removing someone from their vehicle?

Yea you dislike cops alright. You also seem to dislike BLACKS a whole lot too. In fact, you seem to like to rush to the aid of whites being 'victimized' but maybe when its one of these 'black bitches' or 'black ghetto people', they somehow have less importance to you.

Police don't have a right to abuse people on the side of the road because the motorist doesn't sound like a groveling imbecile, terrified of their orders.


Maybe the officers involved in this case, should expend that energy towards real criminals that pose a danger to the local citizens in that jurisdiction.




Yes Robbie those 'failure to signal' people are rather dangerous. Thankfully one of the boys in blue took that woman into custody. And thankfully the miscreants that he works with, helped her check out of this world, with some half baked justification on their end why they needed to kill her. Because people HAVE NO RIGHT ANYMORE, to even answer back to a police officer right?


I see people all the time run stop signs and red lights. Have even seen cops sit on the side of the road and not make a move. Drop the 'failed to signal' argument. Some cops simply have a big problem with people that are black or that don't look 'American' or as a 'law abiding citizen' as they perceive those phrases. And what really is important here is the type of response being INITIATED by police because they don't like how US CITIZENS, respond to them at a traffic stop. Citizens in this country have rights. I think maybe you seem to forget that. Its what has always made America a special place to live in. You know, not like all those '3rd world, hell holes' like so many of us like to quip about like its a fact.


A woman ends up dead over a stop that results from a 'failure to signal.'


Please you are a lot smarter than you are pretending to be. Its outrageous in this country, that someone could mysteriously end up dead over a minor traffic infraction as that.

Its even more comical considering we have people on this site, who openly talk about cops pulling them over doing +100mph, and they walk away with a warning. They don't even get the same treatment as Ms. Failure to Signal. LMAO

Hell you've gotten even crazier. I didn't know that was possible.

Having you, CSD and Drew back is an asylum being breached.

 

[Deceptive]

Hell you've gotten even crazier. I didn't know that was possible.

Having you, CSD and Drew back is an asylum being breached.

Arkham

 

[BoostedByV]

So what if the lady acted like a jackass or made comments that maybe weren't prudent at the time. We don't live in a country where police can treat US citizens like they're in some kind of war zone dealing with an identified enemy. These kind of over reactions by police are very troubling

:thumbsup:

 

[Klay]

Come on guys, it is the same story in all of these threads.

The same people that get angry over the government violating their rights with flag removals, gun limitations, socialist politics are the same one that come into these threads and tell you to give up your rights and just accept unlawful arrests. hahahaha

It should just be normalcy to accept an unlawful arrest, mortgage the house to pay a bondsman, lose your job for long nights in jail, and have a criminal record over an officer's ego. I mean come on, it is just soooooo easy to suck it up and go to court and let the friends of the force decide your fate.

give me a break.

You are 100% right. Every one of these threads the same people claim to just do whatever the officer says. While that may be prudent advice, that isn't the way they respond to any other infraction upon our liberties. It's funny how often the quote by Benjamin Franklin gets used around here "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety" for gun control, state rights, etc. etc., yet they never apply it to police officers.

The question proposed in the OP is not asking what you shoud do to make life easier or prevent yourself from being killed, it is asking what is the right way based on the constitution and law. The fact that resisting an unlawful arrest is not even a viable option should be concerning for anyone who values the rights afforded in the constitution.

 

[01cobravortech]

Hell you've gotten even crazier. I didn't know that was possible.

Having you, CSD and Drew back is an asylum being breached.

LOL

You get a degree in geology and now you so boldly post like you're a pall bearer for truth or even understanding what goes on in reality at a police stops.

LOL. Go away little boy. Little Barneys like you concern me a great deal actually. You are just the shills that come out of college not even knowing what country you walk into. Its actually quite sad. Because you live in a state, where us northern people look for hope. But you're just another one of those joker that thinks, "hey Bro I have a specialized degree...I know what I'm talking about..."

Seriously GTFO.


Jade Helm 15 should roto rooter your consciousness a bit, at least I would hope so, because you haven't a clue as to what is going on little boy, with geology degree.

LOL

 

[cbj5259]

Guess this will be SD bound soon...

 

[ViperRed91GT]

This is where you're wrong. Legal experts on both sides of the fence have all agreed that the officer doesn't have power to tell you put a cigarette out, stop cursing, stop scratching your balls, stop frowning, stand on one leg..etc just for the sake of exerting control over an individual. :read:

In addition, it is also not legal for an officer to remove a person from their vehicle without REASONABLE cause. And within reason doesn't mean during a routine traffic stop where the individual's license/tag/insurance are valid and up to date, no outstanding warrants and no perceivable threat exist.

the principal issue here is whether not being "nice" is grounds for a strictly retaliatory arrest. People aren't "nice" to me at my job everyday but that doesn't mean i have the right to harass them for spite or rough them up abit. :smmon:

I don't know what legal experts you've been following, but I guarantee you that a LEO can articulate the need for the cigarette to be put out, as it can be used as a weapon. It's also a very common cover of weed, thus interfering with his investigation (her autopsy showed significant amounts of marijuana, I think we have a winner). Pennsylvania v Mimms already upholds the officers right to have her exit the vehicle, so that too was a lawful order. You act like she was arrested for the cigarette, let's just completely ignore that she kicked him while he was lawfully removing her from her vehicle...

Do I agree with how he handled the situation? No. Should he have said what he did? Absolutely not. But let's not completely absolve the woman of her own actions that resulted in her being arrested.

 

[cbj5259]

I don't know what legal experts you've been following, but I guarantee you that a LEO can articulate the need for the cigarette to be put out, as it can be used as a weapon. It's also a very common cover of weed, thus interfering with his investigation (her autopsy showed significant amounts of marijuana, I think we have a winner). Pennsylvania v Mimms already upholds the officers right to have her exit the vehicle, so that too was a lawful order. You act like she was arrested for the cigarette, let's just completely ignore that she kicked him while he was lawfully removing her from her vehicle...

Do I agree with how he handled the situation? No. Should he have said what he did? Absolutely not. But let's not completely absolve the woman of her own actions that resulted in her being arrested.

You mean personal responsibility? How dare you suggest that!

 

[01cobravortech]

I don't know what legal experts you've been following, but I guarantee you that a LEO can articulate the need for the cigarette to be put out, as it can be used as a weapon. It's also a very common cover of weed, thus interfering with his investigation (her autopsy showed significant amounts of marijuana, I think we have a winner). Pennsylvania v Mimms already upholds the officers right to have her exit the vehicle, so that too was a lawful order. You act like she was arrested for the cigarette, let's just completely ignore that she kicked him while he was lawfully removing her from her vehicle...

Do I agree with how he handled the situation? No. Should he have said what he did? Absolutely not. But let's not completely absolve the woman of her own actions that resulted in her being arrested.

Yes the cigarette could have maybe lit the fuse for a deadly firecracker that blew off a finger for MR. JPP of the NY Giants or it could have set off a tactical nuke carried by this dangerous woman. Its anyone's guess at this point.

Wiley E. Coyote could have also had a trail of gun powder lined up to her vehicle...jeopardizing the safety of this remarkable human being...

 

[ViperRed91GT]

Yes the cigarette could have maybe lit the fuse for a deadly firecracker that blew off a finger for MR. JPP of the NY Giants or it could have set off a tactical nuke carried by this dangerous woman. Its anyone's guess at this point.

Wiley E. Coyote could have also had a trail of gun powder lined up to her vehicle...jeopardizing the safety of this remarkable human being...

Or it could be thrown at someone's face... But yea, let's detract with ludicrous examples. :dw:

Funny how fast you move from firmly standing your ground to deflecting when facts are presented

 

[derklug]

It all comes down to picking your fights. Sometimes it is just easier to go with the police and fight it out later. Ok, to be honest , it is always better to comply and fight it out later. You should only assert your rights on the side of the road if you think that A) There is no chance of the officer killing you... or B) You are guilty as hell and the officer will have to violate your rights to prove it.

 

[cbj5259]

Having had a few cigarettes flicked in my face during various encounters... it is severely distracting at the least, and if the lit end hits skin it's not pleasant.

 

[SolarYellow]

Its interesting how you refer to that woman. A real bitch huh? Big deal she doesn't want to put out her cigarette and a 'failure to signal' is grounds for removing someone from their vehicle?

Yea you dislike cops alright. You also seem to dislike BLACKS a whole lot too. In fact, you seem to like to rush to the aid of whites being 'victimized' but maybe when its one of these 'black bitches' or 'black ghetto people', they somehow have less importance to you.

Police don't have a right to abuse people on the side of the road because the motorist doesn't sound like a groveling imbecile, terrified of their orders.


Maybe the officers involved in this case, should expend that energy towards real criminals that pose a danger to the local citizens in that jurisdiction.

This guy calls it like he sees it and believe me, I don't make any apologizes for doing so. She acted like a bitch. Plain and Simple! A relatively minor infraction occurred and she blows a common sense fuse. What is the result? The race card is being pulled. Although you are falling for it, rest assured, I am not.

The narrative today being pushed by the media and certain other groups is that each and every time a white cop has a negative interaction with a black person, it is always the result of a racist, overzealous cop. You're smarter than subscribing to that line of thinking.

Yes the cigarette could have maybe lit the fuse for a deadly firecracker that blew off a finger for MR. JPP of the NY Giants or it could have set off a tactical nuke carried by this dangerous woman. Its anyone's guess at this point.

Wiley E. Coyote could have also had a trail of gun powder lined up to her vehicle...jeopardizing the safety of this remarkable human being...

For whatever reason you are starting to resemble the female in question with how irrationally you are acting. Cool down a bit and think about a lit cigarette rationally.

 

[Zerohe]

Interesting points being made on every side here. But to release all suspicion and move things along- I just record the stop and comply. Im not there to make a point and get shot or tackled to the ground. I dont buy into the race baiting, but I have to acknowledge that there are racist cops out there. I have run into them in the town I lived in of 4 years. On multiple occasions I have rode with someone that was speeding and wearing no seatbelt and we got pulled over, but they get a warning and I get a citation. This has happened twice with my girlfriend, two other times with another person that was white.

Shes driving my car, but I get asked for my ID and a full background check on the side of the road. They dont ever once ask her for Registration or Proof of Insurance. They dont find it odd that this little white woman is driving this loud, brash and fast Mustang with another male in the car and give her the sexist line of" I dont see a woman owning a car like this?"
I got popped almost a year ago for failure to signal, (2AM leaving the bar, not a drop to drink, following someone making sharp turns on an empty road getting half-assed directions from the passenger at the last minute.) the cop had me get out of the car, pat me down, and step to the side and search my vehicle for more than 5 minutes for "a weapon or anything sharp that could hurt him". I dont even keep anything in my Cobra except a clean gymbag with fresh clothes. He was literally looking for nothing in an empty, freshly detailed car with nothing to sift through. I was too clean, and suffered a very similar stop at 5am returning home that morning.
This is a direct result in a town so disproportionately white, when you see someone not white, you're like "Oh wow that guy is black!" Yeah. Record,Record,Record and Comply,Comply,Comply.