So when is the next generation "R" model coming out ?? I sure like the power the 03 is making, but it doesn't have the mystique of an "R." I sure would like to see a new R come out to claim top dog status again.... by being over the top and have an abundance of horsepower... is it asking for too much...
New Cobra R
- Thread starter SL 1993 R
- Start date
I would like to see an R that is actually built to be competitive in a race class. I like the 00R but it's VERY uncompetitive in any race class that is placed in.
The 93R was a great first step. I am actually amazed that the 93R ever came about considering it was the last year of a body style. I think the 95 R is a great example of what a true R should be. A car specifically built to be competitive in a race class and also look awesome on the street.
They got it half right with the 00R.
The 93R was a great first step. I am actually amazed that the 93R ever came about considering it was the last year of a body style. I think the 95 R is a great example of what a true R should be. A car specifically built to be competitive in a race class and also look awesome on the street.
They got it half right with the 00R.
Blown V8
New Member
Absolutely nothing looks more awesome than an 00 R coming or going down the street. No other Ford has ever had the presence, or evil-look that those cars have. And, yes, I felt that way BEFORE I bought one! Drive one, you will realize they got it ALOT more than half "right!"
Just my eleven cents...Jeremy
Just my eleven cents...Jeremy
Good point Mark. Does anyone know of any 2000's that are actually being raced. Or are they just falling into the catagory of a suped up car for the streets. Granted a number of 93's and 95's became garage queens, but at least some were raced. Are any 2000's out there competing ???
BRIMSTONE
New Member
From what I've heard, there were a couple 00 R's racing competitively in SCCA but were soon humbled by Z06's. I have already seen a Z06 take first in a race on speedvision - over the top NSX (supercharged).
I know there is an 00 R that is running endurance races, but don't know how successful he is. I think possibly the cost and lack of parts for the 00 R makes it less likely for a team to try and race it ?
Mike
I know there is an 00 R that is running endurance races, but don't know how successful he is. I think possibly the cost and lack of parts for the 00 R makes it less likely for a team to try and race it ?
Mike
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There are several issues with racing the 2000 R as I see it....
1) exclusivity - The sheer low numbers and the exclusivity of this car make it undesirable to go flogging on a race track, even though I disagree with your assessment that it is only half ready is incorrect. I have had a very good road race driver behind the wheel of mine at Hallet and saw him do amazing things with this car!!
2) cost - I for one would rather start with a normal street Mustang to make a racer out of. Why chance a one of only 300 car on the race track?? Open track is a different story though, as many of us here open track our cars. Too much fender banging though in real racing for me to chance my car in that environment
3) weight - The R weighs too much to really be competitive against cars like the Z06. The Z06 is 600 pounds lighter, is more nimble because of its lighter weight and is also lower to the ground with a lower center of gravity.
In summary, although I would love to do ONE race at some point in my R just to give it some "pedigree"... I will likely never chance totalling my car in that environment. I would much rather get an inexpensive used Cobra and strip it down and make it track worthy... less money and you could always find another one real cheap in case you get into a bad wreck during the race.
Oh and by the way, those of us who actually track our R's (a small number) can safely say this is one helluva track car!! Can a Z06 probably take us if it has a good driver?? probably so?, but not by much... which is amazing given its weight disadvantage relative to the Vette?!!!
1) exclusivity - The sheer low numbers and the exclusivity of this car make it undesirable to go flogging on a race track, even though I disagree with your assessment that it is only half ready is incorrect. I have had a very good road race driver behind the wheel of mine at Hallet and saw him do amazing things with this car!!
2) cost - I for one would rather start with a normal street Mustang to make a racer out of. Why chance a one of only 300 car on the race track?? Open track is a different story though, as many of us here open track our cars. Too much fender banging though in real racing for me to chance my car in that environment
3) weight - The R weighs too much to really be competitive against cars like the Z06. The Z06 is 600 pounds lighter, is more nimble because of its lighter weight and is also lower to the ground with a lower center of gravity.
In summary, although I would love to do ONE race at some point in my R just to give it some "pedigree"... I will likely never chance totalling my car in that environment. I would much rather get an inexpensive used Cobra and strip it down and make it track worthy... less money and you could always find another one real cheap in case you get into a bad wreck during the race.
Oh and by the way, those of us who actually track our R's (a small number) can safely say this is one helluva track car!! Can a Z06 probably take us if it has a good driver?? probably so?, but not by much... which is amazing given its weight disadvantage relative to the Vette?!!!
Andy,
I would have to disagree with you on the exclusivity of it... They only did 107 1993's and 250 1995's. Yet more of these seem to of made it to the track then the 2000's. Do you think that part of the reason that 2000's didn't get raced was that anyone could buy them. (no racing license required).
I would have to disagree with you on the exclusivity of it... They only did 107 1993's and 250 1995's. Yet more of these seem to of made it to the track then the 2000's. Do you think that part of the reason that 2000's didn't get raced was that anyone could buy them. (no racing license required).
Blown V8
New Member
Oh, sure, and how many people who bought the 93 Rs actually had the license, and were buying the car for themselves (to go race), instead of for one of their collector-buddies, who didnt carry a license? We all know that probably less than 20 total (per year) EVER saw any competitive track time from 93 or 95. The other 85 or so ended up in collectors hands. Ford finally figured out that it didnt matter if you had a license or not; they were inevitably gonna end up in collectors' hands...regardless of the reasons they were built/intended for! Who cares if there are less, or none of the 00 R's being raced?...you can't force someone who spent $60K plus (or $30-$40 on a 93-95) to beat the crap outta their cars! I agree with the idea of building a cheaper stripped down Cobra, as apposed to beatin' the hell outta mine! :bash:
What are we gonna turn this into, and arguement about which one is the rarest? I think we all know the answer to the production numbers of these cars by now.
Which one is the most unique to date, and carries the greatest amount of parts, greatest level of performance, etc, etc? I think we know the answer to that too. Which one was the first, the pioneer, the father of the Rs; we know that answer too! They were all awesome, neat, low production cars; theres no need to argue which one is the "most exclusive" though!!!
We are a group of approximately 657 total cars!!! (or less, everyday..as they are crashed, {raced??}etc!). How many other cars/car clubs/brands can claim that overall rarity? Lets keep that overall prospective in mind too!
Jeremy
What are we gonna turn this into, and arguement about which one is the rarest? I think we all know the answer to the production numbers of these cars by now.
Which one is the most unique to date, and carries the greatest amount of parts, greatest level of performance, etc, etc? I think we know the answer to that too. Which one was the first, the pioneer, the father of the Rs; we know that answer too! They were all awesome, neat, low production cars; theres no need to argue which one is the "most exclusive" though!!!
We are a group of approximately 657 total cars!!! (or less, everyday..as they are crashed, {raced??}etc!). How many other cars/car clubs/brands can claim that overall rarity? Lets keep that overall prospective in mind too!
Jeremy
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Guys,
I think you are taking what I am saying wrong. I believe that the 00R is one of the best Mustangs ever made both on the street and on the track but I do not think it fully stands for what the Cobra R is (at least in my opinion). The R stands for Race. First and for most I believe that the R's purpose should be to win races. It should be as light as possible, handle as well as possible, and have as much power as possible while still being competitive in a race class.
The 93 and 95R's were built according to SCCA and IMSA rules of the time. Both of these cars were built to be raced first and be street cars second. Although the 95 was far more successful at the race part the 93R was a good learning experience for the guys at Ford. The 95R was a winning right out of the box and I'm sure down the road the 95R's will be the 65 Shelby R models of the 90's.
I have driven many R's from all the different years and even had the opportunity to drive all three on the same day and I realized something interesting. When you drive them back to back to realize that the 93 and 95 R's are definitely race cars first and street cars second. both will work your kidneys over VERY quickly. The 00R on the other hand is a car you could drive every day. In fact I had the opportunity to drive a friends 00R for a week (thanks Dave!
) and I realized the car was very civilized. Almost to civilized when compared to the other two. It's not a fault but it is definitely a different car than the 93 and 95R's.
In no means am I trying to put down the 00R but I think that SVT got caught up in building the ultimate Mustang and forgot what the R designation actually meant.
Hope that clears things up.......
I think you are taking what I am saying wrong. I believe that the 00R is one of the best Mustangs ever made both on the street and on the track but I do not think it fully stands for what the Cobra R is (at least in my opinion). The R stands for Race. First and for most I believe that the R's purpose should be to win races. It should be as light as possible, handle as well as possible, and have as much power as possible while still being competitive in a race class.
The 93 and 95R's were built according to SCCA and IMSA rules of the time. Both of these cars were built to be raced first and be street cars second. Although the 95 was far more successful at the race part the 93R was a good learning experience for the guys at Ford. The 95R was a winning right out of the box and I'm sure down the road the 95R's will be the 65 Shelby R models of the 90's.
I have driven many R's from all the different years and even had the opportunity to drive all three on the same day and I realized something interesting. When you drive them back to back to realize that the 93 and 95 R's are definitely race cars first and street cars second. both will work your kidneys over VERY quickly. The 00R on the other hand is a car you could drive every day. In fact I had the opportunity to drive a friends 00R for a week (thanks Dave!
) and I realized the car was very civilized. Almost to civilized when compared to the other two. It's not a fault but it is definitely a different car than the 93 and 95R's.In no means am I trying to put down the 00R but I think that SVT got caught up in building the ultimate Mustang and forgot what the R designation actually meant.
Hope that clears things up.......
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Steve,
While I agree with what Jeremy said about the exclusivity of ALL of the R's (all 3 production runs), I also know and understand why you probably won't see any 2000 R's on the race track any time soon...
1) most of them are in the hands of collectors and/or folks who won't risk them at the track. Heck, our illustrious moderator has TWO of them, and doesn't run either one very much on the track. hehe.. Brian, I couldn't resist! :bash:
2) COST!!! - at $50K+ it is too expensive for someone to go beat up on the track... alot cheaper to find a used street Cobra and strip it down
3) WEIGHT - I am certain you could get a street Cobra down to close to 3000 pounds??
So, I stand by my assessment that you will likely never see many 2000 R's (at least not in the near future?) on the race track in REAL races.
Your point about the other two versions (93 and 95) being more raw race cars first, then street cars second is correct. I agree with you on this one. I think the SVT folks knew this though when the 2000 R came out and could therefore command a higher premium on the car knowing that folks would not race it much, but in fact collect them and drive occasionally on the street.
However, they are ALL worthy to be on the track with other cars!! IMHO!!
While I agree with what Jeremy said about the exclusivity of ALL of the R's (all 3 production runs), I also know and understand why you probably won't see any 2000 R's on the race track any time soon...
1) most of them are in the hands of collectors and/or folks who won't risk them at the track. Heck, our illustrious moderator has TWO of them, and doesn't run either one very much on the track. hehe.. Brian, I couldn't resist! :bash:
2) COST!!! - at $50K+ it is too expensive for someone to go beat up on the track... alot cheaper to find a used street Cobra and strip it down
3) WEIGHT - I am certain you could get a street Cobra down to close to 3000 pounds??
So, I stand by my assessment that you will likely never see many 2000 R's (at least not in the near future?) on the race track in REAL races.
Your point about the other two versions (93 and 95) being more raw race cars first, then street cars second is correct. I agree with you on this one. I think the SVT folks knew this though when the 2000 R came out and could therefore command a higher premium on the car knowing that folks would not race it much, but in fact collect them and drive occasionally on the street.
However, they are ALL worthy to be on the track with other cars!! IMHO!!
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Blown V8
New Member
Andy, perfect response to the subject at hand!
Oddly, your post number is currently at the EXACT count of Cobra R's produced! How ironic!!!! Its currently at 657....somehow I found some humor in that! (its late, ya know?).....Jeremy
Oddly, your post number is currently at the EXACT count of Cobra R's produced! How ironic!!!! Its currently at 657....somehow I found some humor in that! (its late, ya know?).....Jeremy
BRIMSTONE
New Member
I haven't been involved enough with the other R's to comment from experience, but from reading the magazine articles comparing the 3 R's with each other, even racing them against each other, the 00R will defeat it's predecessors.
I read an article that the 00R was designed to run in the Motorola Cup? Anyone know about this?
Mike
I read an article that the 00R was designed to run in the Motorola Cup? Anyone know about this?
Mike
I caught a Grand-Am race on Speedvision a couple weeks ago and there was a 00R running. Of course I couldn't tell if it was real but it did have the hood and spoilers. I went through the Grand-Am results page and they show that car being run by CMA Sports. I've searched the web for info on the team and have come up empty. At first I was suprised to see a 00R actually racing but to top that the sponsor was Ciber, the parent company of my employer... Now I just need to find out who signs those checks so I can talk them into sponsoring one of their own employees...
No offense taken. I have run one R on the track just about half the events I have ran, but I will not run it in the rain so that is where my 01 comes in.
As some of you may or maynot know, I just bought Deans 95 R a few weeks ago.
The 95's in my opinion are more fun to drive on the track for a person with my experience. The torque of that engine is so much easier to drive and is much more forgiving on tighter tracks. I do love driving both R's, but for pure fun factor, I give the knod to the 95.
With a capable driver, i do believe the 00R has the ability to go faster, but I don't think that is being questioned here.
I love them all, they are the funest cars I have ever owned.
:beer: :beer:
Why did Dean sell his R? I haven't seen him around lately......
Hmmmm, where should I begin.:shrug:
When I originally bought my R, my plans were to just open track it and go to several schools. The more I tracked it, the more I got hooked and also the more money I spent on it. It seems like I was never going to get to the point where I was completely satisfied with the handling or speed. I kept going from one upgrade to the next upgrade and it kept getting faster and faster.
Well, with speed brings another problem called wrecking.
No matter how careful you are, it can and eventually will come up and bite you. Everytime I was in the car, I would push it so I knew that sooner or later something would happen. Yes, I make a good living but I can not afford to trash a $30K car. I have been thinking about selling it for quite awhile but it really convinced me when I found myself worrying about the car more than I should. It's just not fun for me to tippy toe around a track. For those that have gone to enough track events, you see plenty of carnage and that will really make you think.I have a pretty tolerant wife but I know if that car would have been wrecked, my open tracking days would be over. That is something I do not want to happen. For those that have tracked their cars, know what I am talking about here. It's like a drug that you just can't put down.
Another reason is that I want to get into the NASA American Iron series and I do not want to race the R wheel to wheel. It's just too risky for me. If I put a scratch on my track car, I don't want to have to worry about it.
If I would have done it over, I would have bought a '95R that had already been tracked and beat. It would have been a helluva lot less money in the long run.
The Rs are an awesome car but you can build something faster, handle better and cost you a helluva lot less than they do. Was it really cool to track a R?? Hell yes but the guy in the '90s LX that just blew your doors off could care less what you're driving. I'll miss the R and all the stuff that goes with it but this time I had to follow my head and not my heart.
I'm in the process of getting another track car so if anyone knows of one, please let me know.:thumbsup:
Originally posted by Cobra-R
You ever seen him drive???? He should be riding a bicycle instead of a car.
At least you would have a fighting chance. :loser: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Dean,
I hear exactly what you are saying. I came to the point with my street 93 Cobra and bought a theft recovery 93 Cobra (I love 93 Cobra!!) to turn into a track only car. Then my 93R came along and it was actually cheaper to buy this car that had been fully modified (by someone with ALOT more money than I had) than to build the car the I had. So I sold my theft recovery car and bought the finished R. I had always wanted a 93R and this was the perfect way to kill two birds with one stone. Yes I always worry about putting it into a wall but I'm having to much fun!!! (at least that's what I will say until I DO put it into a wall!!) I do have to admit it is fun to watch someone look over the car first when they realize it's a real Cobra and then when they realize it's a Cobra R. Typical statement is "I can't believe you ruined a Cobra R!" to which I respond, "and never driving it isn't doing the same thing?".
I was hoping you were going to come down to IRP this year so we could mix it up a bit but I guess I'll have to find someone else to prey on......
Dean, if you haven't started building a car yet give me a call as I have some information on something in the works you might be interested in getting in on that should suit your needs very nicely!
Mark Wilson
93 Cobra's
I hear exactly what you are saying. I came to the point with my street 93 Cobra and bought a theft recovery 93 Cobra (I love 93 Cobra!!) to turn into a track only car. Then my 93R came along and it was actually cheaper to buy this car that had been fully modified (by someone with ALOT more money than I had) than to build the car the I had. So I sold my theft recovery car and bought the finished R. I had always wanted a 93R and this was the perfect way to kill two birds with one stone. Yes I always worry about putting it into a wall but I'm having to much fun!!! (at least that's what I will say until I DO put it into a wall!!) I do have to admit it is fun to watch someone look over the car first when they realize it's a real Cobra and then when they realize it's a Cobra R. Typical statement is "I can't believe you ruined a Cobra R!" to which I respond, "and never driving it isn't doing the same thing?".
I was hoping you were going to come down to IRP this year so we could mix it up a bit but I guess I'll have to find someone else to prey on......
Dean, if you haven't started building a car yet give me a call as I have some information on something in the works you might be interested in getting in on that should suit your needs very nicely!
Mark Wilson
93 Cobra's
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Dean,
Email or PM me asap! I know of a great track car you can get for only $20K. A friend of mine in Dallas has it for sale.
Email or PM me asap! I know of a great track car you can get for only $20K. A friend of mine in Dallas has it for sale.
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