Predator fuel problems

[speedtigger]

So far i have seen 3 predators on the dyno. all three have a calibration problem above 5000 rpm. it goes way rich (10-1)
it actually makes less power than stock above 5k.

anyone else dyno'd a predator installation?????

 

[gnxs]

Originally posted by speedtigger
So far i have seen 3 predators on the dyno. all three have a calibration problem above 5000 rpm. it goes way rich (10-1)
it actually makes less power than stock above 5k.

anyone else dyno'd a predator installation?????

I had (have) the same issue. I'm debating on spending $$$ for a complete dyno tune or just getting a whipple (in which case I'll need a tune anyway).

When I dynoed I had catback, cold-air and pulley with predator tune. Before the second run I leaned the 4k-7k fuel by 1% and the 2k-4k fuel by .5% Look at my A/F on both runs.

Here a link to my two pulls:

Dyno Runs

As you can see the HP # is way low. Power also died at 5,300 rpms. I didn't have an idler pulley or TR6 plugs at the time. Maybe the belt was slipping.:shrug:

I added an Idler and the NGK TR6s gapped at .038. I also swapped the Kenne Bell Ram Air out and replaced it with a K & N FIPK. I'll be going again soon. I have boost and fuel pressure gauges now, so I can see if those read OK during the pulls.

 

[Black306]

Yup, I had the same problem.

DYNORUN.004 = Steeda CAI and 3" Ultraflow cat-back
DYNORUN.005 = same mods as .004 + Predator "91 Octane Performance Tune"

 

[speedtigger]

yup, thats what all the dyno pulls i have seen look like.
the bad part is that DIABLO is not owning up to this. they say that no one has had this problem but me.:cuss:

the diablo employee that sold me my custom tune said that they are all like this, then recanted later when i asked diablo to pay for the custom tune.........
:bash:

it's a shame really because they are on the cutting edge with thier handheld. not getting involved early and getting the proper tunes out there is gonna make alot of sct and hypertech sales.

people just don't want to pay $400.00 for a tuner and then pay another $300.00 to have a custom tune built.

ps the whipple prospect is very exciting. let us know when that goes on!!!!!

 

[davidwhitt]

I am a bit frustrated with my Predator as well. The Performance tune with no adjustments made my car very lean - air/fuel did not drop below 15 until 5000 RPM - it was still 13 at 6200 RPM - my only other mods were the basics - K&N FIPK, Magnaflow high flow cats with X-pipe and Magnaflow catback. By the time I added fuel I was only up 3 to 7 horspower at any given RPM level over my non-Predator runs - disappointed to say the least.

Chris of Diablo posted on another site that adding 10% fuel (left toward Rich) would drop air fuel by 10% (e.g., from 15 to 13.5 was a similar example he used) - I added only 5% since I had not seen his post and my 15 went to 12.9 at 5000 RPM - strange because the 5% only dropped my 13.5 at 6000 RPM to 12.5

Does anyone understand the impact on air/fuel of adding each 1% of fuel as you move left towards Rich? I am now running between 12.4 and 13 for most of my RPM range and would like to get it down a bit without going too far towards Rich. My readings came from a Dynojet sniffer.

By the way, caught up with Chris of Diablo today on the phone and he seemed miffed by my problem above - not good. They do have a 30 day return policy which I am seriously considering.

 

[Chonger]

I have the original version (pre R12). 15% meant 1 full point. The "canned pulley tune" sucked some serious hairy balls. It was very lean in the midrange and went totally rich up top. Mine was like 13.3:1 in the midrange and dropped to 11:1 after 4,500.

I ended up getting a custom tune. Car runs puuurrffect now. I pulled 458/483 SAE.

 

[SinisterX]

Thats's why you buy a Predator from a chipmaster who sends you a custom tune w/ the Predator purchase.

 

[Chucko]

Car: Second run '03 Cobra (YDH1 Computer). Ford "Stall Fix" flash. Predator r12d, running 93 octane "Performance Tune".

Mods: Magnaflow CB, K&N FIPK, and Predator. That's it. Stock Pulley.

5 Pulls on the Dynojet Dyno about 10 days ago. Best HP 432 SAE. Best Torque 405. 4 of the runs were better than 429/400 SAE.

I ended up adding 15% fuel (rich) in the 2-4k RPM range and 3% fuel (rich) in the 4-7k RPM range. All other values unchanged.

You can find the dyno charts here:

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=482370

Thank you Diablosport.

Better than 430RWHP/400RWTQ SAE on a stock pulley!! :beer:

 

[speedtigger]

Thanx for the info chuck. we need as many diablo people to post thier a/f's as possible so we all know the score.

the 3 cars i have seen on the dyno all had r12d's

you have similar if not the same mods as the cars i have seen tested yet yours worked. did you buy yours new???? who did you buy it from????


everyone who has dyno'd a predator please respond!!!:beer:

 

[Jay03GT]

I had a predator. A/F was ok until 5500 where it promptly disappeared of the bottom of the scale, never to return. I now have a Superchips flasher. Picked up 35hp and 30 tq, same dyno, same day, no changes.

 

[fiorefiveoh]

i have the same a/f curve with my predator, bought it when it first came out, doesnt have any software updates. last dyno i did with the pulley tune, leaned out 15% was still off the charts rich (under 10.0) from 4500-6000 rpms. once i get my clutch in i am going to update my predator and hit the dyno, see if i can lean out the top half of the graph. with what the updates should do, it should work fine. i have no problem with my predator.

 

[BenD]

Predator Problems

It's upsetting to read these problems, because I depend on my Predator to produce accurate results.

I am just about to buy the Wide Band Commander so I can monitor my A/F and then adjust the fuel with the Predator

I was hoping that I could eliminate the expense of going to the Dyno for every little change.

 

[DOHC03]

My predator dyno is here (old version, pre R12):
www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Node/6160/dyno1.jpg
www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Node/6160/dyno2.jpg

It was real rich but still made good power, mods in sig. I think theres too many variables for them to have a perfect tune out of the box for everyones car.

 

[Chucko]

Originally posted by speedtigger
Thanx for the info chuck. we need as many diablo people to post thier a/f's as possible so we all know the score.

the 3 cars i have seen on the dyno all had r12d's

you have similar if not the same mods as the cars i have seen tested yet yours worked. did you buy yours new???? who did you buy it from????


everyone who has dyno'd a predator please respond!!!:beer:

I purchased my Predator new from a local tuner here in the Northwest, but I did not get any custom tunes with it, since my mod list was pretty slim. I always thought I'd wait till I added a pulley and plugs to spring for a custom tune.

I really did nothing special. Stock 93 octane "Performance Tune" with fuel added. Actually, the car made good power without the added fuel, but was too lean down low.

My car is a weekend driver, and the local gas here is 92 octane. I normally add a can of NOS octane booster every time I fill up just to be on the safe side. Most of the octane booster stuff is real crap, but the NOS stuff comes highly recommended so I started using it. I was not seeing any pinging before using it - it's just cheap insurance. I only drive about 500 miles a month.

In re-reading this thread (and others) there seems to be a marked difference between the 03 and 04 Cobra's in how they respond on the dyno with the Predator, and in the case of the 03's there seems to be a difference if the car has the "stall fix" PCM reflash from Ford. Then mix in a few different mods and it seems to be a bit of a "crap shoot".

I'm feeling very fortunate that I have a combo that seems to work very well.

 

[speedtigger]

chucko,
you do seem to be the fortunate one.

you are the lone success post.

I hope to hear from as many people as possible on this because i am intending to hold diablo accountable to fix this.

i expect them to make a corrected tune available for download so that people don't have to pay a tuner to fix this thing.

something else everyone should know. I spoke with the guy who started and designed the predator (who is no longer with the company) and he says he knows what is wrong with the program but, obviously, is not in a position to help.

Willie from diablo sport fixed mine in short order. he was on site when i dyno'd mine. the curious thing about that is that he went to his laptop, typed and viewed for awhile and came back out with a perfect tune first shot. that is a hell of a thing to do on a car that was so far off. but look i don't expect willie to come clean. we all know the wrath of the boss when an employee offers imformation that could cost the company money. and i do expect diablo to give me my money back for the custom tune.

with all that being said i still believe in the product but they need to do the right thing before too many people catch on. COBRA owners love to talk about thier cars and the predator can either be spoken well of or not. it's really up to diablo.

 

[RUgoinup?]

Diablo is the Devil! :fm:


Sorry, I couldn't resist.


So much for this product being a good "stock pulley-off the shelf" flash tuner option.

SCT for me!

 

[speedtigger]

rugoinup,
i'm not sorry i bought the predator. it does things that the others can't, B U T, i don't think we should have to buy a custom tune to make it work either. DIABLO just needs to own up to bad fuel table and do the right thing.

$400.00 for a predator OK
$700.00 for a predator not F-ing way!!!!!

you could buy a super chips tuner platform for a little more than that.

 

[RUgoinup?]

Originally posted by speedtigger
rugoinup,
i'm not sorry i bought the predator.

I don't think you should be.

For those that haven't already purchased one and intend on using the stock pulley tune, they may want to reconsider until the problem is addressed, if in fact there is a problem.

 

[kj385]

I got mine with a custom tune in it and it worked great the 1st time. I never tried the stock preator tunes. Air fuel killer flat all the way to redline. I'd post the dyno/AF sheet but don't know how.

 

[ALA G8R]

Custom tuning is the only way to fly. My custom tuning came with the price of the Predator. My A/F is in the 11's from 2500 to redline. In two weeks I get a custom tune by RWTD "on the dyno" to get the A/F flatlined to 11.8.