Rotary Vs DA

Mach1USMC

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I've been a pro detailer for a while now but I've never used a rotary. I have a Flex 3401 that I'm very happy with and get great results. How much of a leap is there between the Flex and say a DeWalt DWP849X? I have great technique so that's not an issue. Is it just a matter of keeping great technique and being extra aware of the paint (along with media) or is there a whole lot more to it?
 

Mach1USMC

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Sooooo - anywho. I'm having my Flex sent to me. But all you detailers out there- if I was to get a Rotary which is the best bang for the buck?
 

POPPAJ

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If you've got a 3401 and it's working well for you why would you change to a rotary? :shrug: I've got a 3401, 2GG, a PC and three rotarys. Rarely use the rotarys for any thing than headlights and small areas where I use a 4" pad.

Cant resist? Get a cheap one from HF just to try out or a used setup.

Sounds like spring fever!
 

hoamskilet

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I picked up the dewalt rotary just to have available if needed (I also have a boat that I'm going to buff out and from what I've read a rotary/wool is a must for gel coat) and it just feels like a chore to use compared to a good DA. I didnt have any problems damaging paint or anything, but I just don't find it as enjoyable to use. I use my rupes for the bulk of my work and leave a 4" pad on the rotary so I can use it on the small areas.

I haven't used other rotaries to compare, but the dewalt is a nice unit. It's smooth, quiet, not terribly heavy, and pretty reasonably priced
 

Merlinii

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Sooooo - anywho. I'm having my Flex sent to me. But all you detailers out there- if I was to get a Rotary which is the best bang for the buck?


You already have a 3401 (and you like it) then why not keep the same brand and get a Flex PE14-2-150
I have one and I'm VERY happy with it. It is lightweight, has a smooth slow start and it is easy to control.

I have a few different machines Flex, Rupes, PC, GG etc. & there's nothing I can't do with a rotary & a DA.
 

thomas91169

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I picked up the $35 harbor freight rotary about 3 years ago. Very happy with it, fully variable from 300-3000rpm. Ive more than gotten my money out of it, so if it ever breaks, ill just buy another.

Though I still use my PC on certain areas that a rotary is harder to control. Rotary is great for doing large areas rather quickly, hoods, roofs, trunklids, etc.
 

Mach1USMC

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I picked up the $35 harbor freight rotary about 3 years ago. Very happy with it, fully variable from 300-3000rpm. Ive more than gotten my money out of it, so if it ever breaks, ill just buy another.

Though I still use my PC on certain areas that a rotary is harder to control. Rotary is great for doing large areas rather quickly, hoods, roofs, trunklids, etc.

Thanks for the input - I hadn't thought about Harbor Freight. They don't have one here but I'm sure I can have someone send me one. And the large flat areas that I need to do quickly is exactly why I was thinking rotary.

You already have a 3401 (and you like it) then why not keep the same brand and get a Flex PE14-2-150
I have one and I'm VERY happy with it. It is lightweight, has a smooth slow start and it is easy to control.

I have a few different machines Flex, Rupes, PC, GG etc. & there's nothing I can't do with a rotary & a DA.

I did see the Flex rotaries but the "deal" available on the DeWalt was just a really good deal.

I chickened out and ended up with a Rupes 15. Between the Rupes and the 3401 I'm sure I'll be able to handle pretty much anything.
 
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Merlinii

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I chickened out and ended up with a Rupes 15. Between the Rupes and the 3401 I'm sure I'll be able to handle pretty much anything.

The Rupes 15 is a good machine. It is similar (but different) to the 3401.
The 3401 rotates counter clockwise. Other machines rotate clockwise.
IMHO - It functions better with the Kevin Brown washer mod (it's a DIY)
The 3401 is a direct drive so IMHO the Rupes is a "safer" machine to use.

I prefer the 5" BP. Have you used the Megs DMC5 Microfiber Cutting Discs?
I prime the disc with D300 then alternate 2 drops of M101 & D300 on the disc.
M101 cuts the best but dusts (just a little) the added D300 eliminates dusting.

For finishing I'd suggest a 5.5" Blue and/or Gold CCS pad with Carpro Reflect.

IMHO - The Lake Country 5 1/2 Inch Flat Pads 6 Pack is a good pad choice.
I'd go with 2)orange 2)white 1)black and 1)blue (I wish LC made gold in flat)

I can teach someone how to use a Dual Action in about 10+ minutes.
Unlike the DA/orbital, a rotary takes a lot of time to learn and master.
 

SNmustang95

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I have the dewalt, and the 21 and 15 rupes, soon to have the smallest one the offer. I haven't used the dewalt much but it's nice when I need it. My rupes do just as good of job, and they're way safer to use.
 

Mach1USMC

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I got hung up on being a pro and never using a rotary. lol

Wow- where do I even start with you? Are you trolling or just being a tool/yourself? IOW's, are you always a jerk or did you just pick this time to show off your ignorance?:shrug:

I must have missed in the "detailers rulebook" where it says you MUST have a rotary or you can't be a pro. Interesting position since I've been getting paid to detail for quite some time now, many are repeat customers and or are customers recommended by other customers. But here you are claiming one cannot possibly be a professional unless they use a rotary...:rollseyes

Maybe you should stop being so narrow minded and help a fellow detailer that has a legit question, instead of try to tear him down because you're too shallow and ignorant to think yourself out of a wet paper bag:bash:

*Note- you may want to catch the MULTIPLE vids of those amateurs; Larry Kosilla, Mike Phillips, Garry Dean, and Junkman (and many others) making all those vids with DA's. If they were "real" pros they would ONLY use rotaries right?:nonono:
 

TransAxle

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Wow- where do I even start with you? Are you trolling or just being a tool/yourself? IOW's, are you always a jerk or did you just pick this time to show off your ignorance?:shrug:

I must have missed in the "detailers rulebook" where it says you MUST have a rotary or you can't be a pro. Interesting position since I've been getting paid to detail for quite some time now, many are repeat customers and or are customers recommended by other customers. But here you are claiming one cannot possibly be a professional unless they use a rotary...:rollseyes

Maybe you should stop being so narrow minded and help a fellow detailer that has a legit question, instead of try to tear him down because you're too shallow and ignorant to think yourself out of a wet paper bag:bash:

*Note- you may want to catch the MULTIPLE vids of those amateurs; Larry Kosilla, Mike Phillips, Garry Dean, and Junkman (and many others) making all those vids with DA's. If they were "real" pros they would ONLY use rotaries right?:nonono:

First off...your an idiot and yes...I am an asshole most of the time.

I said it was funny that someone calls themselves a professional detailer, yet ask a question of getting a rotary. Very few people know how to properly use a rotary. With the advancement of the technology of detailing, even a slight newb who can follow the videos of hack detailers and great product salesmen as you listed above can become a "professional."

A real professional detailer, would not need to worry about getting a rotary. As those said, with the Rupes, Rupes can do anything. Hell, you can correct most cars today with a polish. Even compounds are becoming obsolete. A professional, can judge there situation of how a paint needs to be corrected and finished down based solely on the buffer, pads, product and type of clear they are working with. You will find almost 1% of your situations that might need the help of a rotary. Only reason I use mine is to finish down on clears that mixed with a ton of clear hardeners. Just because I miss the action and skill required with a rotary. Its fun.

Now if you want me honest opinion to your question...then here....

I've been a pro detailer for a while now but I've never used a rotary. I have a Flex 3401 that I'm very happy with and get great results. How much of a leap is there between the Flex and say a DeWalt DWP849X? I have great technique so that's not an issue. Is it just a matter of keeping great technique and being extra aware of the paint (along with media) or is there a whole lot more to it?

Flex 3401 is a terrible buffer. Its counter oscillation is a pain. Its OPM speeds are generally either too aggressive or too weak. Takes more effort to use that buffer, than to use something more simple as a Griots or the better item, Rupes 21 or 15. That is why the Flex is not really ever talked about on true professional detailing boards. Go to something like Autogeek and flavor of the month, depending if they are trying to lower their stock of Flex, is to tell everyone is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

As I stated above, if you really are a pro, then why do you want to go to something getting outdated like the Dewalt? For the shits and giggles? Or because you are not achieving the results you are after? Are you even using the correct light to inspect your surface to make sure that you are achieving optimal results? Are you using the incorrect products? Are you using too aggressive product for something that technique could yield better results? Are you using the wrong pad? Are you not buffing long enough? Arm speed too fast? These are probably the better questions you should.

Why do I say this, you ask?

Because the Rotary in the correct hands can always achieve such a beautiful, micro marring free finish, that yields amazing gloss and depth of color. Sometimes on too soft of clears, it can still leave holograms behind. The only time people want to use a rotary is if they are a hack like Thomas *guy who posted in this thread* or they are trying to speed up their working time. I will assume you are not a hack. So if you are trying to speed up your cutting time, you will greatly increase the odds that you will burn or scar the finish. Money to fix that panel just ate up all the time in your job...and probably lost you a customer. Rotaries are for dealerships where its all about maximizing your cutting process in as little time as possible. Never yielding great results. With the correct skill level you can turn a 3 step correction down into a 2 step correction. Do all your cutting in the first step with the Dewalt and finish behind with a Griots or a Rupes to remove the holograms and give it a final glossing step. But that cutting step still takes as long as normal if not longer, since you have to ire on the side of caution for edges, groves, angels and uneven areas.

Now...did I answer your question? Or am I still just an asshole?

Hopefully I got both!!!! :D
 

Mach1USMC

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You've pretty much confirmed who I thought you were- an ignorant, arrogant asshole- congrats you got the trifecta!!

What did I learn from you? Let's see, you can't spell for one- but that's fairly petty. However, if you are going to try to take someone down a peg you should probably make sure your game is wired tight (hint, yours isn't!!)

Since you call the detailers I mentioned "hacks," perhaps you can show us your line of products you produced like these detailers did? No? Ok, how about the multiple vids of high end show cars you've worked on showing your amazing technique? No- not that either? Surely then you have your own website where people flock to from all over because you are just so good at conveying your amazing insight on how to properly detail? Right, I thought so, you don't have that either. So are they hacks because they have something you don't and they are simply better at what they do than you? Jealousy is such an ugly thing.

As far as what tools I use (I actually get great results from the Flex, it works great for me)- that was part of my question - but again, you were too busy being a know it all a-hole to actually try to answer the question. What, you're too dumb to learn from someone else, or teach someone else in a constructive way? You're too shallow to ask a question or answer a question without being a complete jerk?? One thing is for certain- you're far to shallow (and classless) to try to help someone without trying to tear them down. So I've never used a rotary- big deal. I want to learn, is that now a crime? This somehow takes away from my ability to detail, and detail very well i might add, with a DA? That's ignorant AND arrogant- but I guess you already knew that about yourself.

If you want people to actually listen and respect your opinion, you may want to work on your delivery. I seriously doubt you were born with a rotary in your hand. But congrats on mastering it I guess. We all have to start somewhere- even you. So try to step off that high horse and actually HELP someone, it's pretty refreshing if you try it from time to time- or just continue being an asshole since you think it's working so well for you. Just remember, you reap what you sow.
 
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coolcobramatt

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First off...your an idiot and yes...I am an asshole most of the time.

I said it was funny that someone calls themselves a professional detailer, yet ask a question of getting a rotary. Very few people know how to properly use a rotary. With the advancement of the technology of detailing, even a slight newb who can follow the videos of hack detailers and great product salesmen as you listed above can become a "professional."

A real professional detailer, would not need to worry about getting a rotary. As those said, with the Rupes, Rupes can do anything. Hell, you can correct most cars today with a polish. Even compounds are becoming obsolete. A professional, can judge there situation of how a paint needs to be corrected and finished down based solely on the buffer, pads, product and type of clear they are working with. You will find almost 1% of your situations that might need the help of a rotary. Only reason I use mine is to finish down on clears that mixed with a ton of clear hardeners. Just because I miss the action and skill required with a rotary. Its fun.

Now if you want me honest opinion to your question...then here....



Flex 3401 is a terrible buffer. Its counter oscillation is a pain. Its OPM speeds are generally either too aggressive or too weak. Takes more effort to use that buffer, than to use something more simple as a Griots or the better item, Rupes 21 or 15. That is why the Flex is not really ever talked about on true professional detailing boards. Go to something like Autogeek and flavor of the month, depending if they are trying to lower their stock of Flex, is to tell everyone is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

As I stated above, if you really are a pro, then why do you want to go to something getting outdated like the Dewalt? For the shits and giggles? Or because you are not achieving the results you are after? Are you even using the correct light to inspect your surface to make sure that you are achieving optimal results? Are you using the incorrect products? Are you using too aggressive product for something that technique could yield better results? Are you using the wrong pad? Are you not buffing long enough? Arm speed too fast? These are probably the better questions you should.

Why do I say this, you ask?

Because the Rotary in the correct hands can always achieve such a beautiful, micro marring free finish, that yields amazing gloss and depth of color. Sometimes on too soft of clears, it can still leave holograms behind. The only time people want to use a rotary is if they are a hack like Thomas *guy who posted in this thread* or they are trying to speed up their working time. I will assume you are not a hack. So if you are trying to speed up your cutting time, you will greatly increase the odds that you will burn or scar the finish. Money to fix that panel just ate up all the time in your job...and probably lost you a customer. Rotaries are for dealerships where its all about maximizing your cutting process in as little time as possible. Never yielding great results. With the correct skill level you can turn a 3 step correction down into a 2 step correction. Do all your cutting in the first step with the Dewalt and finish behind with a Griots or a Rupes to remove the holograms and give it a final glossing step. But that cutting step still takes as long as normal if not longer, since you have to ire on the side of caution for edges, groves, angels and uneven areas.

Now...did I answer your question? Or am I still just an asshole?

Hopefully I got both!!!! :D


You lost all credibility when you said the Flex is a terrible polisher.

That simply is not true.
 

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