What she sounds like with the SLP catted X and Flowmaster 2-chambers.
Troublesome Trouble Codes... P0171
- Thread starter aaron97
- Start date
Hum... so what kind of tune and injectors come with a Vortech Supercharger? I was comparing photos of my engine bay with others and it seems my Cobra might have had a Vortech on it at some point. So i was thinking, if the car was retuned for use of larger injectors and now it has the stockers back in, that could cause it to run lean. Guess we'll find out tomorrow after the reflash from the dealer.
Well the reflash is done and the P0171 is already back on. Will wait to see if the P0174 comes back to before proceeding. At this point I dont really know what else to do... :shrug:
shims
Where do you find this spacer? Or do you have to cut off the stock bung and weld on a new bung that's .25" taller?
I tried searching the web and all I see is where a bunch of ricers are putting Anit-Foulers on the O2 Sensor, most doing it to get rid of the CEL after removing the Cats and some fools are even trying it to get better gas mileage.
Either way it doesn't make much sense to me, why a car would work perfectly fine for 9 years and then all of a sudden need the O2 shimmed... There has to be a root cause to this problem and i really want to find and fix it.
Well, the Ford Dealer really stuck it to me... My buddy was looking and he thinks they just cleared the memory, as in disconnected the battery for 10 minutes. There is no version/carb number listed on the paperwork and there is no new sticker in the engine compartment like there should be, like what they did with his Sport Trac when they reflashed it. There is still no P1000, and everything I see online says there should be because the drive cycle is not complete. The fan still seems like it is coming on at 210 also. Needless to say, he plans on going up there to find out what they hell the did do other than waste my time an money.
:fm:
:fm:
I had those same codes on my old GT. Top half of my motor was a bit dirty (looks like you covered that), but the main problem was my plugs and wires. I changed the plugs and it ran a bit better, and then I changed my wires and it ran awesome. Get some FRPP wires with some NGK's IMO
Oh and the low speed fan comes on at 210... high speed at 228. I'm pretty sure anyway.
In your case as fast as the codes come back I would just try some washers. I know of nothing you can buy off the shelf....all home made.
Changed them last week..
Good to know...
Well, with the FPR disconnected, he drove around for 30 minutes and didnt get a CEL. Here are the PENDING codes (P0411, P0402, P0171) and thats in the order that they appeared. The CEL is still not on, AND with the fuel pressure higher the long and short term fuel trims are down around 0-5 percent on both sides. So I think now we are going to get an Adjustable FPR and raise the pressures to the maximum limits and see how that does.
On another note. I dont think i mentioned it before, but one of the IMRC cables broke and he drove around like that for a couple days and never got any codes related to it. Only found the cable because he pulled the intake off to get the injectors out and noticed the cable then. It actually broke twice. THe original cable broke and then the home-made cable broke. Its all good now, but i was wondering why with one cable broken didnt it throw a code?
New turn of events! :banana: That pending P0171 went away on its on and the car just cleared its first full drive cycle since i have owned it. The only thing it had was the pending P0411 for smog pump system, and it tripped the CEL on the way back to the house. Which at this point is fine with me, at least its not that stupid P0171. :mj:
The P0171 and P0174 went away because we disconnected the vacuum line to the FPR and plugged the vac' line. Then he put a smaller diameter hose inside of the PCV hose to act as a restrictor. So what I've learned is that the fuel pressure, while still within normal limits but at the lower range of that limit, was not enough psi. With it disconnected the psi is about 3psi below the maximum psi limit for when the FPR is connected. So I am going to get an adjustable FPR and turn up the psi to put it in the higher range of what is considered normal operating pressure.
As for the P0411, we start troubleshooting that tomorrow. We may just fix this car yet...
The P0171 and P0174 went away because we disconnected the vacuum line to the FPR and plugged the vac' line. Then he put a smaller diameter hose inside of the PCV hose to act as a restrictor. So what I've learned is that the fuel pressure, while still within normal limits but at the lower range of that limit, was not enough psi. With it disconnected the psi is about 3psi below the maximum psi limit for when the FPR is connected. So I am going to get an adjustable FPR and turn up the psi to put it in the higher range of what is considered normal operating pressure.
As for the P0411, we start troubleshooting that tomorrow. We may just fix this car yet...
Good to hear the lean codes went away! I can't remember, did you replace your fuel pump?
Ya. The original pump was an aftermarket pump and the install was a hack job. It was not putting out full psi and it would not hold pressure when you turn the key off. We installed a new BBK 255lph pump and everything checks good. Only thing is, with the vac connected to the FPR, the psi is in the lower range of whats acceptable. So the plan is to get an adjustable FPR and set the pressure to the higher side of acceptable pressure limits and see how that goes.
As for the P0411. We checked and the smog pump doesnt work, even jumped it with a hot wire and it wouldn't kick on. So a new pump will show up tomorrow. Hopefully in the morning and hopefully the pump will fix and clear all the codes because the temp tag expires tomorrow as well so we have to get the emissions test done tomorrow or we're screwed. Because the emissions facility wont smog a car if it doesn't have at least temp tags and new AZ law states that you are only allowed 1 temp tag for 30 days and will not be allowed to get another temp for the same vehicle.
She is finally fixed and running like a champ. Passed the AZ emission check yesterday afternoon.
Changed the smog pump and left the stock FPR disconnected and vacuum line plugged so the Fuel Pressures would stay up. I will install an Adjustable FPR in a week or so, but now that she finally passed the smog test, its time to get her registered.
Oh and after all this the RPM is a steady and solid 800rpm. Unlike before where it would hang-up around 1500rpm once the engine was warm. Its been a long and costly road but its okay because everything we changed was indeed bad.
Here is everything that was found bad and replaced.
-Forward O2 sensors
-Intake Manifold gasket set
-Intake manifold & IMRC cleaned (looks like new on the inside)
-IMRC cable replaced (driver side)
-IMRC o-rings & bearings replaced (both sides)
-New MAF
-New Canister purge valve
-New IAC
-New TPS
-New BBK 255lph Fuel Pump
-Cleaned Injectors
-New end pieces for the Injectors
-New FPR (stock style for now)
-New Fuel Filter
-New Spark Plugs
-New FMS Plug Wires
-New Smog Pump
-Made a restrictor for the PCV hose.
-Installed 2 Oil Catch Cans in the PCV system.
-PCM Reflash with all the Updates
-New SLP catted x-pipe.
A few other things that were accomplished during all of this that didnt have must to do with the CEL problems.
-flushed the Engine Oil 3 times and now runs synthetic.
-drained and fill the trany with Royal Purple.
-drained and filled the rear end with Mobile 1 synthetic.
-New Pinion Input shaft seal and new diff cover seal.
-New Pads and Rotors on all 4 corners.
-SpeedCal to correct the speedo for the 4.10 gears.
I'm sure I left something out, but thats pretty much it.
Changed the smog pump and left the stock FPR disconnected and vacuum line plugged so the Fuel Pressures would stay up. I will install an Adjustable FPR in a week or so, but now that she finally passed the smog test, its time to get her registered.
Oh and after all this the RPM is a steady and solid 800rpm. Unlike before where it would hang-up around 1500rpm once the engine was warm. Its been a long and costly road but its okay because everything we changed was indeed bad.
Here is everything that was found bad and replaced.
-Forward O2 sensors
-Intake Manifold gasket set
-Intake manifold & IMRC cleaned (looks like new on the inside)
-IMRC cable replaced (driver side)
-IMRC o-rings & bearings replaced (both sides)
-New MAF
-New Canister purge valve
-New IAC
-New TPS
-New BBK 255lph Fuel Pump
-Cleaned Injectors
-New end pieces for the Injectors
-New FPR (stock style for now)
-New Fuel Filter
-New Spark Plugs
-New FMS Plug Wires
-New Smog Pump
-Made a restrictor for the PCV hose.
-Installed 2 Oil Catch Cans in the PCV system.
-PCM Reflash with all the Updates
-New SLP catted x-pipe.
A few other things that were accomplished during all of this that didnt have must to do with the CEL problems.
-flushed the Engine Oil 3 times and now runs synthetic.
-drained and fill the trany with Royal Purple.
-drained and filled the rear end with Mobile 1 synthetic.
-New Pinion Input shaft seal and new diff cover seal.
-New Pads and Rotors on all 4 corners.
-SpeedCal to correct the speedo for the 4.10 gears.
I'm sure I left something out, but thats pretty much it.
Christ, after reading this thread I now want to cry as I now have P0171 and P0174 codes tripping my check engine light
This is gonna suck
This is gonna suck
Christ, after reading this thread I now want to cry as I now have P0171 and P0174 codes tripping my check engine light
This is gonna suck
Ya it sucks. Everything i did fixed them for about 3 days... and now the codes are back..
We just put new FMS Fuel Injectors in a day ago and that didnt help either. I did a live streaming sensor check with a new code reader a few minutes ago and when you let off the gas the car goes way lean and then balances out in range, so I guess I’ll have to keep researching on what that could be. Fuel trims under load are fine, and at idle they end up stabilizing at about 25%, but they end up at about 35%+ when combined with short term trim when it is coming back to idle.
Damm man.
I'm still thinking.
I'm still thinking.
At least it went away long enough to get her past the emissions testing, so it registered now and all good for 2 years. So at least now i can slow down on the spending and try to fix her at my leisure. Or at my buddies leisure anyway, since i am still over here in Abu Dhabi and it looks like i will be for quit a while now, at least to the end of the year or maybe even until next summer... man what i wouldn't give to have my Cobra or GTO over here, my Mazda 6 rental car is killing me... seriously, i die a little inside every time I have to drive it.
I don't know much about Mustangs, but Stampede3 asked me to take a look at this thread since I have a tuner for my Grand Prix and deal with a lot of the same tuning issues.
Did your friend go back to the dealer about the PCM flash? If the car had nitros and possible a SC, it's probably still tuned for those things which would really screw up the tune since they are no longer installed.
BTW, the foul out adapter trick is not just for ricers. There are a lot of Grand Prixs running the same setup. Either because they've removed the cat like you said or just because of a bigger downpipe or catback system. I'm told it works very well. It's not a problem in the engine, it's just that the exhaust gases are not as dense because of the extra space in the exhaust. The stock O2 sensor sees this as a lean condition.
With all the stuff you've changed, and since you haven't found any exhaust leaks (which is what I suspected to be the problem), I'm leaning toward a really bad tune or maybe even a faulty PCM. Have you checked the ground for the PCM?
Did your friend go back to the dealer about the PCM flash? If the car had nitros and possible a SC, it's probably still tuned for those things which would really screw up the tune since they are no longer installed.
BTW, the foul out adapter trick is not just for ricers. There are a lot of Grand Prixs running the same setup. Either because they've removed the cat like you said or just because of a bigger downpipe or catback system. I'm told it works very well. It's not a problem in the engine, it's just that the exhaust gases are not as dense because of the extra space in the exhaust. The stock O2 sensor sees this as a lean condition.
With all the stuff you've changed, and since you haven't found any exhaust leaks (which is what I suspected to be the problem), I'm leaning toward a really bad tune or maybe even a faulty PCM. Have you checked the ground for the PCM?
Going lean when you let off on the gas is normal. That part of it is nothing to worry about.
Any way your buddy can capture some logs for us to look at?
Any way your buddy can capture some logs for us to look at?
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