Urethane!

[cydewaze]

Does anyone here use urethane front sway bar pivot bushings? If so, are they horribly noisy? I remember the ones I had on my fox were creaky as hell, and no amount of lube would shut them up. I'm thinking about a set for my 03, as well as a set of aluminum differential bushings. Might as well do both sets at once.

 

[racer726]

The stock bushings are urethane.

 

[ragansrcobra99]

Not to mention, be sure you want the aluminum diff bushings. Just put a set in, noisy as hell. I don't drive mine daily at all anymore, so it's not an issue for me. You may want to consider urethane for that....

couple 'o pennies....

 

[Andy M]

I've got the monster Steeda front sway bar on my R and I am pretty certain it came with Urethane bushings?? a call to Steeda would confirm this?....

Also, I agree that you would probably not want the aluminum bushings on a daily driven street car!! a LOT of noise coming through the diff and emanating through the inside of the car.. and of course on our R's, with not much insulation, it is even louder... cool as hell though!!!!

 

[cydewaze]

Thanks! Good info on both counts. I thought the stock sway bar pivots might be urethane, but I had it up on a lift the other day (installing the poly IRS bushings), and when I dug a fingernail into the front SB pivot bushings, they felt pretty soft. Kinda made me wonder.

 

[toofast4u]

I have the MM urethane end-links and pivot bushings and they don't make any noise. I am pretty sure the pivot bushings are rubber not urethane. The stock end-links are urethane.

 

[cydewaze]

Hmm, I think I'll leave the front sway bar alone. If I stiffen it up, it might make the understeer worse. If I lower the car (thinking about the MM coil-over kit) I'll do toofast4u's end link shortening trick.

Anyone tried the urethane control arm bushings yet? I'm pretty sure they're overkill for what I use the car for, but I'm still curious.

 

[Andy M]

the larger sway bar DOES in fact induce a little more understeer... however, once you learn how to take corners with it, it will put a huge smile on your face... basically, you need to brake early, plant the car down, rotate, then on the gas no later than the middle of the apex... AWESOME!!!!

 

[toofast4u]

Originally posted by cydewaze
Hmm, I think I'll leave the front sway bar alone. If I stiffen it up, it might make the understeer worse. If I lower the car (thinking about the MM coil-over kit) I'll do toofast4u's end link shortening trick.

Anyone tried the urethane control arm bushings yet? I'm pretty sure they're overkill for what I use the car for, but I'm still curious.

I have urethane bushings in my MM LCAs and don't have any problem with them.

 

[cydewaze]

Originally posted by Andy M
the larger sway bar DOES in fact induce a little more understeer... however, once you learn how to take corners with it, it will put a huge smile on your face... basically, you need to brake early, plant the car down, rotate, then on the gas no later than the middle of the apex... AWESOME!!!!

Kinda reminds me of the way I used to drive the old 911. Definitely not the car to practice trail braking in.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

There is a Ford TSB out about a year and a half old...
I think it was a front sway bar creak in the Lincoln LS...
Anyway.... Rotunda (div of Ford) has a special sway bar pivot bushing lube... might be worth a try...
maybe a Lincoln tech could post the number... or maybe a Ford tech... Thunderbird is pretty much the same mechanicals...
Urethane does not like "dry pivot" applications... works great where not pivoting, w/o noise...low deflection..etc.

but in that pivoting app. it needs to be well lubed w/ a fairly thick water proof grease...
I just wish I could remember the name ...I am very confident it would work.

I think it was something like "Krytox"....."Crytox"
YEP.... found it here's the link...ouch that's scarey both spellings are on the site????
http://www.tmcindustries.com/krytoxvpf.htm

It's the one spelled w/ a "k" those little tubes are what we used:thumbsup:

 

[Cobra-R]

Originally posted by Andy M
the larger sway bar DOES in fact induce a little more understeer... however, once you learn how to take corners with it, it will put a huge smile on your face... basically, you need to brake early, plant the car down, rotate, then on the gas no later than the middle of the apex... AWESOME!!!!

Whats the advantage of putting on a swaybar that makes your car understeer worse?

I am putting a smaller swaybar on my car to help reduce understeer, thus the reason for my confusion.


Brian

 

[Andy M]

Brian,

A perfectly valid question and one that I asked too when Joe put the larger sway bar on his R before I did... then I rode with him in his car and realized that we can induce OVERSTEER whenever we wish, simply using the throttle...

At least for my driving style, I felt the car was always getting loose in the rear when coming around corners, no matter what I did with the throttle. I now (again, at least with my current comfort and skill levels) feel alot more secure with the car, because I have learned how to throttle steer it, but the slight understeer is keeping me honest...

Does this make sense?... I hope I articulated this correctly? bottom line, there are those who are more comfortable with some understeer and those who are perfectly fine with a TON of oversteer.. I am one of those "understeer" kind of guys... YMMV!

 

[Cobra-R]

Yea, it makes perfect sense. Like you said we all drive differently and like different different things from our cars. I hope you didn't take it as an attack, it was not meant that way.

Any idea what you will be doing now with the coilovers? Will they require a swaybar change?

Brian

 

[Andy M]

Brian, I know you well enough now to know better man!! no offense taken...

I will likely do the coilovers (as soon as I secure funding from my finance director) .. and when I do this, I will likely back down to the smaller sway bar at that time... I may try it out with this sway bar just to see how it behaves though .. before nuking it?...

 

[Cobra-R]

Originally posted by Andy M
I will likely do the coilovers (as soon as I secure funding from my finance director) .. and when I do this, I will likely back down to the smaller sway bar at that time... I may try it out with this sway bar just to see how it behaves though .. before nuking it?...

Wonder why I was under the impression that you were adding coilovers.

I am in the process of looking for additional swaybars for my 95 to tune with. The 95 has a 30MM, I am looking for multiple bars between 25mm-29mm so I can switch them at the track. If I find all that I need and figure out what works for my car, you would be welcome to the rest to see what works for your car with the coil-overs.

Brian

 

[JoeJ]

Brian,

The main reason I installed the larger front sway bar was to cut down on the amount of front lean in the corners. It was leaning so badly that I was almost picking up one of the rear wheels. I know the best way to combat this problem is to install heaver springs but the larger sway bar was a stop gap measure. Of course a SLA suspension with coil overs is the best solution.

I now reduce the understeer by braking late, lighten up the rear end, point the car, and then hard on the gas..It works pretty good and the car doesnt lean as much as it did with the stock sway bar.

 

[BlueStripe]

Originally posted by Andy M
the larger sway bar DOES in fact induce a little more understeer... however, once you learn how to take corners with it, it will put a huge smile on your face... basically, you need to brake early, plant the car down, rotate, then on the gas no later than the middle of the apex... AWESOME!!!!

You're driving your Cobra R as if it were front wheel drive :nonono:

Originally posted by Andy M
Brian,

A perfectly valid question and one that I asked too when Joe put the larger sway bar on his R before I did... then I rode with him in his car and realized that we can induce OVERSTEER whenever we wish, simply using the throttle...

At least for my driving style, I felt the car was always getting loose in the rear when coming around corners, no matter what I did with the throttle. I now (again, at least with my current comfort and skill levels) feel alot more secure with the car, because I have learned how to throttle steer it, but the slight understeer is keeping me honest...

Does this make sense?... I hope I articulated this correctly? bottom line, there are those who are more comfortable with some understeer and those who are perfectly fine with a TON of oversteer.. I am one of those "understeer" kind of guys... YMMV!

By using the throttle to induce oversteer, you're wasting tire revolutions and thus losing time. Get rid of that swaybar, it's only hurting you. I had it on my car, took it to one event, and ditched it.

Originally posted by cydewaze
Hmm, I think I'll leave the front sway bar alone. If I stiffen it up, it might make the understeer worse. If I lower the car (thinking about the MM coil-over kit) I'll do toofast4u's end link shortening trick.

Anyone tried the urethane control arm bushings yet? I'm pretty sure they're overkill for what I use the car for, but I'm still curious.

When you lower the car, call Energy Suspension and get a set of urethan front swaybar endlinks for a 1967 Mustang (part number 9.8117). They're the perfect length for a lowered SN95. Stay away from urethane control arm bushings, the last thing you want on a bushing that rotates is urethane. Delrin or nylon are good alternatives.