(2) Lund Custom Tunes And Still......

[Joe5.0]

John Lund Custom Tune.....Still Having Problems......

..............Detonation and Pinging at 1/2 throttle on the dyno.

I tell you what guys this has been an absolute nightmare. I purchased the basics from Lethal Performance back in early August for the car....

-Innovators West 10%
-FRPP Monoblade TB
-JLT 127mm Carbon Fiber Intake
-Sct Xcal 3 With now (2) Lund Racing tunes
-Gates Belt
-Ngk TR'6's Gapped at 0.30

Tried to take it down to Brads Custom Auto here in Seattle....an extremely well known shop, and the car went into limp mode and barely ran/stummbled all over the place. When i arrived back home i adjusted some of the clamps on the upper intake tubing, and also moved the air filter farther down on the inlet pipe. The car then ran like an absolute dream all the way down to the dyno shop, but had a bloppy idle.

Once the car was hooked up to the dyno, we discovered it was reading 25% lean at idle which was causing the flucuation of RPMS. Next we went ahead and tried to do a quick pull on the dyno to 4,000 RPMS, and around 1/2 throttle the car detonates and pings extremely bad, suggesting it is running lean. We then went ahead and notified Lund Racing of the issue, and they confirmed.....and i quote:

"The file you were sent did not have the proper adjustments for the throttle body. This is the correct file. Sorry about the mixup"

Ok so no big deal right? Nobody is perfect not even John Lund ( Or whoever tuned the ****Ing car)

They sent me a new custom tune, i loaded it into the car and it definately took care of the surging idle and runs alot better. But the car is STILL having the same issues. Detonation and pinging at 1/2 throttle or so. Brad shows that the fuel trims in the tune are off.

Lund Racing went on to suggest that the car may have "Bad Fuel" and that fuel in the Northwest is Notorious for bad fuel issues (92 Octane From 76 here in Washington State) and that i need some octane booster or better fuel. LOL!

Knowone told me that i need to run octane booster ON EVERY TANK OF GAS

-OR-

Run a higher quality of fuel (93 Octane which is near impossible to find here)

I suggested that a Datalog be sent into Lund Racing and was told:

"Datalogs shouldn't be needed. The tune is being run worldwide by all of our and Lunds customers and it seems to be very finicky with certain fuels"

We Datalogged the car on the dyno and it clearly shows that the long term fuel trims are off. Brad sent them the DataLog on Monday and ofcourse we have yet to hear anything back....

The point here is that the car STILL does not run right after (2) John Lund custom tunes, and has been sitting at the shop costing me who knows how much money just sitting there. Hopefully John Lund Racing helps get this right, i understand that knowone is perfect but for being so well known on the hours put into these cars.....im not very impressed, and extremely pissed off thus far.

Any input helps guys.

 

[specizripn]

Thats a total bummer man. I hope everything gets resolved for you, and doesn't cost you too much! :bash:

 

[03svtcobracoupe]

Go with a different tuner. You can tune a cobra down to 87 just adjust the timing big time sounds like a run around to me. Get a place to tune you for the gas you have easily available to you. Dyno tune that bad girl! !

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

[USV8PWR]

I'm sure all of those tunes are programmed for 93 Octane, unless you do the over the top 100 octane tune. So I'd either start buying some quality octane booster (which really isn't much) of start using 93 Octane (which you said is impossible to find). They're correct in that those tunes are used all over, so it sounds very likely to be a fuel issue.

 

[Joe5.0]

I'm sure all of those tunes are programmed for 93 Octane, unless you do the over the top 100 octane tune. So I'd either start buying some quality octane booster (which really isn't much) of start using 93 Octane (which you said is impossible to find). They're correct in that those tunes are used all over, so it sounds very likely to be a fuel issue.

Yes 93 Octane is hard to find here in Washington. Im not gonna drive 200-300 miles out of my way to purchase fuel for a car that gets 9 miles to a gallon.....

And like i mentioned, the Datalog shows that the long term fuel trims in the custom tune are not correct.

Wether the car is tuned for 93 octane or not.....i asked for it to be tuned for 92 octane....no matter what the quality.

 

[03svtcobracoupe]

You can 100% tune a car for 92 or 91 even if its tuned for 93 and you run 92 you shouldn't be able to notice now 93 tune to 87 she will ping

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

[zr1gerhardt]

You need a dyno tune. Sometimes generic tunes won't work. It happens.

Scott

 

[nix5o]

Lund is an awesome tuner. But I've never been a fan of mail order tunes, regardless of who is doing the tuning. I've never been able to work for me. I'd rather just put the car on the dyno with whom ever I'm going to have tune it.

Does the person that is doing the dyno for you have the software to tune it himself?

 

[John@Lethal]

Joe,

I received your email with the logs towards the end of the day today, and forwarded them to Lund Racing to review. I do apologize you're still having issues. As I did explain to you before, another option you have is to pull 2* of timing from the tune as that is an unlocked feature for the end user to adjust. That will compensate for the lower octane you're using.

At the end of the day, we want to make sure you're satisfied with your purchase. Keep in mind, the car is running higher than stock boost as well with your lower/tb/intake. You'll be much happier with how the car will run on 93, or using Torco with the current fuel you have. If there is a local shop that has a can for you to try, give it a shot.

I'll get with LR tomorrow and see what we can do about your tune.

Thanks

John

 

[BigDan]

Sounds like a TB issue. Put the stock one back on and see if that fixes your problem.

 

[jdcobra]

Sounds like a lund tune issue. I've been reading about problems people have been having with lund and I'm going steeda for a while and then hit up Shaun at AED

 

[Dick Lyon]

I went with Lethal's new intake and a Lund tune. Had the install done by Bodine and a dyno right after........No problems for a few days and then a "engine light"......Light stayed on for a couple hundred miles and is now gone.....Not sure if this thing "learns" or not but all seems OK for now. I burn 93 all the time. I feel better performance and you can sure hear the blower whine under acceleration which is all good, however if things like your having happen continued and it took an additive to make the thing run right I would scrap the whole venture and go back to stock as bone stock is still one helluva ride.

 

[cobraguy24]

This sounds like he needs to get this fixed asap. It would suck if my 60K mustang was detonating and pinging. That would be NFG.

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

I would talk with Shaun at AED.. I'm pretty sure he can tune the 13's like he does the 5.0's.. I could be wrong but might be worth a shot.

 

[91svtbird]

These types of problems are all too common and inherent in a tune when the MAF meter curve put into the tune is incorrect and or altered. This is a foundational flaw in the way certain tuners are tuning today. With the limited mods stated, you should have no problems with surging or detonation if the tuner is using the correct tuning practices.

We see the "bad gas" card or the "bad throttle body" card played all too often to explain away the problem and the real cause is never addressed mainly because they don't understand the ramifications of their improper tuning practice's.

a good article which will help to explain further http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/tuning-la-carte-375/897172-your-car-tuned-correctly.html

My recommendation to you is find a different tuner who tunes the way FMCO tunes using correct MAF flow bench transfer functions ....your engine will thank you and you will enjoy driving a car that drives like it is supposed to.

 

[Mike Adams]

Everyone is doing cold pulls, what numbers are guys getting when car is at street temps. Real world number

 

[Franz]

You need a dyno tune. Sometimes generic tunes won't work. It happens.

Scott

+1

We built an Ultima GTR a couple years ago with an American Speed LS7 in it and the ECU "pre-tuned" by the engine builder's LS7 tune guru. After the car kept stalling out in coast-downs we sent the ECU back and forth to the tuner three times. I finally took it to a local shop known for specializing in LS7s (Extreme Performance in Tempe) and he was able to fix it by tuning the car while it was on the dyno and by driving around town with me while his laptop was hooked up to the car.

I'm not saying a mail order tune can't ever work, but I'm pretty convinced after my experience (and many others like this I've heard) that the only way to go is doing the tune on the car to smooth out drivability issues. After all, everyone lives in different elevations, has access to different kinds of gas, etc... Sometimes "one fits all" just doesn't work. I'm not opposed to ordering the various parts I want through Revan or Lethal, but I might want to have my tune done by a local place that can actually hook up to MY car.

On a side note- OP mentioned he has the mono-blade TB. This thing moves like 1,900 CFMs vs the dual 65 TB moving closer to 1,600 with less RAM effect when the TB opens at full throttle. Just curious if the vendors on here have experienced a "smoother" throttle response out of the dual 65 TB. Your input would be appreciated guys. Thanks!

 

[farmboy90]

These types of problems are all too common and inherent in a tune when the MAF meter curve put into the tune is incorrect and or altered. This is a foundational flaw in the way certain tuners are tuning today. With the limited mods stated, you should have no problems with surging or detonation if the tuner is using the correct tuning practices.

We see the "bad gas" card or the "bad throttle body" card played all too often to explain away the problem and the real cause is never addressed mainly because they don't understand the ramifications of their improper tuning practice's.

a good article which will help to explain further

My recommendation to you is find a different tuner who tunes the way FMCO tunes using correct MAF flow bench transfer functions ....your engine will thank you and you will enjoy driving a car that drives like it is supposed to.

Thanks for this link it was a good read. So is Lund a tuner who follows the principles outlined in the link?

 

[Joe5.0]

Joe,

I received your email with the logs towards the end of the day today, and forwarded them to Lund Racing to review. I do apologize you're still having issues. As I did explain to you before, another option you have is to pull 2* of timing from the tune as that is an unlocked feature for the end user to adjust. That will compensate for the lower octane you're using.

At the end of the day, we want to make sure you're satisfied with your purchase. Keep in mind, the car is running higher than stock boost as well with your lower/tb/intake. You'll be much happier with how the car will run on 93, or using Torco with the current fuel you have. If there is a local shop that has a can for you to try, give it a shot.

I'll get with LR tomorrow and see what we can do about your tune.

Thanks

John

Thanks John, looking forward to hearing back then we will go from there....

Joe

 

[John@Lethal]

Thanks John, looking forward to hearing back then we will go from there....

Joe

From my understanding, looks like you're now in contact with Lund Racing. Hopefully they can get you squared away.

Thanks again

John