Hrm. That seems like it's hanging around, then. I'd take it in to the dealer and see what they say; since you know how to repro the issue, you should be able to give them the steps.
Piston noise before warmed up..?
- Thread starter Blown2004Stang
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Hrm. That seems like it's hanging around, then. I'd take it in to the dealer and see what they say; since you know how to repro the issue, you should be able to give them the steps.
I'm going to have to pull my intake off, and pull the tune out.. but, that's probably what I'll end up doing doing.
Hi...my name is SM99GT..... and I am victim of engine knock!
I almost feel like I am in a focus group here but its nice to see that I am not the only one with the problem. My car was built Nov 2010 and purchased Dec 2010. I babied it for the first 750 miles only going WOT i think twice, during that period. At around 1000-1100miles I started noticing the knock on cold starts. Now I have 1600 miles and it makes a racket. The conditions upon which mine makes the noise is cold engine (first 5-7 minutes) and almost coast in any gear. IOW, if you take with a certain amount of throttle in gear, as the speed of the car catches up to the amount of throttle input held steady, the internals get to a sort of "equilibrium" state and the top end starts rattling. I am almost positive the issue is not piston slap. Its too high in the motor. It actually sounds like the camshafts are loose or the rockers are loose. Mine has been at the dealer since Monday and so far FMC has not released any public documentation acknowledging such a problem or a fix. I authorized the dealer to pull my valve covers and check clearances on all the parts under there. I asked to re-torque the cam tower caps as a preventitive measure. Upon receiving some pictures from the service manager, it made me wonder if the VCT (specifically the cam phasers) system was the culprit. Here is a pic from the RH head.
The full size is at: CAMS_Full_Size
I will update here as well as I partake on my journey for a fix.
I almost feel like I am in a focus group here but its nice to see that I am not the only one with the problem. My car was built Nov 2010 and purchased Dec 2010. I babied it for the first 750 miles only going WOT i think twice, during that period. At around 1000-1100miles I started noticing the knock on cold starts. Now I have 1600 miles and it makes a racket. The conditions upon which mine makes the noise is cold engine (first 5-7 minutes) and almost coast in any gear. IOW, if you take with a certain amount of throttle in gear, as the speed of the car catches up to the amount of throttle input held steady, the internals get to a sort of "equilibrium" state and the top end starts rattling. I am almost positive the issue is not piston slap. Its too high in the motor. It actually sounds like the camshafts are loose or the rockers are loose. Mine has been at the dealer since Monday and so far FMC has not released any public documentation acknowledging such a problem or a fix. I authorized the dealer to pull my valve covers and check clearances on all the parts under there. I asked to re-torque the cam tower caps as a preventitive measure. Upon receiving some pictures from the service manager, it made me wonder if the VCT (specifically the cam phasers) system was the culprit. Here is a pic from the RH head.
The full size is at: CAMS_Full_Size
I will update here as well as I partake on my journey for a fix.
being that the ti-vct partially uses pressurized oil to control the cam timing, it wouldn't surprise me at all if it made some sound when cold. it definitely shouldn't be getting worse though. the noise that most people are reporting may just be a normal byproduct of the ti-vct system in cold conditions(hence why ford isn't "fixing" anything), but it sounds like you have an actual problem.Hi...my name is SM99GT..... and I am victim of engine knock!
I almost feel like I am in a focus group here but its nice to see that I am not the only one with the problem. My car was built Nov 2010 and purchased Dec 2010. I babied it for the first 750 miles only going WOT i think twice, during that period. At around 1000-1100miles I started noticing the knock on cold starts. Now I have 1600 miles and it makes a racket. The conditions upon which mine makes the noise is cold engine (first 5-7 minutes) and almost coast in any gear. IOW, if you take with a certain amount of throttle in gear, as the speed of the car catches up to the amount of throttle input held steady, the internals get to a sort of "equilibrium" state and the top end starts rattling. I am almost positive the issue is not piston slap. Its too high in the motor. It actually sounds like the camshafts are loose or the rockers are loose. Mine has been at the dealer since Monday and so far FMC has not released any public documentation acknowledging such a problem or a fix. I authorized the dealer to pull my valve covers and check clearances on all the parts under there. I asked to re-torque the cam tower caps as a preventitive measure. Upon receiving some pictures from the service manager, it made me wonder if the VCT (specifically the cam phasers) system was the culprit. Here is a pic from the RH head.
The full size is at: CAMS_Full_Size
I will update here as well as I partake on my journey for a fix.
Check my post "Really Disappointed with Ford"...mine does the exact same thing......not what you would expect out of a new $35K car
no one here is a ford engineer. i wouldnt worry about anything till ford says something is wrong. Its its the internet. 90% of it is peoeple thinking they heard something not normal, but its a brand new engine. so who knows whats normal or not
That's a good point. I'm going to wait until Ford, who would have absolutely no motive to skew facts or opinion on the subject, declares to all the world that they have a problem with their engines. In the meantime, all is perfect!
In other news.. I just hit 4K miles, and I decided to check the oil. It was a quart and 1/2 low, cold, with the car on a level surface. Interesting..
And also, I have a new noise under the hood. It almost sounds like rapidly puffing air or a vacuum leak, but, it sounds like it could be something mechanical, in the top end of the motor, too. Whatever it is, it doesn't sound good. The car is going to the dealership this week. I'm sick of this crap..
Travis
And also, I have a new noise under the hood. It almost sounds like rapidly puffing air or a vacuum leak, but, it sounds like it could be something mechanical, in the top end of the motor, too. Whatever it is, it doesn't sound good. The car is going to the dealership this week. I'm sick of this crap..
Travis
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This..:rockon:
they arent going to get away with it, if there is really any issues. I work at a dealer, zero of these cars have been back. Internet is full of bulsshit
they arent going to get away with it, if there is really any issues. I work at a dealer, zero of these cars have been back. Internet is full of bullshit Esp people on mustang forum who think they are engineers
LOL, we're all making it up. So are our dealers, who have unsuccessfully tried to fix the myriad of issues. They must be, because you work at a dealership and haven't seen any Mustangs come in for service.
then you shouldn't have bought a car with a 100% brand new drivetrain. your a guinea pig when you buy a first year car, because there will be issues.
That's fine.. I don't mind being a guinea pig, as long as Ford honors thier warranty, and stands behind thier product.
The puffing noise you hear from the intake that comes and goes is from the EVAP solenoid mounted on top of the throttle body. its a controlled vacuum leak by pulsing the solenoid. You can unplug it and it will stop, then the CEL will come on
I build race engines, and have done so for 10+ years. I'm not stupid, and it's not bullshit when you have a legitimate problem. My trans has a bearing issue or a lash issue, and, this motor definitely shouldn't have piston slap. It's a cast piston, which has high amounts of silicone, and does not expand a fraction of what a forged piston expands. Modern day engines shouldn't make noise.. The 330hp, 7500rpm engine in my 370z doesn't make noise. And, you know what? If it does, Nissan will take care of it.
I haven't gone to the dealership yet, but, I will not settle for anything less than a fix. Tell me something? If I went to sell this car, tomorrow.. do you think someone would buy it with the noise it's making? Hell no.. I took my buddy for a ride yesterday, and he was freaking out about it/asking me why I haven't taken it in yet. I told him that I didn't want to seem like I was being a pest, and I wanted to take it in once the problem was obvious. Ford had better stand behind this car, or, they'll be buying it back. I know my rights, and I have a good attorney. I plan to be courteous, and to the point with them upfront. If they give me the run-around, I'll do what needs to be done.
Travis
Kudos to you... you said it before I did.
I too have been building engines for years, everything from puny 90hp 4 bangers to 700hp V8s and diesels. Does this make me a Ford Engineer... no. Does this mean that I am full of sh1t as the other guy suggests? Hell no. It gives me the credibility and understanding to determine between internet BS and actual problems. I do not know if my engine has an actual problem yet. I am on quest to find out. Years of experience tells me that any engine that I have ever dealt with that made the noise I am experiencing, most certainly had a problem. To be ignorant of an issue because you believe the internet to be a place for people to whine about something they just spent 30K+ on is exactly that.... IGNORANT. When your engine scatters its internals right after the warranty expires because of an engineering design flaw, you will be happy that people like us brought it to light and gave YOU some credibility when YOU walk into your dealership whining about your 37K mile engine that erupted.
I see you're from BTR.. Do you ever come down to No Problem for midnight madness or test & tune?
I haven't been down there in a while. I was hoping that once I got this car broken in, that I might be able to head down to the track a couple of times and play around with it. However, the tracks have been closed since purchase and in light of this knocking issue, I haven't really beat up on it at all. I really would like to make one of their open lapping days.
UPDATE: Picked up from the dealer yesterday after the week long excursion of re-torquing the cam caps and checking clearances. Noise was still there on this 20*F morning this morning. If its quieter, its marginal. Back to drawing board. On the lighter side, Ford Customer Care has been excellent. They call to check in with me every couple of days. They contact the dealer for constant updates. They seem to listen to what I need and they are trying to do it. I requested to bring an engineer who has experience with these motors in to listen to this. She said she is going to try to get a 5.0 specialist but all the engineers are highly trained in these cars. I am going to drive the car for now and see if I can figure out the noise. I am going to try some things and see if it helps. I will report my findings as I get them.
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