L&m Airflow news

[klcmcse]

I have been trying o make up my mind on which TB and plenum as a next step......:shrug: Don't know if its official or been posted' This is the copy I recieved from Muscle Motors this AM:
Sorry Kevin L&M is out of business and we no longer have stock of their items. We do carry the Ford Racing/Accufab throttle bodies in stock. What application are you looking for?

________________________________________
From: Kevin Campbell [[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 10:30 AM
To: Jack
Subject: Website Inquiry from MMP L&M Airflow Store

 

[Red-GT500]

Cant go wrong with a 65mm twin from Ford Racing. I had one and swapped to the 72mm VMP unit. Both are great but the 65mm was so smooth and easy to drive.

 

[08KR525]

I've used the L&M throttle bodies and elbows on a couple of GT500s and they have performed flawlessly. Very high quality. The products are still available through different vendors, as well as, used ones in the market place here on SVTPerformance. I believe GForce Transmissions have taken over production of the L&M tb's and you can order one directly from them. GL.

 

[Blackmax]

They are a nice piece and will probobly go up in value.

 

[07 Black Beauty]

I have the Ford Racing twin 65 , it worked great w/ out even having the tune adjusted and the craftsmanship is top notch.

 

[breoland]

Not true... tb are still being made...I'll find out what's available

 

[PistolWhip]

G-Force Transmissions out of Cleona Pennsylvania is making and selling the L&M Throttle Body. Jim Larocca turned the operation over to Mike a few years ago and L&M Airflow basically was no more at that point. The TB's are still referred to as L&M TB's, but they are only sold by G-Force as far as I know. I had the 66mm TB on my car when I had a ported Eaton and it was a fantastic unit. I have a 72mm L&M now with my TVS and I've had quite a few problems with idle. I'm finding out that it's not a hardware issue, more of tuning issue as they require a bit of work to tune for, but the FRPP twin bore TB is one that has never caused any problems that I've heard of. Revan Racing has a couple of the FRPP TB's in stock and should be able to hook you up if you decide to go that route.

 

[1320 Junkie]

Call G force...Mike Long should have some cores on the shelf..takes a few weeks to get it built but well worth the wait.

 

[klcmcse]

My first thought was to go for an elbow and a frpp 65mm but JLT tells me its a no go on the CF 127mm CAI I just put on 12 days ago.......
kevin

 

[1320 Junkie]

My first thought was to go for an elbow and a frpp 65mm but JLT tells me its a no go on the CF 127mm CAI I just put on 12 days ago.......
kevin

The problem most people have is there is no trasfer function provided for the jlt maf housing. Thats why the bigger better flowing 66-72 mm l&m's get a bad rap. Its not the pieces themselves its the lack of a maf transfer curve for maf housing....your maf housing would have to be flowed on a flow bench to get a true curve. My tune is built with exactly the parameters I just explained...my car runs amazingly...no hanging idle..no pulsing throttle etc.

 

[Im1livewire]

The problem most people have is there is no trasfer function provided for the jlt maf housing. Thats why the bigger better flowing 66-72 mm l&m's get a bad rap. Its not the pieces themselves its the lack of a maf transfer curve for maf housing....your maf housing would have to be flowed on a flow bench to get a true curve. My tune is built with exactly the parameters I just explained...my car runs amazingly...no hanging idle..no pulsing throttle etc.

That's the best "in a nutshell" explanation I've read on this forum. Like yours, my L&M 66 is mated up perfectly to my FRPP CAI, thanks to the right tune.

 

[1320 Junkie]

That's the best "in a nutshell" explanation I've read on this forum. Like yours, my L&M 66 is mated up perfectly to my FRPP CAI, thanks to the right tune.

I owe my car running this good to Jim Larocca (Black Shelby)...the original developer of the L&M products. He flow benched the whipple 123mm maf housing and basically runs it on all 11+ cars in conjunction with a cj elbow and part # R0303 S&B filter in the stock cai housing with some slight modification to the opening where the maf gets mounted. I'm going to dyno tune my car today with my tuner Bill Miller @ Pro edge tuning...him and jimmy are friends and I'm lucky to have both of them on my tuning

 

[91svtbird]

It's good to see more members realize and see for themselves the importance and value in having the correct meter curve in their tune, how it should be achieved first on a professional flow bench that is capable of flowing the whole range of air flow for that meter combo and how it is the critical foundation to all other tuning parameters which will ensure safe and correct engine operation and drive-ability.
I only wish more would come to realize what is going on out there with most of the so called best tuners who alter and change known MAF transfer functions as standard practice to adjust for target A/F and how doing that will result in inaccuracies that can and do affect many aspects of the tune negatively affecting things like proper engine operation, accurate boost gauge readings and TB operation.

 

[Ray Lucca]

Does Black Shelby still do Tuning, where is his shop?? Email tunes, etc. Let us know
He has tuned your set-up, Tbird, right??? Thanx

 

[mustang loco]

91svtbird,I consider myself just the avrg car guy,even after reading on the subject,especially 1 particular thread,I get bits and pieces of it...all I can honestly say is after all the help from Black Shelby,the car runs,drives,reacts like night and day from the new tune.Couldn't be any happier with it!!

 

[91svtbird]

Does Black Shelby still do Tuning, where is his shop?? Email tunes, etc. Let us know
He has tuned your set-up, Tbird, right??? Thanx

No he's not in business anymore and doesn't have a shop. He has helped many with these cars who have asked him though. Jim has also helped and advise many tuners in the business willing to learn to better understand correct tuning.

If you are looking for a tuner who is in business and tunes correctly the same way Ford does (ie. uses correct flowed MAF transfer data without altering it) I would urge you to give Tasca Ford in RI a call and ask for Dennis. Yes Jim has tuned my car's.

 

[03 DSG Snake]

It's good to see more members realize and see for themselves the importance and value in having the correct meter curve in their tune, how it should be achieved first on a professional flow bench that is capable of flowing the whole range of air flow for that meter combo and how it is the critical foundation to all other tuning parameters which will ensure safe and correct engine operation and drive-ability.
I only wish more would come to realize what is going on out there with most of the so called best tuners who alter and change known MAF transfer functions as standard practice to adjust for target A/F and how doing that will result in inaccuracies that can and do affect many aspects of the tune negatively affecting things like proper engine operation, accurate boost gauge readings and TB operation.

What setup do you run?

 

[91svtbird]

What setup do you run?

On my 07GT500 I had the 2.3TVS blower, FRPP113CAI/HPX sensor, 10% lower, 1.7upper, L&M 66mmTB, Stainless works LT's, 80lb inj, FGT pumps, Larocca tuned, many other mods as well. Sold that car to get the 13', been extremely busy with work this year so I only have 550 miles on it. Haven't modded yet but have the Whipple 123( for extended meter range), and a L&M 66 ready to go once I reach 1000 mile mark. The way this car responds to tuning plus the L&M 66 it will be close to where my 07 was so I don't feel the need to go any further at this time.

 

[me32]

I owe my car running this good to Jim Larocca (Black Shelby)...the original developer of the L&M products. He flow benched the whipple 123mm maf housing and basically runs it on all 11+ cars in conjunction with a cj elbow and part # R0303 S&B filter in the stock cai housing with some slight modification to the opening where the maf gets mounted. I'm going to dyno tune my car today with my tuner Bill Miller @ Pro edge tuning...him and jimmy are friends and I'm lucky to have both of them on my tuning

I have to say IMO frpp cj 123 maf an the whipple 123maf seem to have the best drivabilty an it maybe cause both maf have been flow benched an data to tune them with ease.

 

[91svtbird]

I have to say IMO frpp cj 123 maf an the whipple 123maf seem to have the best drivabilty an it maybe cause both maf have been flow benched an data to tune them with ease.

Yes that is a very important factor. That plus the fact that both the Whipple 123 and the Ford 123 have a belmouth and filter stop in their inlet designs which smooths out the airflow before it reaches the MAF sensor. This is especially important in the 11's- 14's because of the added air introduced from the factory ram-air port at highway speeds. Turbulence has been seen to be an issue in other aftermarket meters that don't incorporate this feature. Ford has been designing their meters like this for years for good reason.