Got 4.10s Installed Plus Some Potential 3.73 Whining Causes

SteveWK

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So, I did have 3.73s installed and they were obnoxiously loud. I was going to go the 9" route but after pricing that out with a watts link and torque arm, it was insanely expensive. Not just a simple bolt in part for me, although I could have put the stock style BMR parts I have back in and not messed with the watts link and torque arm. Ultimately the final deciding factor was I found the 8.8 guru in the Wichita area and he charged me $350 for the install, it normally is $250 but he had to remove the entire housing because of my torque arm and that added to the cost. Also, I had a new set of FMS 4.10s, pinion bearing, and install kit sitting in my closet. Happy to report the 4.10s are nearly dead quiet. On a scale from 1 to 10, where 10 is my whiney 3.73s, the 4.10s are a 2 at the most. It is very pleasant to drive the car now plus I really like the 4.10s. It really is a blast to drive.

My 3.37s whined from day one. I had him check out the 3.73 install to see if there was anything that jumped out as the cause of all the whining. The gear pattern was ok according to him, but the pinion gear was loose. Loose meaning it turned easily with the carrier removed and the pinion nut still installed. I should have asked him to put a torque wrench on it and measure the drag. I know it was within spec before this install with a solid spacer. The carrier literally fell out which tells me there was absolutely no preload on the carrier bearings. I also noticed while driving the car and going through a right sweeping turn fast enough to apply a lateral load on the axel the whining would virtually disappear. This makes me think the lack of preload on the carrier bearings was at least in part the cause of the whining.

I spent quite a bit of time talking with the installer who is a mechanical engineer and does this in his spare time. Just listening to him, it sounds like he has built 100s of 8.8s and 9" rear ends. One thing he did tell me was that the S197 is tricky to get setup right. For whatever reason harmonics from the ring and pinion resonate with the S197's body. An example of this is a buddy of his had a loud set of gears in his S197, while getting it ready to sell, he installed the stock lower control arms and the whining disappeared. If my 4.10s start to whine, I'm going to take it back to find out what changed. I will keep you posted as time goes by.

If you live in the Wichita, KS area and need gears installed, msg me and I will give you his name and how to contact him. He does a good job.

Cheers
 

PM-Performance

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its not even just S197's.
My same FMS 373's with the same fluid in my SN95 whined like hell too. Both completely stock suspension and fully modified.

I thought the install was bad until my GT500 with the same exact components does the same exact thing
 

CobraBob

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Interesting thread. Good comments from your installer. Knowledgeable installers like him deserve a star in your list of preferred vendors. That's great that the annoying whining is gone after the 4.10 install. Now your exhaust can properly be the sound of choice.
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Jam421

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Good stuff Bud. Another factor might be to be patient with the break in. My 410's were broken in for 500 miles and have since suffered 100+ foot stomps at every level and still don't whine. On the other hand I also broke in my old 373's. After 450 miles of patient driving I stabbed the gas at 25mph ran thru the gears and my 373's whined instantly and never stopped . I also have now have the BMR UCA's which it appears from your comments do help with the whine but they most certainly helped get the dig LOL!
 

SteveWK

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its not even just S197's.
My same FMS 373's with the same fluid in my SN95 whined like hell too. Both completely stock suspension and fully modified.

I thought the install was bad until my GT500 with the same exact components does the same exact thing

I dunno. It's really odd especially with the 3.73s. Some whine from day one, some whine down the road, and on rare occasions some don't whine. Based on the mental tally I have kept of other people's experiences, the 4.10s seem to fair better, but they all start whining if you launch on a drag strip with sticky tires. I don't go to the strip, but I fully realize that mine will probably start to whine down the road. The real solution is a 9", but since I already had all of the parts and could get them installed by somebody that knows what they are doing for $350 bucks, I decided to role the dice. It would interesting if you could find a road with left and right sweeping turns and see if they stop whining with a moderate lateral load applied. Mine would nearly stop with a right sweeper.


Good stuff Bud. Another factor might be to be patient with the break in. My 410's were broken in for 500 miles and have since suffered 100+ foot stomps at every level and still don't whine. On the other hand I also broke in my old 373's. After 450 miles of patient driving I stabbed the gas at 25mph ran thru the gears and my 373's whined instantly and never stopped . I also have now have the BMR UCA's which it appears from your comments do help with the whine but they most certainly helped get the dig LOL!

He didn't mention a break in period lol. My first concern was whether my R888s were going to hold in second, and they don't. I bet I was WOT within the first 10 miles. Still no problems to speak of. I do have a slight whine between 50-60 mph, but even with just the AC blasting in the high 90 deg heat here, I don't hear it. I am going to try to tape some strips of lead wheel weights on the lower control arms and see if that dampens what little I do hear. I also have a torque arm and watts link. Both are connected directly to the pumpkin and then to the body. I'll post the results in this thread when I get my box of weights from Amazon.
 

CobraKid04

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Do you like the 4.10 more than the stock 3.31?...dumb question, but I'm still considering it for mine. Just worried it's to much gear.
 

SteveWK

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Yeah, I do like them for the street. The car is much easier to drive, especially from a stop. Rowing through the gears with a liberal amount of throttle is a blast. Now, if I was open tracking the car, I would have left the 3.31s in. Less shifting on a road course is better.
 

SteveWK

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Good stuff Bud. Another factor might be to be patient with the break in. My 410's were broken in for 500 miles and have since suffered 100+ foot stomps at every level and still don't whine. On the other hand I also broke in my old 373's. After 450 miles of patient driving I stabbed the gas at 25mph ran thru the gears and my 373's whined instantly and never stopped . I also have now have the BMR UCA's which it appears from your comments do help with the whine but they most certainly helped get the dig LOL!

Quick question, do you have both upper and lower BMR control arms?
 

me32

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Yeah, I do like them for the street. The car is much easier to drive, especially from a stop. Rowing through the gears with a liberal amount of throttle is a blast. Now, if I was open tracking the car, I would have left the 3.31s in. Less shifting on a road course is better.

The 3.31s imo sucked in the 07-09 Gt500. With the combination of the transmission gears and clutch it just was not a fun setup. The 3.73s for me were a huge improvement. I had mine do . At like 2000 miles on the car along with the Ford racing handling kit complete at the time.
 

SteveWK

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3.31s suck even more in the 13/14 because of the taller 1st and 2nd gear. I really enjoy rowing through the gears with fairly sticky tires (R888).
 

Jam421

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Steve....I just need the uppers (UCA) done but we also did the adjustable bracket. I forget where I'm set ( middle ?) but at first I was only a bit impressed. Until...he re-adjusted for better stratight line grip. Then there very noticeable improvement in straight line. I was advised this would be at the expense of deep twisty handling but so far just on streets & roads it holds all I want when I lean on it.
 

Jam421

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Steve....I just did the uppers (UCA) but we also did the adjustable bracket. I forget where I'm set
(middle ?) but at first I was only a bit impressed. Until...he re-adjusted for better straight line grip. Then there very noticeable improvement in straight line. I was advised this would be at the expense of deep twisty handling but so far just on streets & roads it holds all I want when I lean on it.
 

SteveWK

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Ok, thanks. Seems like stock lowers transmit less whine. Was curious if you still had the stock lowers and you do.
 

Robot_trainer

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So, I did have 3.73s installed and they were obnoxiously loud. I was going to go the 9" route but after pricing that out with a watts link and torque arm, it was insanely expensive. Not just a simple bolt in part for me, although I could have put the stock style BMR parts I have back in and not messed with the watts link and torque arm. Ultimately the final deciding factor was I found the 8.8 guru in the Wichita area and he charged me $350 for the install, it normally is $250 but he had to remove the entire housing because of my torque arm and that added to the cost. Also, I had a new set of FMS 4.10s, pinion bearing, and install kit sitting in my closet. Happy to report the 4.10s are nearly dead quiet. On a scale from 1 to 10, where 10 is my whiney 3.73s, the 4.10s are a 2 at the most. It is very pleasant to drive the car now plus I really like the 4.10s. It really is a blast to drive.

My 3.37s whined from day one. I had him check out the 3.73 install to see if there was anything that jumped out as the cause of all the whining. The gear pattern was ok according to him, but the pinion gear was loose. Loose meaning it turned easily with the carrier removed and the pinion nut still installed. I should have asked him to put a torque wrench on it and measure the drag. I know it was within spec before this install with a solid spacer. The carrier literally fell out which tells me there was absolutely no preload on the carrier bearings. I also noticed while driving the car and going through a right sweeping turn fast enough to apply a lateral load on the axel the whining would virtually disappear. This makes me think the lack of preload on the carrier bearings was at least in part the cause of the whining.

I spent quite a bit of time talking with the installer who is a mechanical engineer and does this in his spare time. Just listening to him, it sounds like he has built 100s of 8.8s and 9" rear ends. One thing he did tell me was that the S197 is tricky to get setup right. For whatever reason harmonics from the ring and pinion resonate with the S197's body. An example of this is a buddy of his had a loud set of gears in his S197, while getting it ready to sell, he installed the stock lower control arms and the whining disappeared. If my 4.10s start to whine, I'm going to take it back to find out what changed. I will keep you posted as time goes by.

If you live in the Wichita, KS area and need gears installed, msg me and I will give you his name and how to contact him. He does a good job.

Cheers
Any control arms with a better bushing (poly/spherical) will transmit any noise from the rear end straight into the floor which will act like a drum head and amplify the noise.
 

CobraKid04

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I put BMR poly LCA a few weeks ago. Definitely, more gear wine. Nothing major, just more than there was before. I'm still on 3.31 gears.
 

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