2014 GT 500 Catastrophic Engine Failure: Next Steps? Thoughts?

Mulholland Man · Oct 8, 2020

Steve@TF said:
Couldnt you toss a 5.4 with KB in there and achieve the same power for a fraction of the cost?

I wouldnt go E85 in this area. Thats a long way to rely on a getting to the gas station (7 miles). With a car that gets poor mpg lol. We had fun with that with an NGV civic that got 40mpg. Had a few oh shit moments with gas stations lol.

As to the 5.4. I looked and saw a built 5.4 MOTOR for around 20k. That's not much cheaper than my current plan AND the short block in that motor wasn't built to the specs I'm looking at with L&M. Ford Doesn't sell the 5.4 block any longer that I know of (let me know if I'm wrong), though MMR does (refurbished?) ALso the 5.4 Block weighs 100 more pounds if memory serves. If your gonna do it, do it right I figure. Catmonkey swapped his 5.4 for an ALuminum 5.8 for weight savings, better heat transfer/ power, etc. I would hate to work backwards.

On the E85 front, Believe me, I've thought of that. I never let my fuel levels get that low to begin with. I just get to know the gas station attendants like they are extended family!! Good news is that with the NGauge I could just toggle between tunes if it came down to it. If I was somewhere I couldn't get E85, I could just flash the 91 tune and fill up with regular gas. Your supposed to be next to empty before switching between E85 and pump gas anyway. As it stands I get 170 Miles per tank. Figure I'd get 25% LESS miles wtih E85, say 130 to tank. My driving universe is within a few miles of my house (work 1 mile from home for last 15 years) so I would never be in a situation where I was outside distance from E85 or pump gas. And I always fill up around 1/4 to 1/2 tank so I don't dredge up crap in bottom of fuel tank.

Catmonkey · Oct 8, 2020

Mulholland Man said:
Catmonkey swapped his 5.4 for an ALuminum 5.8 for weight savings, better heat transfer/ power, etc. I would hate to work backwards.

2011 and 2012 had aluminum block 5.4s, so my decision to swap blocks was not due to weight savings. I had slight flame cutting on the deck between 7 and 8 from a blown head gasket. The engine was going to have to come apart and the block decked, and there's no way it was going back together with stock components. When the 2013 debuted the aluminum block's weren't that expensive and it cured my 5.8 envy, so it was stuffed with much stouter pieces instead. I still have my original low mile short block in storage. I figured it's not a bad thing to have an aluminum block available if I ever needed it, and can to sleeved and bored to the same bore diameter as the 5.8.

If you're going balls out high boost racing using a smaller bore gives you slightly more deck surface between cylinders, which isn't a bad thing to consider. Too bad Ford didn't have the foresight to use a larger bore pitch when they designed the modular engine.

Steve@TF · Oct 8, 2020

Mulholland Man said:
As to the 5.4. I looked and saw a built 5.4 MOTOR for around 20k. That's not much cheaper than my current plan AND the short block in that motor wasn't built to the specs I'm looking at with L&M. Ford Doesn't sell the 5.4 block any longer that I know of (let me know if I'm wrong), though MMR does (refurbished?) ALso the 5.4 Block weighs 100 more pounds if memory serves. If your gonna do it, do it right I figure. Catmonkey swapped his 5.4 for an ALuminum 5.8 for weight savings, better heat transfer/ power, etc. I would hate to work backwards.

On the E85 front, Believe me, I've thought of that. I never let my fuel levels get that low to begin with. I just get to know the gas station attendants like they are extended family!! Good news is that with the NGauge I could just toggle between tunes if it came down to it. If I was somewhere I couldn't get E85, I could just flash the 91 tune and fill up with regular gas. Your supposed to be next to empty before switching between E85 and pump gas anyway. As it stands I get 170 Miles per tank. Figure I'd get 25% LESS miles wtih E85, say 130 to tank. My driving universe is within a few miles of my house (work 1 mile from home for last 15 years) so I would never be in a situation where I was outside distance from E85 or pump gas. And I always fill up around 1/4 to 1/2 tank so I don't dredge up crap in bottom of fuel tank.

if im not mistaken an iron 5.4 can hit your desired power levels in stock configuration, or close to it. unless youre racing or tracking often i dont think the weight penalty would be an issue. im just looking at from a cost/benefit perspective. you can buy a motor out of a wrecked car and slap a KB on it and have a street terror for far less. even the aluminum 5.4 can probably hold quite a bit as well im sure. unless you plan on going balls out i just couldnt see spending $30k and waiting a few years to make it happen. and if you do go balls out, plan to do other supporting mods and for it to break again and have issues. the less complex it is, the more time you will have to drive it and enjoy it. ive seen plenty of people go down that road and have nothing but problems. just being the little angel on your shoulder, the other guy (devil) is saying "fck it! build the racecar!" lol. hey if you got the money and the patience you do you booboo

Mulholland Man · Oct 8, 2020

Steve, thanks for your thoughts. I looked into MMR a little closer and realized that they do make the 5.4 block in either Cast Iron or Aluminum and their prodcut does seem to be a lot more affordable than L&M and even JDM 5.8s. Good thing is that they are very close my house too. 6 Mo. Warranty standard and Extended 12 Mo. warranty available. See package below fro 1500 HP rated "Cast Iron" Base level block. Fully optioned w/ Aluminium (Alloy?) Block is also shown below:

#1: Base Price for Cast Iron Block (aobout 140lbs heavier than Stock Block per MMR)

#2 OPTIONS

Price of MMR 5.4 Cast Iron MMR Block W Forged Internals rated at 1500 HP FULLY OPTIONED (No Sleeves)= $7,649.93

Price of MMR 5.8 Aluminum MMR Block W Forged Internals rated at 1500 HP FULLY OPTIONED (No Sleeves) = $11,649.92 (Believe this is What Catmonkey went with when he got his MMR Block)

JDM's build is about a grand more if I recall and they use the H Beam forged Manley Rods, not the I Beam forged rods. L&M is around 3-4k more for similar materials and build but how freaking sweet do those Diamond Pistons look eh? LOL.

Steve@TF · Oct 8, 2020

Whoa whoa whao i didnt mention mmr lol

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Mulholland Man · Oct 8, 2020

Steve@TF said:
Whoa whoa whao i didnt mention mmr lol

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No Sir, you did not mention MMR. Its just that every time I do a search online for new blocks their name comes up. I have noticed that many forum members use their "parts" on their builds (See Nate Rider's 1500 HP build online) and that Catmonkey had them build his small block which has worked well for him. They are 15 miles from my house and their product costs thousands less than others.

I heard what you said Steve about finding a "junked" GT500 block somewhere, but really? Is that even possible? There aren't that many of our cars made to begin with and I'm imagining when junk yards get them they strip and sell the valuables on them pretty quick. I would be open to looking but sounds like a bit of a rabbit hole. Next best option would be to go with a new block from someone "like" MMR. I like the way my car handles the twisties and putting another 140 lbs in the front I think would compromise that. So still thinking I'll go with a built alum 5.4 or 5.8 block. Anyway. This is all a ways away. Itll take some time to save. I will make sure to post when I get into the build. Love this forum. THanks for everyone's input.

And Catmonkey, your ride is SICK!!! Freaking love that car. Just beautiful. You and BiminiLX have ridonculous rides.

Mulholland Man · Oct 8, 2020

What kind of time and labor would I be looking at to dissassemble the top end to remove the heads for inspection? I need to know if my heads can be Machined back to health or if I'm SOL. Apparently Ford Doesn't manufacture new heads for the 13-14's anymore so you can't buy new replacements.

Streetpwr281 · Oct 8, 2020

Devil here again

. Don’t put a 5.4L in your 13/14 GT500. I’m looking for a modded 13/14 now to purchase and if it doesn’t have an aluminum 5.8L in it (as came originally) I’m swiping right by. Yeah you may save $5k now but I believe at some point you’ll regret it.

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ShelbyGT5HUN · Oct 9, 2020

Devil here too... You daily the car, so you might be more prone to getting in an accident, than a Cars and Coffee garage/dyno queen. I'd be a little cautious about putting 30k into a motor, that depending on the hit the car takes, might not be salvageable. Maybe look into some kind of rider on your insurance. Just sayin...

Streetpwr281 said:
Devil here again . Don’t put a 5.4L in your 13/14 GT500. I’m looking for a modded 13/14 now to purchase and if it doesn’t have an aluminum 5.8L in it (as came originally) I’m swiping right by. Yeah you may save $5k now but I believe at some point you’ll regret it.

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Streetpwr281 · Oct 9, 2020

I was simply saying if your already committing to spending $30k over 3yrs why not go balls to the wall and push $40k with all the goodies. Top notch everything. I’m not condoning the spend in your situation but if your going big then legitimately go big! Now, given that your still planning to use this car as a regular driver and appear to only want ~ 800rwhp I would get that JDM $11k 5.8L shortblock w new 5.8L alum block, h-beams, CobraJet crank, forged pistons, billet opg’s, etc. Send JDM your heads to be evaluated, freshened up, and installed on said shortblock. Ship back, have installed, and enjoy your car again for < $20k. That motor will take 1000rwhp safely tuned. I daily drove my 13 GT500 for over 25,000 miles w no issues at 780rwhp w the factory longblock. You don’t need a 1500hp capable motor for your purposes. My $.02

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geoffmt · Oct 9, 2020

Step outside the box and call Nelson Racing in chatsworth. They are starting coyote crate engines, he did that wild code red Shelby. He may be able to do something for the 5.8 for you. Hell, you may end up with twin symmetrical turbos and 1400hp

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dale.baker · Oct 9, 2020

Streetpwr281 said:
I was simply saying if your already committing to spending $30k over 3yrs why not go balls to the wall and push $40k with all the goodies. Top notch everything. I’m not condoning the spend in your situation but if your going big then legitimately go big! Now, given that your still planning to use this car as a regular driver and appear to only want ~ 800rwhp I would get that JDM $11k 5.8L shortblock w new 5.8L alum block, h-beams, CobraJet crank, forged pistons, billet opg’s, etc. Send JDM your heads to be evaluated, freshened up, and installed on said shortblock. Ship back, have installed, and enjoy your car again for < $20k. That motor will take 1000rwhp safely tuned. I daily drove my 13 GT500 for over 25,000 miles w no issues at 780rwhp w the factory longblock. You don’t need a 1500hp capable motor for your purposes. My $.02

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I agree with these comments. I have 806 RWHP from my JDM built motor and it is impossible to hook up with 20" drag radials. Now, let's put some 15" Sticky Mickeys on this car and now we have something that will hook up on the track. But our current 8.8" rear end won't handle the additional torque! No tire is going to hook up on the street with 800RWHP let alone 1000-1200RWHP. Thus the comment here is correct. Bragging at the local car show you have 1200HP is all well and good but when it comes to hooking up this is where the fun factor sets in with these cars. Remember Demonology's quote "Spinning Aint Winning. Good luck with your build process.

gimmie11s · Oct 9, 2020

5.4 iron block build... It wont cost you more than $5-6k and will hold 1000whp.

Built aluminum 5.8.. lol No. What a waste of cash. Hell, I'd coyote swap a 13/14 car before i spent $20k+ on putting another 5.8 in one if the original motor popped.

Streetpwr281 · Oct 9, 2020

I disagree. Built JDM 5.8L alum shortblock is $11k. He may need cylinder heads either way but if an iron 5.4L built shortblock is $6k I’m spending that extra $5k all day long for the proper aluminum 5.8L engine. It’s a $45k+ car not a 4cyl swap fox body.

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gimmie11s · Oct 9, 2020

Streetpwr281 said:
I disagree. Built JDM 5.8L alum shortblock is $11k. He may need cylinder heads either way but if an iron 5.4L built shortblock is $6k I’m spending that extra $5k all day long for the proper aluminum 5.8L engine. It’s a $45k+ car not a 4cyl swap fox body.

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Depends on what his goals are. If resale is a high priority then sure.

If resale is not a high priority, why on earth would you waste $5k on the "proper" block material? And who GAF if it's a $45k car.. what does that have to do with anything at all?

Streetpwr281 · Oct 9, 2020

If you own any asset resale always has to be a consideration to some degree. I point out the cars value as the impairment to said value is much greater than say a $3500 4cyl Fox body. Many buy the 2011+ GT500’s for the lighter weight aluminum block and many spend for the 13/14 for the added displacement along with other improvements. He may not be thinking resale near term but if I had $5k for every Mustang I said I’d never sell I would personally be rich. But to each his own just my advise to consider as he wishes. No 100% right answer here.

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gimmie11s · Oct 9, 2020

Streetpwr281 said:
If you own any asset resale always has to be a consideration to some degree. I point out the cars value as the impairment to said value is much greater than say a $3500 4cyl Fox body. Many buy the 2011+ GT500’s for the lighter weight aluminum block and many spend for the 13/14 for the added displacement along with other improvements. He may not be thinking resale near term but if I had $5k for every Mustang I said I’d never sell I would personally be rich. But to each his own just my advise to consider as he wishes. No 100% right answer here.

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The 5.8 vs. 5.4 displacement difference itself is worth almost 0 in actual performance.

Also, I would pay more for a used 13/14 GT500 with a built iron motor capable of handling 1000whp every day of the week and 2x on Sunday.

For the purists who are more concerned about the polished luster on your brake reservoir cover, then i guess i understand the point.

Streetpwr281 · Oct 9, 2020

gimmie11s said:
The 5.8 vs. 5.4 displacement difference itself is worth almost 0 in actual performance.

Also, I would pay more for a used 13/14 GT500 with a built iron motor capable of handling 1000whp every day of the week and 2x on Sunday.

For the purists who are more concerned about the polished luster on your brake reservoir cover, then i guess i understand the point.

Yeah we clearly disagree. It’s all good though. To each his own.

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MG0h3 · Oct 9, 2020

JFC so glad I never bought one of these things.

If I had, the minute I discovered the rebuild costs I would’ve unloaded it.

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Steve@TF · Oct 9, 2020

Resale value kind of geos out the window when you dump $30k into your $45k car that is now worth $40k

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2014 GT 500 Catastrophic Engine Failure: Next Steps? Thoughts?

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