2.80 or 2.93 pulley?

[Trmn8er]

Don't need a 2.8 pulley!

Kenne Brown has answered all our questions in a test published in the June issue of Muscle Mustangs & Fast Fords.

According to KB to get the best bang for your buck, do the following:

1) Cat-back
2) Cold Air Intake
3) 3 inch pulley
4) Chip it!

According to KB, pullies smaller than 3.0 inches provide no more gain than a 3.0" due to blower limitations.

You can argue with me! But I don't think you can question Kenne Brown! :thumbsup:

 

[JKD COBRA]

Trmn8er - didnt we already go over this? the 3.1 pulley will NOT make as much hp or tq as a 2.93 or 2.80.

 

[Trmn8er]

Read the article!

KevinJKD,

Read the article! Kenne Brown optimized his ECU with a KB 3.0" pulley. He dyno'ed 473HP. I'm not optimized yet. He had no HP gain when switched to a KB 2.80" pulley. Boost pressure did increase some but he stated that it did not equate to more power due to blower limitations.

Again, you can disagree with me since I'm no expert. But Kenne Brown is! If you disagree with him, maybe you should publish your data and start your own speed shop! :bash:

 

[silvercoffin]

hmmm

Well depends on which expert you talk to. Maybe with all those mods that pulley is the best.

 

[JKD COBRA]

firs of all, do you mean kenny brown or kenne belle?

Second, like silver coffin said, it depends. Thats great he got all the power he needed with a 3.10, but that doesn't mean a 3.10 will make the most max power, it just can't. Didn't nitrous pete make over 550rwhp with a lower/upper pulley at around 20psi? And then he made 700 with an 80 shot (this was before he had the KB, this was all done with the eaton)

I am not saying that this is good for the eaton, it has been shown that the eaton loses effeciency over 13-14psi, but just because you push it past that doesn't mean you will not make any more power.

So he dynoed at 473? I have seen a lot of 03 owners that are just normal people that don't own shops dyno at 470 and much more. I am not trying to argue, I am just saying that the 2.80 pulley will make more power because its making more boost, thats it.

 

[Trmn8er]

My Bad!

Yeah, I mean Kenne Bell!

Second point, he used a 3.00" pulley, not a 3.10". His 3.00" is closer to the "standard" Lightning 2.93 pulley. Not my 3.10.

The point he made and the point I want others to understand is that for the normal "daily driver" guy, going crazy on pullies isn't necessary. You can use the more conservative sizes and make serious HP without over-spinning the Eaton blower.

The mods Kenne Belle did are safe and anybody should feel comfortable having them done. And they will net you 475HP at the wheels!

I think this is good info for anybody who has not modded their Cobra yet but wants too.

That's all!:beer:

 

[JKD COBRA]

I totally agree about that, the 3.1 pulley is able to make good numbers, and for the street this pulley would be just fine. I just thought you meant that the 3.0 pulley maxed out the supercharger, although it may put the supercharger to its max effeciency, you can still squeeze more out of it. I get what your saying though, looks like we are finally on the same page!:read:

 

[mkdiehl]

why do you say the 3.1 would be just fine for the street, when a 2.8 would be better. when you are not in the boost, there shouldn't be any difference; right? why would one not go for the 2.8 even for the street? some would say that the stock power is "just fine" for the street, but if you are after more power, why not go to the max at a 2.8?

not arguing, just shopping at the moment

 

[silvercoffin]

hehehe

ALright i have the 2.80 and a chip. No belt slippage from I can tell or from what the dyno shows. Gained 45hp and 95lbs TQ with a "safe tune"

I have no other power mods aside from CHip and pulley.



The car went from great to unbelievable! SICK!

and from 12.56 to 12.06 at the track! I think there are 11s in it!

Ran 12.06 @ 115mph with 1.83 60ft

last night ran 12.08 @ 116.65 with a 1.95 60 ft!

If I combine that best 60 with the higher trap speed= 11.9! or 11.8!

 

[JKD COBRA]

mkdiehl - what I meant was, for the people who want just alittle more hp than what an exhaust/CAI will give them, than a 3.1 pulley can do the job. But even if your not in boost with the 2.80 pulley the blower is still spinning faster all the time. So far this does not seem to be a problem, but it will create more heat and you might want to change the blower oil more often. The better heat exchanger from PHP would be a good idea too.

It just depends on how much hp you want.

 

[SinisterX]

How often should we change blower oil?

 

[silvercoffin]

??

BLOWER OIL

I find it interesting that Ford says nothing in the manual about changing the oil. When I had my new pulley installed I was told that I needed new oil already and that if I am going to continue racing all the time I should check the oil every year.

 

[Trmn8er]

I see the top fill plug. Where's the bottom drain plug on the blower?

 

[Z20WHAT]

What are the experiences with the 2.8" upper and 4# lower??

I want to do that, but I drive my car everyday and don't want my car crapping out on me any time soon!

Thanks.

 

[Trmn8er]

Z20WHAT,

I would not recommend that combination if you are wanting a 'daily driver'. That combo is good for racing applications only when you don't worry about damage or cost to repair if something goes south! IMO.

A lot of info is out there that suggests that the common Lightning pulley, 2.93", is as small as you need to go on the street. That pulley with a cat-back, CAI and a chip will put you in the 450-475 RWHP range.

That's plenty to have one heck of a party every time you get behind the wheel!

 

[SVTdubs]

I would think 2.80 would be ok for a daily driver or am I smoking something???

 

[Trmn8er]

00SVTdubs,

The pulley debate will go on for a long time. For what it's worth, here's my assessment of the relevant data so far.

1) No one really knows how long the Eaton M112 blower will last on the Cobra. The car has been out for less than a year.
2) Blowers on the Lightning suggest that they are durable and will go the distance.
3) The Cobra engine's RPM limit is higher than the Ligthning engine, hence the different stock pulley sizes for the two vehicles.
4) The Eaton M112 is limited by thermal inefficiences at a given blower RPM speed.
5) Once the limit is reached, gains fall off dramatically vs. blower speed.
6) The faster you spin the blower, whether you are in boost or not, the quicker it will wear out.
7) So you must balance pulley size vs. thermal efficiency,
8) Experts have tested the Cobra with complimentary mods, i.e. cat-bak, CAI and chip and determined that a pulley around 3.00" is approaching the limit of efficiency.
9) The Lightning stock pulley, 2.93", is close enough to this limit.
10) Anything more gives decreasing returns in performance and will wear out the M112 quicker than it's design life.
11) Will the 2.80" wear it out that much quicker? We don't know. Only time will tell.

Is a 2.80" OK to run on the street? Yes. Is it the best choice? IMO, no. Stay close to 3.00". 2.93" being the most common size at this point.

 

[silvercoffin]

hehe

well the expert i talked to claims that the 2.80 pulley with no lower pulley change puts the eaton just at its peak potential.

I guess Ill find out. Actually I have the JDM Kit so I could try another pulley and see how the car runs.

I dont understand what this belt slippage is that people are talking about???? I dont seem to have any, but keep hearing people talk about it.


Heck if the blower goes, ill put the kenny Bell on!

 

[Trmn8er]

Heck silvercoffin,

If you can afford to put the Kenne Bell twin-screw blower on, I'd do it now! Sounds like a sweet setup!

 

[dkd58]

Originally posted by MineralGray03
1st Dyno 438.8 rwhp at 474.3 Max torque w/h flowmasters

2nd Dyno 456.0 rwhp at 506.4 Max torque w/h Magnaflows (Much Better)

Sounds good! I just got back from a drive after doing a complete Magnaflow exhaust install w/cat-x & cat-backs. I was running a stock exhaust w/Flowmaster 2-chambers. I have a dyno scheduled for tomorrow so I hope to see results similsr to yours. Last run before Magnaflow was 448/456. Could be looking at 460/480 or better? We shall see... So where you gettin' all that torque anyway?