Best Street Suspension - Opinions Welcome!

[Lucky_13]

Hey All,

So after going through a few set ups and still not finding quite what I want, I thought I'd turn to the forums. My goal is to have a streetable car (95% street) with the best performance possible. Car is a 2013 Brembo Pack GT, and is driven on Michigan/Detroit area roads as well as in New York twice a year.

I've had these set-ups in the past year:
1) Koni Yellow + K Spring --> Thought I was going to pee blood
2)Koni's + Steeda Sport (Linear) --> Sam Strano's recommend, don't get where people say these are "like stock" - definitely much firmer.
3) (Current) Koni's + BMR's --> Decent ride until it's not, bottoms out a lot on these roads and highway seams (bump stops are trimmed). Feels a bit floppier than the brembo stuff, too. Also kind of lower than I thought, although that might be due to the Koni's being shorter.

If money were no object, what would be your personal recommend to preserve as much ride quality as possible while gaining handling? Feel free to tell me if this is unrealistic if that's your thought. Might go to boss springs and keep the yellows, but the increased compression on the yellows might be part of the problem.

Especially interested to hear from people with high-end set-ups like the KW V3's etc. Or the FRPP adjustable handling kit, heard good things.

Thanks in advance! :beer:

 

[NickSezz]

What do you have the yellows set at in regard to rebound stiffness? Sounds like the may be set too stiff.

That said, I run the Roush Extreme springs. They worked well with the stock shocks/struts and even better with the Strange 10 ways I have now.

 

[Lucky_13]

What do you have the yellows set at in regard to rebound stiffness? Sounds like the may be set too stiff.

That said, I run the Roush Extreme springs. They worked well with the stock shocks/struts and even better with the Strange 10 ways I have now.

Hey Nick,

I've run them on full soft for the most part. Cranking them up on the roads I drive on makes the car near unbearable.

Those Roush Extremes sound interesting, especially if they worked well with the stock shocks/struts. Do you know if they'd give anything away to the stock brembo springs in terms of performance? The 5% of non-street driving I do is autocross, not strip, so transitional behavior is more important to me than squat.

Thanks!

 

[BV600]

I had BMR Springs, Steeda Pro action, GT500 mounts and BMR Panhard. Loved that setup. I had it in Germany, so I threw the autobahn and nurburgring at it. Smooth ride.

Now on my 14' I have H&R Race, Koni STR.T, GT500 mounts and BMR panhard, its ok not great bouncy and noisey. Ive had noise in the front which I suspect is the struts, Ive checked all bolts/nuts over 4 or 5 times. I will probablly switch in a couple months. I will probablly go with BMR springs again and Steedas or try something new.

 

[blackbeast12]

Read my signature , i found my set up to work perfectly, giving you complete control of your car in every situation. My tires are staggered nitto invos!

 

[bam2012@TBR]

I have dd my car on k-springs and d-specs for about 30k. I currently run the shocks at 4 turns off stiff. Are you still on stock wheels and tires?

Maybe you should look into stock brembo front springs with the brembo rear only lowering springs, I think its like a 1/2" drop. I don't think you are going to get lower and a better than stock ride, sorry since i'm sure this isn't what you want to hear.

http://www.brembo50.com/Default.aspx?pageId=1200846

 

[natedog_1959]

If money is no object, I would look at AST, KW V3, Moton, Ohlins, Cortex etc. These are all going to be coil-over setups with full adjustability for height, compression and rebound. You are probably looking at $3k+ for any of the above although there is a gent in the for sale section selling some KW V3's for $1700!!! I'm personally looking at the AST's (used). The guys at Vorshlag are pretty respectable and are more oriented towards road course setups rather than drag racing.

 

[Action Bronson]

Hey All,

So after going through a few set ups and still not finding quite what I want, I thought I'd turn to the forums. My goal is to have a streetable car (95% street) with the best performance possible. Car is a 2013 Brembo Pack GT, and is driven on Michigan/Detroit area roads as well as in New York twice a year.

2)Koni's + Steeda Sport (Linear) --> Sam Strano's recommend, don't get where people say these are "like stock" - definitely much firmer.

I'm getting ready to install this set up in the near future, just waiting for some extra cash for BMR lca and relo brackets.

While I understand that these are definitely a firmer ride, were they uncomfortable? Seems like the rule of thumb is you gotta sacrifice some comfort for performance.

My last lowered car had Eibach pro-kits and KYB gr2 struts/shocks and they felt like they were going to rattle the fillings out of my teeth when going over rough roads and highways. And on larger bumps and cracks, I thought I was going to bounce my head off the roof. I don't mind a firm ride, but I definitely don't want to land myself in the same situation as before.

I rode in my buddies lowered G35 today, and while it was a firm ride I barely noticed the rough patches of road I used to dread driving over in my last ride. Unfortunately he bought it used like that so he has no idea what he's riding on. Felt very BMW like. I'm hoping the Koni Yellow and Steeda sports get me close to that feeling.

 

[Lucky_13]

I have dd my car on k-springs and d-specs for about 30k. I currently run the shocks at 4 turns off stiff. Are you still on stock wheels and tires?

Maybe you should look into stock brembo front springs with the brembo rear only lowering springs, I think its like a 1/2" drop. I don't think you are going to get lower and a better than stock ride, sorry since i'm sure this isn't what you want to hear.

Hey bam, yep, stock tires (255 pirelli's) on 19 inch flow formed wheels. No worries, I think it's a safe bet, too. Thanks for your advice!

Brembo50.com - 55D Spring Kit

If money is no object, I would look at AST, KW V3, Moton, Ohlins, Cortex etc. These are all going to be coil-over setups with full adjustability for height, compression and rebound. You are probably looking at $3k+ for any of the above although there is a gent in the for sale section selling some KW V3's for $1700!!! I'm personally looking at the AST's (used). The guys at Vorshlag are pretty respectable and are more oriented towards road course setups rather than drag racing.

Hey nate, been looking into that stuff but not sure if they'd target what I'd want to. I took your advice and called Vorshlag, however, see below for details!

I'm getting ready to install this set up in the near future, just waiting for some extra cash for BMR lca and relo brackets.

While I understand that these are definitely a firmer ride, were they uncomfortable? Seems like the rule of thumb is you gotta sacrifice some comfort for performance.

My last lowered car had Eibach pro-kits and KYB gr2 struts/shocks and they felt like they were going to rattle the fillings out of my teeth when going over rough roads and highways. And on larger bumps and cracks, I thought I was going to bounce my head off the roof. I don't mind a firm ride, but I definitely don't want to land myself in the same situation as before.

I rode in my buddies lowered G35 today, and while it was a firm ride I barely noticed the rough patches of road I used to dread driving over in my last ride. Unfortunately he bought it used like that so he has no idea what he's riding on. Felt very BMW like. I'm hoping the Koni Yellow and Steeda sports get me close to that feeling.

Hey Action,

I know I go very much against the grain in the mustang community, but I did not like that set up. It was borderline, and over some NY roads seams I'd catch air off the seat. Car felt "heavier" and more sturdy for sure, but still had enough roll that I'd say the trade-off wasn't worth it. I had yellows on some of my past project cars and they've all been firm, and you'll notice that if you google it for other applications people say the same.

Taking Nate's advice, I dialed up Jason at Vorshlag who was very helpful. Jason took the time to explain to me that the twin-tube setup in the Koni's, while great for budget, doesn't allow for a very large piston diameter and enough digressive damping characteristics to filter out a lot of high-frequency responses - i.e. road imperfections - the way a monotube damper would. To be clear, I'm not expecting stock-like ride quality, but I feel that with the yellows my handling actually decreases over imperfect roads. On the other hand, he said, it's hard to beat Koni Yellows for a budget autocross shock.

In short, my issues with suspension were in fact due to the Yellows, which would explain why the spring changes didn't do the trick.

For a high-end street shock, he recommended me this package: Vorshlag-Bilstein StreetPro Monotube Suspension Kit (S197 Mustang) - Vorshlag LLC

Monotube Bilstein's with Ford P Springs. There's a video showing ride vs stock, and it doesn't look bad at all. Looks like great damping over the nasty bits! (railroad tracks, etc).

Anyone in the same predicament, I highly recommend dialing up the guys at Vorshlag. They didn't try to oversell me on the AST's (in fact, recommended me away from them). I'll be doing a review on the package when I get it in, and letting you all know if it compares favorably to the Yellow combinations I've run (fingers crossed!).

Also, if anyone is interested in purchasing lightly used Yellows, K Springs, Steeda Sports, or BMR springs, let me know!!

:beer:

 

[macbar13]

I rode in my buddies lowered G35 today, and while it was a firm ride I barely noticed the rough patches of road I used to dread driving over in my last ride. Unfortunately he bought it used like that so he has no idea what he's riding on. Felt very BMW like. I'm hoping the Koni Yellow and Steeda sports get me close to that feeling.

I had steeda sport springs and you are not going to get a bmw like ride. They were tolerable on the street but they are pretty firm. I switched to the BMR springs, which are lower and have spring rates closer to stock. Still a firm ride due to the shorter spring, but much more tolerable for the street. And while springs with a rate closer to stock will pitch and lean a little more than stiffer springs, I think in the real world they "handle" better. When you are flying around turns on bumpy roads, the lower spring rate will soak up the bump instead of bouncing off of it, which makes the car jump around. On a racetrack... sure use the stiffer spring.

Here are some numbers that I found. Not sure if these are correct or not.

Stock......Front Sway/Rear Sway/Front Spring/Rear Springs
Base GT.....34.6 mm.....24mm.......123 lbs......156 lbs
Brembo......34.6 mm.....24mm.......131 lbs......167 lbs
Boss 302....34.6 mm.....25mm.......148 lbs......186 lbs
Laguna Sec. 34.6 mm.....26mm.......137 lbs......191 lbs

Eibach Pro Kit Front: 171-230 progressive
Eibach Pro Kit Rear: 110-200 progressive

BMR SP009 Front: 120-165 lb progressive
BMR Sp009 Rear: 130 lb linear

555-8206 Steeda Ultra Lites - 195lb front, 175lb rear
555-8215 Steeda Sport Springs 200lb front, 175lb rear
555-8245 New Steeda Comp Springs Boss 302 and GT 225lb front, 195lb rear.

 

[macbar13]

Anyone in the same predicament, I highly recommend dialing up the guys at Vorshlag. They didn't try to oversell me on the AST's (in fact, recommended me away from them). I'll be doing a review on the package when I get it in, and letting you all know if it compares favorably to the Yellow combinations I've run (fingers crossed!).

Also, if anyone is interested in purchasing lightly used Yellows, K Springs, Steeda Sports, or BMR springs, let me know!!

:beer:

I'm interested in your results. I've been pretty happy with the BMR/Koni setup I have now, but I'm always open to ideas. It took me a while playing with the koni rebound adjusters to get what I think is a decent ride for being pretty low.

Ever consider airbags? I've never ridden in a "bagged" car, so I'm hesitant about the ride/handling.

 

[Lucky_13]

I had steeda sport springs and you are not going to get a bmw like ride. They were tolerable on the street but they are pretty firm. I switched to the BMR springs, which are lower and have spring rates closer to stock. Still a firm ride due to the shorter spring, but much more tolerable for the street. And while springs with a rate closer to stock will pitch and lean a little more than stiffer springs, I think in the real world they "handle" better. When you are flying around turns on bumpy roads, the lower spring rate will soak up the bump instead of bouncing off of it, which makes the car jump around. On a racetrack... sure use the stiffer spring.

Here are some numbers that I found. Not sure if these are correct or not.

Stock......Front Sway/Rear Sway/Front Spring/Rear Springs
Base GT.....34.6 mm.....24mm.......123 lbs......156 lbs
Brembo......34.6 mm.....24mm.......131 lbs......167 lbs
Boss 302....34.6 mm.....25mm.......148 lbs......186 lbs
Laguna Sec. 34.6 mm.....26mm.......137 lbs......191 lbs

Eibach Pro Kit Front: 171-230 progressive
Eibach Pro Kit Rear: 110-200 progressive

BMR SP009 Front: 120-165 lb progressive
BMR Sp009 Rear: 130 lb linear

555-8206 Steeda Ultra Lites - 195lb front, 175lb rear
555-8215 Steeda Sport Springs 200lb front, 175lb rear
555-8245 New Steeda Comp Springs Boss 302 and GT 225lb front, 195lb rear.

Agreed, don't expect BMW from a solid rear car, unfortunately. I've seen those spring rates bounce around as well, although Kelly from BMR told me it's 165 F 160 R I believe, or somewhere around there.

To be perfectly honest, the BMR's would probably be fine for me if I didn't live in an area of the country with such terrible roads. The softer rate of the BMR's is great until I see a big bump coming then, well...watch out. Bottom city. And although like I said it "feels" a little more wallow-ey than stock (subjective), it still grips like a mother when pushed on on/off ramps.

I'm interested in your results. I've been pretty happy with the BMR/Koni setup I have now, but I'm always open to ideas. It took me a while playing with the koni rebound adjusters to get what I think is a decent ride for being pretty low.

Ever consider airbags? I've never ridden in a "bagged" car, so I'm hesitant about the ride/handling.

Yeah, I play with my Koni's all the time! And Koni + BMR is pretty darn low. I believe Kelly measured and noted that the Koni actually contributes to the drop, which would explain why my front is almost slammed (1 finger gap).

Same on the airbags. Never ridden in a bagged car, and hesitant to go with a lower-end system with only a 1 year warranty. Planning to keep this car in the long run, love it! Also, as a side note, Jason said that the Bilstein's will last a LONG time...monotube = less heat, friction, etc.

 

[mhyjek]

Koni yellows with GT500 mounts up front with BMR springs up front and rear with bmr springs and brembo rear shocks. Had it with yellows and trimmed bump stops still too bouncey now just right! If you don't have brembo shocks try stock should be good...

 

[twistid]

How are Eibach Sportline springs?

There supposed to be progressive springs but it looks like the front are linear?
Front: 183 lb/in.
Rear: 103-217 lb/in.

 

[macbar13]

Koni yellows with GT500 mounts up front with BMR springs up front and rear with bmr springs and brembo rear shocks. Had it with yellows and trimmed bump stops still too bouncey now just right! If you don't have brembo shocks try stock should be good...

What are brembo shocks? You mean the shocks that come with the brembo brake package? If so, I think they are way underdamped. That was the first thing I changed on my car when I got the Koni's. On the stock suspension I changed just the rear shocks to the Koni yellows and with the adjustable rebound damping I was able to improve the stock ride quality. The koni's take out the rear end kick due to the -increased- rebound damping. But who knows? Since ride quality is highly subjective.

 

[Lucky_13]

How are Eibach Sportline springs?

There supposed to be progressive springs but it looks like the front are linear?
Front: 183 lb/in.
Rear: 103-217 lb/in.

Sportlines are going to be rough, I think they are very similar to the FRPP K Springs. Not much bump travel, but I'll be darned my Mustang handled dam close to a go kart when I had them on with the Yellows. Was just way too stiff for the road.

Interesting is that when I was talking with Jason at Vorshlag, he noted that the "P" Springs are actually stiffer than the K's, in the front at least. For optimal handling, run a bigger diameter bar in the front with the K's. Rears are pretty stiff.

 

[twistid]

Can they be run with stock Brembo shocks, or atleast Koni STR.T rear shocks? I assume since the front is only ~1.3" drop the stock Brembo shocks should be good up front...

Looking for a nice handling car I can take auto-x'ing for fun every once and a while (not for serious competition).

 

[Lucky_13]

Can they be run with stock Brembo shocks, or atleast Koni STR.T rear shocks? I assume since the front is only ~1.3" drop the stock Brembo shocks should be good up front...

Looking for a nice handling car I can take auto-x'ing for fun every once and a while (not for serious competition).

Are you talking about Eibach's pro kit? The sportlines lower around 2 inches if I recall correctly.

 

[twistid]

I'm talking about sportlines... 2" rear drop 1.3" front drop... unless I'm mistaken?

 

[MRSUPRA]

I'm looking for a better riding suspension package too. I have Eibach pro springs with Ford FR500 struts/shocks and the ride is too firm and bouncy. Seems like the car never stops moving around.