Datalogging and Normal Temperatures

[VSack]

I've been trying to find any information I could on what could be considered normal temps when datalogging. I have datalogged both my Cougar and Terminator for a nice baseline between the two, but we're really talking about apples and oranges here.

Would it be possible for someone to share with me what averages are considered normal for a stock supercharged V8? I know that there are really three numbers to look for (idle, load, and normal operation) but any information we could build out would be great. I know some of these numbers should fluctuate with modifications, but I assume that stock would be the most preferred temperature to keep things at.

Finally, I know that ambient temp and humidity play into this, but again, a nice baseline would be a good barometer to measure against.

Here are some of the temps that I was monitoring or thought might be remotely useful without using any wideband sensors:

IAT1 Intake Air Temp
INFERRED_EGO_TEMPERATURE
Charge Temp (+/- from IAT1?)
Cylinder Head Temp

While not pertaining to temps, what are the baselines for fuel pressure, MAF lbs/min, Ignition Advance, etc.

I'm completely new when it comes to datalogging, and I'd be an idiot to assume the trends on both my cars being average would constitute some sort of baseline.

Thanks!

 

[Brutal Metal]

I'm wanting to get a tune revision but it's been SO HOT in Florida when I datalog the IAT temps are close to 100 degress, definitely not optimum. I would say a 75 degree dry day with low humidity would be best!
03 Cobras like to see around 20 degrees spark advance!
And when I do Dyno runs and logging I have the ECT in the 170-175 range!

 

[SVTkel]

I've been trying to find any information I could on what could be considered normal temps when datalogging. I have datalogged both my Cougar and Terminator for a nice baseline between the two, but we're really talking about apples and oranges here.

Would it be possible for someone to share with me what averages are considered normal for a stock supercharged V8? I know that there are really three numbers to look for (idle, load, and normal operation) but any information we could build out would be great. I know some of these numbers should fluctuate with modifications, but I assume that stock would be the most preferred temperature to keep things at.

Finally, I know that ambient temp and humidity play into this, but again, a nice baseline would be a good barometer to measure against.

Here are some of the temps that I was monitoring or thought might be remotely useful without using any wideband sensors:

IAT1 Intake Air Temp
INFERRED_EGO_TEMPERATURE
Charge Temp (+/- from IAT1?)
Cylinder Head Temp

While not pertaining to temps, what are the baselines for fuel pressure, MAF lbs/min, Ignition Advance, etc.

I'm completely new when it comes to datalogging, and I'd be an idiot to assume the trends on both my cars being average would constitute some sort of baseline.

Thanks!

I presume you are looking for the normal ranges of your datalogs?

IAT2's - will be dependent upon the ambient conditions. However, 30 - 40 over IAT1's is typical for an Eaton.

MAF counts at idle ~ 155 on my car. MAX counts at 1023 or 1025 - can't recall exactly.

Fuel pressure ~ 38 - 39 at crusing / idle. At WOT, well that is what your tuner is for.

Not sure how you woudl exactly monitor cylinder head temps on a Cobra?

Hope that helps.

 

[VSack]

Not sure how you woudl exactly monitor cylinder head temps on a Cobra?

Beats me. I'm just trying to decipher the PIDs in the SCT. I saw another thread on another site where someone is doing a writeup, and my own testing makes me think the "Cylinder Head Temp" is the same as "Coolant Temp".

 

[hotcobra03]

temps

hey im a new learner also...i have a predator.


iat ,,,isnt that just the outside air temp? air going thru air filter into air inlet....

iat2 is just air temp below supercharger,,which will change due to heat exchanger cooling ,,,


i was hoping that engine temps (water)were discussed cause its hot in south tx,,,

outside temp 102 im seeing 220(water temp) with ac on at idle,
iat 100,iat2 up to 150,,,

 

[VSack]

hey im a new learner also...i have a predator.


iat ,,,isnt that just the outside air temp? air going thru air filter into air inlet....

iat2 is just air temp below supercharger,,which will change due to heat exchanger cooling ,,,


i was hoping that engine temps (water)were discussed cause its hot in south tx,,,

outside temp 102 im seeing 220(water temp) with ac on at idle,
iat 100,iat2 up to 150,,,

You're right on the IAT. I wanted to grab some numbers, but apparently reimporting from CSV back into Livelink hosed up my logs. I'm installing Excel now.

Right now, I'm running with a bigger K&N off the standard intake and will be moving to a CAI I just need to install. So far as I can tell, IAT shows the temp of the air entering the system, and the Charge Temp sensor will tell us what the air leaving the Intercooler is feeling.

I'm guessing the sensor is located on the MAF, but of course...what the hell do I know. I'm still trying to use my decoder ring to figure out all these different sensors (aren't there like 1400+ in the system?).

If it is and its not an "ambient sensor" hanging out in the bay, I should see a direct drop off in IAT when I install the CAI that would account for any heat soak in the bay. I don't believe that there is a true "outside temp" sensor in the car, so I'm relying on Accuweather on my Palm Pre. Any differential between the IAT and my phone should tell me how much heat I am ingesting from the engine.

Please bear with me if I am a noob or repeating things most people already know. Part of this is going to be my learning experience plus making sure we document it for the next person that comes along.

 

[MVD]

I'm still trying to use my decoder ring to figure out all these different sensors (aren't there like 1400+ in the system?).

No, only like 50, I could tell you exactly when I get home and check the wiring manual.

As for the IAT1 sensor, it is the push in sensor located in the stock inlet elbow between the throttle body and air filter.

IAT2 is the sensor downstream of the blower and intercooler, so it is measuring temperature of the air going directly into the combustion chamber. It is located on the driver side rear of the Eaton.

 

[VSack]

No, only like 50, I could tell you exactly when I get home and check the wiring manual.

As for the IAT1 sensor, it is the push in sensor located in the stock inlet elbow between the throttle body and air filter.

IAT2 is the sensor downstream of the blower and intercooler, so it is measuring temperature of the air going directly into the combustion chamber. It is located on the driver side rear of the Eaton.

Thanks for the clarification. Had I looked at the engine I would have known that.

I'd love to put together some sort of document that allows us to see a mapping of each sensor for datalogging and how accurate these sensors are as opposed to wideband alternatives.

I'm still stuck on the inferred EGO vs. EGT. Its going to more than likely take someone with an EGT to do a log and compare the two. I'd just like to know if IEGO is completely useless for any sort of low scale diagnostic or I should go with an EGT outright even if I am not pushing the engine.

My goal is to be careful with any tuning or mods.

 

[yellowgt02]

I logged a few passes at the track a few weeks ago.

Outside Temperature was around 80*
IAT was 90*
IAT2 down the track on that pass didnt get above 110*.
That was with Ice cubes in the I/C Reservoir, that pretty much melted before the pass even started.

Even on the return road the IAT2 didnt get over 120*

I took that as a reference for the night before. Im not sure what the temperature was, probably in the low 70's outside. At the end of the run with just regular I/C coolant, IAT2's were climbing into the 130's at the end of the pass.

Usually around town the IAT2's are anywhere between 110-120.
Highway it drops into the 90's

 

[mitrls10]

Shit how are ya'lls so low?? my Iat2 is always about 220-240* lol. That was b4 bigger heat exchanger and now its 210-215. Thats after a really hard run and sitting there at idle for 5 mins.

 

[yellowgt02]

Shit how are ya'lls so low?? my Iat2 is always about 220-240* lol. That was b4 bigger heat exchanger and now its 210-215. Thats after a really hard run and sitting there at idle for 5 mins.

I highly doubt those are your IAT2's, more likely your engine coolant temperature.

If not, something is seriously wrong.

 

[VSack]

So building a list is next to impossible when you start to consider all the variables. A chart is more likely, but far more cumbersome.

I poked around a bit when I saw the high numbers on the IAT2 mitrls10 posted and I agree with Yellowgt, that sounds more in line with higher than average (at 70 degrees not Georgia temps) coolant temps. I found some information RaceBronco posted in 107 degree heat the the IATs didn't get over 160.

Maybe the best thing to focus on are ceiling tolerances for some of the specifics used for datalogging while driving, not tuning.

 

[hotcobra03]

data logging

vsack...im old school and learn everything hands on,,,

for me i learn best while solving a problem,,than expand from their,,


i started from my car going down and i had to fix,,,

i picked up a ford service manual on cd,than a predator...other tools followed as needed,,,


i found that you need a referance chart for all those numbers and a guide to understand abbreavation...


understanding what these sensors do will make it easier to do....


for newbi`s like us its like fat chance,,,but if you are willing to learn anyone can do this..


do you have a referance chart and sensor discriptions?

 

[hotcobra03]

Vsack

as too iat2 temps...as the other poster said 220 is a problem...start with that,,if its true and its high ,,we can supply you with whats needed for diagnostic,,:shrug:

 

[03cobra#694]

I highly doubt those are your IAT2's, more likely your engine coolant temperature.

If not, something is seriously wrong.

Agreed

 

[mitrls10]

I have a $13000 genisys scan tool and alldata and mitchell on demand I go by. I'm looking at the right pid on the scan tool I promise lol. Whether the sensor is reading right I dunno, I haven't bothered to check it I'm lazy. My coolant stays around 200* and iat1 bout 10* hotter than the ambient temp.

 

[VSack]

vsack...im old school and learn everything hands on,,,

for me i learn best while solving a problem,,than expand from their,,


i started from my car going down and i had to fix,,,

i picked up a ford service manual on cd,than a predator...other tools followed as needed,,,


i found that you need a referance chart for all those numbers and a guide to understand abbreavation...


understanding what these sensors do will make it easier to do....


for newbi`s like us its like fat chance,,,but if you are willing to learn anyone can do this..


do you have a referance chart and sensor discriptions?

Unfortunately no. This is why I'm interested in collecting this data so that maybe I can put something together for the next person who is looking.

I definitely agree that problem tends to spur innovation, but in this case I'm trying to let "new" push me along first I'd rather try to learn what I can now as I'm getting familiar with this platform (and the finer points of the car in general).

I'm going to try asking as many questions as I can, even if I look stupid, until I have this all figured out.

 

[VSack]

I have a $13000 genisys scan tool and alldata and mitchell on demand I go by. I'm looking at the right pid on the scan tool I promise lol. Whether the sensor is reading right I dunno, I haven't bothered to check it I'm lazy. My coolant stays around 200* and iat1 bout 10* hotter than the ambient temp.

Based on what I've learned so far, if your coolant temps are normal and your IAT1s are only a little above ambient, I'd say unless you live on Planet Mercury, your IAT2 sensor may be throwing you some bad data.

 

[96stanggt]

I have a $13000 genisys scan tool and alldata and mitchell on demand I go by. I'm looking at the right pid on the scan tool I promise lol. Whether the sensor is reading right I dunno, I haven't bothered to check it I'm lazy. My coolant stays around 200* and iat1 bout 10* hotter than the ambient temp.

If your charge temps are over 200* then your IC pump isn't working or the sensor is shot.

 

[mitrls10]

Yea Ic pump is new and looks like a whirlpool in my ic tank lol.