Ford GT Disappointing Finish at 12 Hours of Sebring

[DBK]

The way I interpret what you just summed up here DBK, is basically saying that GT racing is a bunch of B.S. The governing bodies basically chose which car they want to win.

I'm surprised that these manufacturers fork out the money they do. The success/failure of their programs rests with a handful of people.

Well, that's definitely one way to interpret it. During the actual race broadcast of Sebring they were talking about it on Radio Le Mans, and how some fans are apoplectic about it and it's a dirty word to even mention BoP because it pisses people off so bad. It is what it is though. The series believe close racing brings casual fans, and manufacturers aren't going to stick it out if they continually get paddled. Otherwise homologation specials like the Ford GT would just destroy a car based on a big fat grand touring BMW M6 and BMW would never enter.

Reliability obviously is a different situation.

They did win the Le Mans though. That one race basically guaranteed a successful season for them.

Which is what Ford's goal is. George Howard-Chappel is no dummy and he's played this game for a long time, so he's certainly trying to time the effort for maximum advantage at LM. I don't expect the cars and their drivers to be set on kill until May.

 

[FortLewisCobra]

Lotta race experts in here!

1. It's impossible to dominate in modern racing. Corvette won the first two races last year, then with the balance of performance adjustments did absolutely nothing for the remainder of the IMSA season. The 911 RSR and their little 6 cylinder laid waste to everyone. Initial BoP in WEC has GT with 10kg more and less boost throughout the range over the IMSA cars.

2. Second race. GT was within 15-20 seconds of the winner with 10 minutes to go.

3. Everything until May is a reliability test to work out any kinks until June.

4. It's a bummer some of you guys are gonna have to bail on buying GTs given what's happened the last 90 days.

DBK has spoken, let it be so.

Seriously though, being that I haven't consistently followed the series Im not going to jump in a declare the V6 a mistake after only two races unlike some...

 

[99COBRA2881]

The fact some people instantly blame the v6 shows how little they know about road racing Ford GTs. The last iteration of the GT with very little factory support despite the best efforts of some very dedicated teams had little success.

The V6 has had plenty of testing in the Daytona prototypes and makes more than enough power.

The V6 can get the job done!
http://youtu.be/wgKsTuiudyU

 

[Coiled03]

Not at all. Obviously the race at Daytona was a mess, but it was the first time the car was ever on a track competitively, so I can't get too bent out of shape over it.

I'm pointing out that you don't just show up and blow people away, whether your car is superior or inferior. GT manufacturers spend a lot of money to race in these series, and the Balance of Performance is designed to equalize things so everybody gets a turn at or near the top of the table, regardless of the superiority of the road car you're race car is based on. For people that think you just show up with a sweet car and win, reliability or not, that's just not how it works.

The BoP is just another document created to fabricate a competitive environment. It's really quite infuriating such things exists, as a racing purist.

If your car sucks, you don't deserve a turn at the top.

 

[CO Mack]

The BoP is just another document created to fabricate a competitive environment. It's really quite infuriating such things exists, as a racing purist.

If your car sucks, you don't deserve a turn at the top.

Totally agree, sick of this kind of crap in racing. The fat rule books are written by and for big manufacturers; a scrappy genius team cannot get creative and slay goliath anymore. By design.

 

[DBK]

On cue from yesterday:

Expectations for next month’s season-opener at Silverstone, meanwhile, remains realistic, knowing the variables the team and Multimatic-built car could be up against this year in its ambitious dual-championship campaign.

“We want to see the car run through with no issues and be as competitive as we can,” Howard-Chappell said. “We’re taking a couple of fairly significant BoP hits, so we’ll have to see where we are."

Obviously the series thinks the car is fast as is to add the weight and reduce the boost as they have, but it's all about timing BoP so they've maximized the performance for LM.

It's certainly risky to put all the eggs for this season in the LM basket...

 

[thomas91169]

Lotta race experts in here!

1. It's impossible to dominate in modern racing. Corvette won the first two races last year, then with the balance of performance adjustments did absolutely nothing for the remainder of the IMSA season. The 911 RSR and their little 6 cylinder laid waste to everyone. Initial BoP in WEC has GT with 10kg more and less boost throughout the range over the IMSA cars.

2. Second race. GT was within 15-20 seconds of the winner with 10 minutes to go.

3. Everything until May is a reliability test to work out any kinks until June.

4. It's a bummer some of you guys are gonna have to bail on buying GTs given what's happened the last 90 days.

Bingo. Spot on.

5. The legendary GT40 didn't come out of the garage and immediately start winning races either.

Took a few years to be exact. Ford sunk millions of dollars into the program just to beat Ferrari because he screwed Ford out of buying Ferrari at signing day and went with Fiat. If that hadnt happened, Ford would have just bought and dismantled Ferrari as another entity and never even gotten into LeMans.

The original GT program only exists as retribution and proof if you sink millions of dollars and half a company worth of effort into anything, eventually you win some races.

Most here are aware of who you are (informally) and the information you provide. That said, all you posted here was a list of excuses.

Just stop. You are severely outclassed in a debate against DBK about the FGT program.

 

[mrlrd1]

Just stop. You are severely outclassed in a debate against DBK about the FGT program.

There is no debate, dumbass. I'm not questioning his involvement or knowledge. He was making excuses, plain and simple.

 

[DBK]

There is no debate, dumbass. I'm not questioning his involvement or knowledge. He was making excuses, plain and simple.

Care to respond to my actual response instead?

 

[08mojo]

Lotta race experts in here!

1. It's impossible to dominate in modern racing. Corvette won the first two races last year, then with the balance of performance adjustments did absolutely nothing for the remainder of the IMSA season. The 911 RSR and their little 6 cylinder laid waste to everyone. Initial BoP in WEC has GT with 10kg more and less boost throughout the range over the IMSA cars.

2. Second race. GT was within 15-20 seconds of the winner with 10 minutes to go.

3. Everything until May is a reliability test to work out any kinks until June.

4. It's a bummer some of you guys are gonna have to bail on buying GTs given what's happened the last 90 days.

:rockon:

Most here are aware of who you are (informally) and the information you provide. That said, all you posted here was a list of excuses.

There is no debate, dumbass. I'm not questioning his involvement or knowledge. He was making excuses, plain and simple.

Those are facts...not excuses. The Corvette team was slapped with weight penalties after their win at Daytona. I'm sure they'll be slapped with more rules to make the rest of the field competitive.

Rules are bent/amended/changed to keep the field competitive. If you look at the lap times, you'll see the field is very very close. These races come down to endurance and race management. It's a totally different game than most people are used to watching--once you know the ins and outs, it becomes a lot more exciting. You also begin to understand how much success the Ford GT team has truly had this season. They learned a lot in Dayton and came with a much better car to Sebring.

 

[mrlrd1]

Care to respond to my actual response instead?

No response was necessary. What you stated was absolutely correct. But you still made excuses, regardless of how you try to spin it.

 

[DBK]

No response was necessary. What you stated was absolutely correct. But you still made excuses, regardless of how you try to spin it.

Whatever you say. I think it's interesting to call something an excuse and also say it's correct. I'm just pointing out the rules of the game for people that clearly don't know them, and subsequently judge events improperly.

Otherwise, all I said was it's only two races in and the car is already competitive and their primary concern right now is preparing the car for LM. Holy cow! What a load of excuses!

 

[CobraRed01]

The BoP is just another document created to fabricate a competitive environment. It's really quite infuriating such things exists, as a racing purist.

If your car sucks, you don't deserve a turn at the top.

I understand what you are saying...but unless you are in a totally Open Cla$$ I can't imagine what you would do to keep multiple manufacturers in a series when they are all running vastly different street-based GT cars. Back in the day, Can Am was a very open class...and thrilling to watch...until McLaren started to dominate and then Porsche came in a crushed it. Considering the incredibly high state of automotive tech these days and the incredibly high cost one would face in a non-BOPed series few manufacturers have a stomach for it. Right, Ford?

 

[mrlrd1]

Whatever you say. I think it's interesting to call something an excuse and also say it's correct.

The two are not mutually exclusive.

And now you're making excuses for your excuses.

Finally, don't be so quick to bash BoP. Without it the GT team has very slim chance at success.

 

[DHG1078]

Except I believe the Ford GT had the fastest lap time in its class at Daytona.

 

[black92]

Except I believe the Ford GT had the fastest lap time in its class at Daytona.

At the start I believe it was turning the fastest lap time, but after it was all said and done the #6 Corvette had set the fastest lap time.

http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...-cost-599K&p=15184031&viewfull=1#post15184031

 

[DBK]

Finally, don't be so quick to bash BoP. Without it the GT team has very slim chance at success.

 

[DHG1078]

At the start I believe it was turning the fastest lap time, but after it was all said and done the #6 Corvette had set the fastest lap time.

http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...-cost-599K&p=15184031&viewfull=1#post15184031

Oh ok. I went back and the article did say in the first couple hours they had set the fastest lap, before causing a full course caution from transmission issues, but I just assumed it meant the fastest lap for the race.

Still, to have the fastest lap at any point in the race proves potential.

 

[Coiled03]

I understand what you are saying...but unless you are in a totally Open Cla$$ I can't imagine what you would do to keep multiple manufacturers in a series when they are all running vastly different street-based GT cars. Back in the day, Can Am was a very open class...and thrilling to watch...until McLaren started to dominate and then Porsche came in a crushed it. Considering the incredibly high state of automotive tech these days and the incredibly high cost one would face in a non-BOPed series few manufacturers have a stomach for it. Right, Ford?

Let me put it this way: I don't mind so much the existence of the document as I do the heavy handed nature in which it's used, and the way it's constantly modified.

Penalizing teams for building a better race car to the point they literally have almost no advantage over others is ridiculous, and takes away from the innovation that's a key element of racing. They need to do a better job at fostering a competitive environment while not making it pointless to attempt to build a better car.

I'd rather it not exist at all, though, to be honest. To me, the best formula for a series would be energy based. Rules would be pretty simple: You get XXXX ergs of energy to complete the race. Build whatever the hell you want. May the fastest car win.

 

[DBK]

“BoP is the same as you hitting my wife in the face with a shovel, just because she’s prettier than yours”.
- Italian gentleman driver Gianni Giudici