Ford Mustang beats Chevy Camaro in May

tt335ci03cobra

Well-Known Member
Established Member
SVTP OG 4 Life
Joined
Feb 15, 2008
Messages
7,067
Location
USA
Product life cycles aren't taken into context in the traditional comparison of camaro vs mustang sales from 2009-present.

One product was at its life cycle end, that being the 05-09 mustang. The REFRESH was good in 2010 for ford but not edgy enough to offset the transformers trend and relative NEWNESS of the gen 5 camaro which was only 1 year into its product life cycle.

Look now in 2012 and likely through 2013. Camaro sales are hovering steady and mustang sales are booming. It's mid life cycle for the camaro and sales are turning tide to fords side. New innovations, better incentives, and a great product are driving a lot of attention. That coupled with the halo factor of the '13 gt500 makes people want a mustang again irregardless of which level (v6, gt, boss, gt500) they can afford. It's cool to be in a mustang again. Not 1965 levels of cool, but enough to bump sales 20+%.

Also, we were I a recession in 2009 an the camaro was brand new then where as the 05-09 was at the end of its cycle. People bought the Camaro's in droves because you could get much more performance for about the same cash. 305hp v6, 426hp v8, all while the stang had 215, 315, and for big bucks, 540.

Bottom line is the sales assessment and argument that has been held over the stang isn't a balanced or valid one.

Let's compare pretty much any 2 product that launch at different intervals and see how they're product life cycles measure up without considering each ones full span. Every time, the newer unit is almost a star on paper.

Now try to justify spending and advertising budgets on that false info and 3 years in, the life cycle begins its decline and even though development costs are met leaving simpler unit variable costs, profits may fall if spending is too high.

Gm has done it right though, little advertising an investments more so in the new generation. One could argue that light advertising could greatly help Chevy generate profits off the camaro at this unit variable cost period but Chevy is smartly applying the money towards a new product.

It will be interesting to see the sales and product life cycles of the 2014 camaro and mustang since they are both getting huge make overs. I believe those life cycles will be much more telling of true buyer habits. I don't believe comparing a product at the end of its cycle to a new product as was done until the 2011 mustang came out is applicable to anything but chest pumping.
 

Kiohtee

Well-Known Member
Established Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2010
Messages
9,365
Location
NC
IDGAF! Given the opportunity, I'd own each/both cars. Even a Challenger, I just don't care.
 

xXGadfly09Xx

Banned
Joined
Mar 22, 2010
Messages
2,922
Location
Long Island, NY
I have quite the affection for my insanely built up 03 and I would never go that far.

To me the 05-09's are too plain and boxy while being oddly large. Nice cars but I like my 03 better.

That said the new 11+'s and especially the 13 really instill the gotta have it factor in me. I've considered trading my car on one (though obviously never will).

The 05 never did that for me. I could just be crazy so my opinion obviously is as conditional/abstract as yours.

I just hate the plastic rear diaper on the 10+ mustangs. If I am paying $40,000+ I dont want some cheap plastic on the rear bumper
 

Black*Death

Sleeping
Established Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2008
Messages
3,203
Location
South
I believe the Camaro only outsold the Mustang those years because GM didnt have the Camaro for how long?

Stop using logic...Car not produced for 7 model years new look and power plant I was not completely surprised when it outsold Mustangs

By the end of 2012 all will be normal again Mustangs outselling Camaros and continuing to beat them on the street.

Too bad Pontiac is gone because I always like the FireBirds more than plain Camaros
 

Kiohtee

Well-Known Member
Established Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2010
Messages
9,365
Location
NC
... and continuing to beat them on the street. ...

You're joking, right? I'm not a GM/Camaro fanboy by any means, but c'mon man! It's been a long time since a Mustang could outperform a same year Camaro, especially back in the days of the LS1 (which is still holding it's own pretty well, especially with bolt-ons).

Like I said, IDGAF, they're all nice cars with good power and I'd jump at the chance to own any of them. But if you start spewing a bunch of BS I'm gonna call you out on it.
 

tt335ci03cobra

Well-Known Member
Established Member
SVTP OG 4 Life
Joined
Feb 15, 2008
Messages
7,067
Location
USA
You're joking, right? I'm not a GM/Camaro fanboy by any means, but c'mon man! It's been a long time since a Mustang could outperform a same year Camaro, especially back in the days of the LS1 (which is still holding it's own pretty well, especially with bolt-ons).

Like I said, IDGAF, they're all nice cars with good power and I'd jump at the chance to own any of them. But if you start spewing a bunch of BS I'm gonna call you out on it.

I disagree since the only time in the last 9 years that ford didn't offer a dollar for dollar faster pony car was 09-10. And even then during those two years, the gt500 was killing the ss in most every department plus dealer markups were putting the ss close to gt500 prices of those lucky enough to get a gt500 at sticker.

Anyways, the 90's was all Chevy but the last decade was all ford. The terminator alone ended the debate and kick started modern pony cars all over again. We wouldn't have seen a zl1 or gt500 or zr1 if the terminator didn't push those early buttons.

Hell, John Colletti is the real thankable cause of all the fun we're having with easy 10 second cars like the zl1 and 07-12 gt500's. Now it's evolved to be easy 9 second cars with the '13 gt500.

And for those that wanna pull the "01 ss only needs 5k in mods to run 9's bs" please don't.

We all know that lasting builds are not simply heads, cam, intake, headers, 200shot, slicks, skinnies, 4.10's.

Rockers will break, lifters will fail, head studs will warp, pistons will grenade, valve springs will stick, valves will float, clutches will melt, rears will sheer, hubs will crack, brakes will warp, chassis' will tweak, fuel will run lean, coolant will boil, tranny's will break, driveshafts will snap u joints into bits, shocks will inhibit launch, etc etc etc etc etc.

Sorry to rant, I'm more so pointing out the falsities of other peoples common arguments, not yours. The camaro performed awesome in the 90's through 02 compared to the stang stable. Today it's a whole different thing. The modern v6 stang runs 13's, and handles way better than a 90's ss ever has and even holds its own against the 2012 ss. The 5.0 boss is nearly as fast as the zl1 in a straight line. Much more so than the zl1 is compared to the 13 gt500 that literally outpaces the zl1 by 7-8mph at the strip.

Bottom line, a lot has been proven that shows ford holding the reins close and tight from 03-13. Ya camaro went bust 04-08, but the gto never reached terminator credentials and the gt500 came out in 07 after the gto was axed for low sales. The 05-06 goats were awesome and faster than gt's but terminators were faster. Again different price points though so not a fair fight just like the 09-10 years.

Rant done
 
Last edited:

Kiohtee

Well-Known Member
Established Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2010
Messages
9,365
Location
NC
I disagree since the only time in the last 9 years that ford didn't offer a dollar for dollar faster pony car was 09-10. And even then during those two years, the gt500 was killing the ss in most every department plus dealer markups were putting the ss close to gt500 prices of those lucky enough to get a gt500 at sticker.

GM's Camaro and Trans Am beat the Mustang from at least 1993-2002 (including the Cobra, excluding Cobra R models). Other than the '03-04 Cobra's, it took Ford until 2011 to produce a Mustang that would outrun even a stock LS1, again, excluding specialty Mustangs. Don't get upset though, you have to give the LS1 credit, it's an incredible engine.

No stock 2V would outrun a stock LS1. The '99-04 2V's were pretty good competition for the LT1, but even then LT1's came out on top more than not. The 3V put up a little better fight to the LS1, but still no dice.

Edit: And the Camaro didn't go bust in '04. Try after '02. And the LS1 in the GTO was one of the worst mistakes GM ever made. The LS2 however, is a lot better than the LS1. I wouldn't mind throwing one in my Camaro actually.
 
Last edited:

thomas91169

# of bans = 5203
Established Member
Joined
Mar 2, 2006
Messages
25,662
Location
San Diego, CA
GM....still relying on quantity, not quality. Thats the mindset that made them have to resort to bailouts in the first place.....
 

Kiohtee

Well-Known Member
Established Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2010
Messages
9,365
Location
NC
GM....still relying on quantity, not quality. Thats the mindset that made them have to resort to bailouts in the first place.....

Ain't that the truth! It's amazing to see what Ford didn't take when everyone else did and where they're at now despite it. Just awesome!
 

Users who are viewing this thread



Top