Mach 1 vs. LT1 Z28

[Ls1z28-00]

I find that very hard to believe. A LS1 6 speed is going to pull hard on an automatic LT1 with those mods. I bet your car would do good to run 13.5@103mph in the 1/4th.

yes i found it hard to believe as well. a ls1 car may only run 13.2-3 @105 so id say thats about right. remember he only has lid and everything else is stock. my z28 is low option car(manual windows, seats...etc.) so im sure im quite a bit lighter than he is. Im borrowing my buddies slicks and going to re-run them this weekend, ill see if i can get a video. We raced 5 times with about the same outcome. Im a LS1 guy at heart but the LT1 isnt as slow as some may beleive, in my experiances anyway. but once you start adding cam and heads the ls1s just come alive where the LT1s are not as impressive. Im going to see about racing some new edge GT's and such and get it on video and post it up.

 

[S8ER01Z]

I find that very hard to believe. A LS1 6 speed is going to pull hard on an automatic LT1 with those mods. I bet your car would do good to run 13.5@103mph in the 1/4th.

x10000 ... I had a laundry list of mods including lightly ported heads and LS1 6 speed cars would yank my automatic from a roll.

There is a difference between the two..as someone that has owned 2 LT1s and 1 LS1 car now it is in fact night and day. I would be kidding myself to believe otherwise.

 

[Stopsign32v]

yes i found it hard to believe as well. a ls1 car may only run 13.2-3 @105 so id say thats about right. remember he only has lid and everything else is stock. my z28 is low option car(manual windows, seats...etc.) so im sure im quite a bit lighter than he is. Im borrowing my buddies slicks and going to re-run them this weekend, ill see if i can get a video. We raced 5 times with about the same outcome. Im a LS1 guy at heart but the LT1 isnt as slow as some may beleive, in my experiances anyway. but once you start adding cam and heads the ls1s just come alive where the LT1s are not as impressive. Im going to see about racing some new edge GT's and such and get it on video and post it up.

No offense but compared to a LS1, Mach 1, or Cobra the LT1 automatics are a slug. (Yes I know my 95 is even a bigger slug. I'm scared of speed.) And even with your lighter car you are not going to pull a LS1 6 speed car unless the driver is terrible. Do you have any track numbers to back up your claim?

 

[S8ER01Z]

No offense but compared to a LS1, Mach 1, or Cobra the LT1 automatics are a slug. (Yes I know my 95 is even a bigger slug. I'm scared of speed.) And even with your lighter car you are not going to pull a LS1 6 speed car unless the driver is terrible. Do you have any track numbers to back up your claim?

Both of my automatic LT1s were trapping a massive 97~98mph bone stock... I could see where I would have to worry on the big end...

 

[ponygt65]

yes i found it hard to believe as well. a ls1 car may only run 13.2-3 @105 so id say thats about right. remember he only has lid and everything else is stock. my z28 is low option car(manual windows, seats...etc.) so im sure im quite a bit lighter than he is. Im borrowing my buddies slicks and going to re-run them this weekend, ill see if i can get a video. We raced 5 times with about the same outcome. Im a LS1 guy at heart but the LT1 isnt as slow as some may beleive, in my experiances anyway. but once you start adding cam and heads the ls1s just come alive where the LT1s are not as impressive. Im going to see about racing some new edge GT's and such and get it on video and post it up.

Uh what?. THe more you post, the more I wonder how much you know. I mean, I understand you have a kickass LS and cobra....but are you seriously trying to tell me that an LS M6 'MAY ONLY' run a 105 TS?:??::shrug::nonono:

 

[S8ER01Z]

Uh what?. THe more you post, the more I wonder how much you know. I mean, I understand you have a kickass LS and cobra....but are you seriously trying to tell me that an LS M6 'MAY ONLY' run a 105 TS?:??::shrug::nonono:

Maybe he means if conditions are bad/bad driver it 'may' only 'manage'... :banana:

I know someone is going to bring up some LS1 they know of at 5000ft+ that only traps 100mph... I'm talking sea level times here.

 

[amxguy1970]

+1

Um...no, no, and no. Sorry, but I think your knowledge on the cars on topic is lacking based on that post.

:lol:Says the owner of 2 Mach's, surprise surprise...

:read:Most of that stuff is true, there might be a few things that are up for discussion. Next time why don't you make a useful post instead of trying to shoot something down that you obviously have nothing to back it up with. Come on son, bring it.... oke:


But please oh wonderful master, enlighten us with your car brilliance! :burn:

Tyler

 

[mrbigjeep]

ls1z28, you saw some bad drivers in those 2v's

i ran 8.8 with just a muffler delete...and averaged 9.0's or 9.1's in 70-80+ degree weather.

 

[ponygt65]

:lol:Says the owner of 2 Mach's, surprise surprise...

:read:Most of that stuff is true, there might be a few things that are up for discussion. Next time why don't you make a useful post instead of trying to shoot something down that you obviously have nothing to back it up with. Come on son, bring it.... oke:


But please oh wonderful master, enlighten us with your car brilliance! :burn:

Tyler

AHAHAH...nope. If you want to play that game, take it to SD. I'm not gonna get another infraction for that stuff.

My only point is, you don't own the cars..which doesn't always mean everything, but it's obvious you could use some knowledge.

I will say, if you honestly think an LT will hang with a mach in the first two gears, you don't know a thing about those cars. A mach puts down more power, AND has better 1-2 gears AND better rear gears. The mach's advantage against an LS IS the dig.

Son?....Hmmm...never been called that before on a board...kind of funny given the knowledge advantage I have over you.

 

[BlueSnake01]

AHAHAH...nope. If you want to play that game, take it to SD. I'm not gonna get another infraction for that stuff.

My only point is, you don't own the cars..which doesn't always mean everything, but it's obvious you could use some knowledge.

I will say, if you honestly think an LT will hang with a mach in the first two gears, you don't know a thing about those cars. A mach puts down more power, AND has better 1-2 gears AND better rear gears. The mach's advantage against an LS IS the dig.

Son?....Hmmm...never been called that before on a board...kind of funny given the knowledge advantage I have over you.

Even my N/A "Slowbra" :lol1: will put the LT1 to shame. I did say before why it will keep up but I never finish saying why. The reason why it will because the other car will burn out more (most of the time). I was able to keep up from a dig on my friends NE GT against an '00 LS1 because the LS1 was burning out (guess driver didnt know how to race it:shrug. Same thing goes with the LT1 against me, if I dont slip the clutch properly (and burn out), he will be next to me. But if i was to slip it the right way, the only thing the LT1 will see in 2nd gear are my tail lights ;-)

 

[amxguy1970]

AHAHAH...nope. If you want to play that game, take it to SD. I'm not gonna get another infraction for that stuff.

My only point is, you don't own the cars..which doesn't always mean everything, but it's obvious you could use some knowledge. :bored:

I will say, if you honestly think an LT will hang with a mach in the first two gears, you don't know a thing about those cars (then enlighten me, but I think I do....). A mach puts down more power (peaky power, not the down low grunt/torque of a LT through an 1/8th mile which I have mentioned), AND has better 1-2 gears AND better rear gears (slightly, but not enough to significantly off set the advantage of the LT down low again). The mach's advantage against an LS IS the dig (agreed, but we are talking about the LT1 not LS1...).

Son?....Hmmm...never been called that before on a board...kind of funny given the knowledge advantage I have over you. (Nice ASSumption there old timer)

Certainly could, so why not enlighten me then? Here is what I know.

If you take a quick glance at a LT1 dyno what jumps out at you? Being I am a clueless person that you are so quick to point out I would like to guess the big deep torque curve and how it starts down low. They have dyno'd 30+ ftlbs of torque over the HP out put, gee thats alot these days... Now since I know only a miniscule (sp?) amount about drag racing I have come to the conclusion that torque is what gets you out of the hole and gets you moving (As everyone here would agree).

An 1/8 of a mile is a short race, what do Mach's do it at? The LT1's have been known to go in the high 8's, especially in M6 form with the more aggressive rear. I am guessing the Mach's run about the same knocking on the mid 8's. Now, what are Mach's dynoing at? From what I am seeing they have to build their torque across the board just like every other car these days. Go ahead, search some graphs of both and you will see. A Mach is not as high or starting as low as the LT's in the torque department. Now if you know a thing or two you would realize that a stock for stock match against the two (manuals) it is a descent race through the 1/8th with the Mach over taking it by the end by a car or so. Sure they may not trap as high as the Mach's or even close to an LS1, but they can get moving just fine!

We are talking strictly 1/8 mile, and a LT1 can for sure hold its own there with a Mach. Next time why don't you try proving your point rather then just blabbing your age next time and how much "smarter" you are then me? :lol:

Tyler

 

[Dynotune04]

Certainly could, so why not enlighten me then? Here is what I know.

If you take a quick glance at a LT1 dyno what jumps out at you? Being I am a clueless person that you are so quick to point out I would like to guess the big deep torque curve and how it starts down low. They have dyno'd 30+ ftlbs of torque over the HP out put, gee thats alot these days... Now since I know only a miniscule (sp?) amount about drag racing I have come to the conclusion that torque is what gets you out of the hole and gets you moving (As everyone here would agree).

An 1/8 of a mile is a short race, what do Mach's do it at? The LT1's have been known to go in the high 8's, especially in M6 form with the more aggressive rear. I am guessing the Mach's run about the same knocking on the mid 8's. Now, what are Mach's dynoing at? From what I am seeing they have to build their torque across the board just like every other car these days. Go ahead, search some graphs of both and you will see. A Mach is not as high or starting as low as the LT's in the torque department. Now if you know a thing or two you would realize that a stock for stock match against the two (manuals) it is a descent race through the 1/8th with the Mach over taking it by the end by a car or so. Sure they may not trap as high as the Mach's or even close to an LS1, but they can get moving just fine!

We are talking strictly 1/8 mile, and a LT1 can for sure hold its own there with a Mach. Next time why don't you try proving your point rather then just blabbing your age next time and how much "smarter" you are then me? :lol:

Tyler

a 2v gt will also dyno 30+ ftlbs of torque over its hp rating. whats your point the gt has good bottom end grunt and strong gearing in the manual trans. thats why its able to keep up with the lt1s. the gt doesnt make the top end power the lt1 does thats why the lt1's trap 1 or 2 mph higher. fwiw my old 04 gt when it was bone stock went 14.1 @ 100 with crappy bald good years on it.

 

[BlueSnake01]

a 2v gt will also dyno 30+ ftlbs of torque over its hp rating. whats your point the gt has good bottom end grunt and strong gearing in the manual trans. thats why its able to keep up with the lt1s. the gt doesnt make the top end power the lt1 does thats why the lt1's trap 1 or 2 mph higher. fwiw my old 04 gt when it was bone stock went 14.1 @ 100 with crappy bald good years on it.

That pretty much summons it up. Dont forget the GT is lighter too, another reason why it holds up.

 

[ponygt65]

Certainly could, so why not enlighten me then? Here is what I know.

If you take a quick glance at a LT1 dyno what jumps out at you? Being I am a clueless person that you are so quick to point out I would like to guess the big deep torque curve and how it starts down low. They have dyno'd 30+ ftlbs of torque over the HP out put, gee thats alot these days... Now since I know only a miniscule (sp?) amount about drag racing I have come to the conclusion that torque is what gets you out of the hole and gets you moving (As everyone here would agree).

An 1/8 of a mile is a short race, what do Mach's do it at? The LT1's have been known to go in the high 8's, especially in M6 form with the more aggressive rear. I am guessing the Mach's run about the same knocking on the mid 8's. Now, what are Mach's dynoing at? From what I am seeing they have to build their torque across the board just like every other car these days. Go ahead, search some graphs of both and you will see. A Mach is not as high or starting as low as the LT's in the torque department. Now if you know a thing or two you would realize that a stock for stock match against the two (manuals) it is a descent race through the 1/8th with the Mach over taking it by the end by a car or so. Sure they may not trap as high as the Mach's or even close to an LS1, but they can get moving just fine!

We are talking strictly 1/8 mile, and a LT1 can for sure hold its own there with a Mach. Next time why don't you try proving your point rather then just blabbing your age next time and how much "smarter" you are then me? :lol:

Tyler

Couldn't find a bone stock LT1 dyno sheet real quick..(I'm at work)...however here is a link with three dyno's of machs and a link to an LT4 (which we all know is better than an LT1).
http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/7990050-post69.html
Dyno Results

Hmm...TQ curves look pretty similar. Have you even SEEN a mach dyno before this?...I have a feeling you haven't.

ALso, there's two more INCORRECT comments.....

A) given teh TQ curve of both, how can you say the difference in rear gearing and so called minor differences in tranny gears off set?.

B) An LT1 Fbod being back by only two lengths....:lol: R U kidding me? SInce when does .5-.7 in 1320 equal a length or two?

If this goes for one more reply, I'm taking to SD. Not risking another infraction and I'm not saying that again.

Oh and MORE 'proof" (seems how you didn't provide ANY, merely made comments), try a search on 1/8 mile times...you'll see machs are mid 8s and LTs are upper 8s low 9s....thank you.

Again, it's obbvious you are lacking some much needed knowledge to make the comments you have.

ANd..Age?....when did I say anything about age. I merely commented on your 'son' comment.:nonono:

a 2v gt will also dyno 30+ ftlbs of torque over its hp rating. whats your point the gt has good bottom end grunt and strong gearing in the manual trans. thats why its able to keep up with the lt1s. the gt doesnt make the top end power the lt1 does thats why the lt1's trap 1 or 2 mph higher. fwiw my old 04 gt when it was bone stock went 14.1 @ 100 with crappy bald good years on it.

It's starting to get to the point where these threads are just pointless DT.

 

[Dynotune04]

yea burnzilla has been at this for too long. problem is people get sucked in by him. one day he will realize that hes just an ignorant gm fan boy.

 

[ponygt65]

yea burnzilla has been at this for too long. problem is people get sucked in by him. one day he will realize that hes just an ignorant gm fan boy.

Yep.

I wonder if "AMX" has even owned or driven any of hte cars talked about in here?...I have a feeling NOPE.

 

[mrbigjeep]

Certainly could, so why not enlighten me then? Here is what I know.

If you take a quick glance at a LT1 dyno what jumps out at you? Being I am a clueless person that you are so quick to point out I would like to guess the big deep torque curve and how it starts down low. They have dyno'd 30+ ftlbs of torque over the HP out put, gee thats alot these days... Now since I know only a miniscule (sp?) amount about drag racing I have come to the conclusion that torque is what gets you out of the hole and gets you moving (As everyone here would agree).

An 1/8 of a mile is a short race, what do Mach's do it at? The LT1's have been known to go in the high 8's, especially in M6 form with the more aggressive rear. I am guessing the Mach's run about the same knocking on the mid 8's. Now, what are Mach's dynoing at? From what I am seeing they have to build their torque across the board just like every other car these days. Go ahead, search some graphs of both and you will see. A Mach is not as high or starting as low as the LT's in the torque department. Now if you know a thing or two you would realize that a stock for stock match against the two (manuals) it is a descent race through the 1/8th with the Mach over taking it by the end by a car or so. Sure they may not trap as high as the Mach's or even close to an LS1, but they can get moving just fine!

We are talking strictly 1/8 mile, and a LT1 can for sure hold its own there with a Mach. Next time why don't you try proving your point rather then just blabbing your age next time and how much "smarter" you are then me? :lol:

Tyler

with a good driver in a mach and a good driver in an lt1 the mach is gonna win everytime. a good driver in a mach can get a mid eight...thats not happening with a stock lt1. they are lucky to get high eights stock.

 

[amxguy1970]

Couldn't find a bone stock LT1 dyno sheet real quick..(I'm at work)...however here is a link with three dyno's of machs and a link to an LT4 (which we all know is better than an LT1).
http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/7990050-post69.html
Dyno Results

The LT1 and LT4 aren't the same, but yes the LT4 is better. The LT1 is more of a low torque lower spinnig car. The LT4 got its redlined raised with lighter weight components which you should know compromises low end torque for high end HP. Hence the reason it picked up 30 hp over the LT1 with the same torque out put, lighter larger valves, roller aluminum rockers versus the standard steel ones, ect... The LT4 still has a great torque curve though!
http://www.grandsportregistry.com/lt1vslt4.htm

Hmm...TQ curves look pretty similar. Have you even SEEN a mach dyno before this?...I have a feeling you haven't. Yes I have once, at Mustang shop in Arlington when I had my car dyno, but I didn't really pay much attention though because it wasn't important to me. Have you ever seen a LT1 dyno, I have a feeling you haven't. Saying those torque curves look the same is like saying Beyonce and Queen Latifa (sp?) look the same, come on. Any basic car guy over the age of 8 can tell the LT starts its torque at 310 ftlbs at just over 2000 rpm and climbs slightly to 325 at about 3500 rpm, that is a flat torque curve right there! The Mach starts at like 275 ish and has to climb to 335 at a higher RPM.

ALso, there's two more INCORRECT comments..... :dw:

A) given teh TQ curve of both, how can you say the difference in rear gearing and so called minor differences in tranny gears off set? How can you say other wise? You are telling me with your extreme knowledge that those two graphs are the same! The LT has a big lead in torque down low where it really matters, and the Mach has a lead in the HP where it matters. That's the problem with new cars these days, they have awesome upper end at the expense of low end (NA cars).

B) An LT1 Fbod being back by only two lengths....:lol: R U kidding me? SInce when does .5-.7 in 1320 equal a length or two? We are talking about 1/8 mile, I have stated that multiple times, I know a Mach will be about a half secodn faster or so in the 1/4....

If this goes for one more reply, I'm taking to SD. Not risking another infraction and I'm not saying that again. What is SD and how do we go there?

Oh and MORE 'proof" (seems how you didn't provide ANY, merely made comments), try a search on 1/8 mile times...you'll see machs are mid 8s and LTs are upper 8s low 9s....thank you. Exactly, 8.6 (mid 8) to a 8.8 (high 8) that is two tenths of a second, not exactly car lengths we are talking about here huh?

Again, it's obbvious you are lacking some much needed knowledge to make the comments you have. Just your comment about the same dyno graphs makes me question yours.

ANd..Age?....when did I say anything about age. I merely commented on your 'son' comment.:nonono: Agreed, I mentioned that first

Answers are in bold...:beer:

Tyler

 

[amxguy1970]

with a good driver in a mach and a good driver in an lt1 the mach is gonna win everytime. a good driver in a mach can get a mid eight...thats not happening with a stock lt1. they are lucky to get high eights stock.

Not arguing that, as it was what I was saying earlier. I know the Mach is faster, I am just saying through the 1/8th it will be alot closer then many people realize! :beer:

Tyler

 

[ponygt65]

Not arguing that, as it was what I was saying earlier. I know the Mach is faster, I am just saying through the 1/8th it will be alot closer then many people realize! :beer:

Tyler

I can agree with that comment.....about it being closer than most realize. THe same goes for the 03 cobra and Mach from a dig. Not saying the mach will win, but closer than most think.

I won't reply to the above (not that I didn't read it), just I think it would be a moot point. I will admit, my mindset goes straight to 1320 not the 1/8th. That was my error. Best case scenarios between the two the mach will be ahead at the marker by roughly 2 lengths and will only get uglier if it went a full 1320.

Shall we leave it at that? :shrug: