New to the forum. I'm going to start the install of my Whipple 2.9 supercharger on my 12 GT in a few weeks. I've already done suspension, driveshaft and clutch upgrades to support the blower. Are the oil pump gears really needed with the Whipple? I understand if I was going to run the motor past 6800 rpm all the time but I haven't raised the rev limiter. It's mainly a weekend warrior that sees a few drag strip days a year. I'm in Colorado, so I'm thinking I'll be at 550-570 rwhp after the dyno tune, maybe a little lower because of the elevation. I've seen other Coyotes at sea level put down around 600. I'll be well below that. I plan on doing an aluminator short block in a couple of years that already had the forged pieces and lower compression. I'm thinking the gears will survive until then. Just looking to see everyone else's experiences.
Oil Pump Gears Required?
- Thread starter bg302
- Start date
Welcome to the forum! This topic has been covered many, many times.
Do a search on "oil pump gears". Tons of info available.
Do a search on "oil pump gears". Tons of info available.
Thanks, I'll check it out.
Oil pump gears and also a crank sprocket would be a good upgrade to do for your application. We can set you up with a package deal and we also have a write up on how to install them if you search my username on here.
Www.teambeefcakeracing.com
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Www.teambeefcakeracing.com
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Its not an HP thing necessarily its an RPM and a rapid change of the RPM (hitting the RevLimiter) that typically breaks them. Some on stock levels have broken. Increased HP just adds more stress to those parts under the same conditions.
I have heard it said that power doesn't make a difference but I have also had some tell me at 600rwhp I would be fine..... thought power didn't make a difference? I say for 430$ beefcake combo he has it's worth the money and could save thousands.
It all depends. Just like relocation brackets, I've had many mustangs and never had any before all the hype of them. I had LCA's but not the brackets. So, I purchased some and they are on my car, didn't notice crap. No different from only LCA's. Now, everybody says replace the oil pump gears. I've got 18000 miles and 14000 of supercharged miles with zero issues. Some people have issues, but doesn't mean everybody will. I myself, personally, would only change them out if I was rebuilding the motor at the same time.
For the cost of the parts vs the cost ofthe repair if they fail it's worth it. I did mine with the twin turbo install. Pain, but there is a good write up in the How to section. Take your time and you'll be good.
Thanks for all the input. I'll end up doing them but it'll have to wait until later this year (already spent the budget on the blower, clutch kit and supporting mods), still have to order the JMS BAP yet. I should be ok waiting until fall to do it. Install looks pretty straightforward, probably get it done in a day taking my time. I like the kit Beefcake has, that's the one I'll do.
Banging the gears together is what breaks them. That can happen from hitting the rev limiter, from misfires, from detonation, etc.
Normally there are other contributing factors, like thin oil, aeration of the oil, or simply low on oil. This is why it tends to be a problem at higher RPM (excessive windage causing aeration or a lack of oil in the sump).
Thicker viscosity oil can help protect gears, as does staying off the limiter and running good quality fuel to avoid knocking.
We've implemented soft limiters on Boosted applications and recommend Ford 5W50 oil.
Normally there are other contributing factors, like thin oil, aeration of the oil, or simply low on oil. This is why it tends to be a problem at higher RPM (excessive windage causing aeration or a lack of oil in the sump).
Thicker viscosity oil can help protect gears, as does staying off the limiter and running good quality fuel to avoid knocking.
We've implemented soft limiters on Boosted applications and recommend Ford 5W50 oil.
It's like using a condom. Sure she might not get pregnant without 1 but chances are....,
@bg302 Here's how I looked at it. There's not "stories" out there about boosted Coyotes over heating or a/c breaking or ABS failing... or any other "thing" like that... BUT - there are a FAIR number of stories (enough that it's not 2 dudes and a lot of forum cross posts) about a healthy Coyote getting some forced application and then the OPG's letting go.
If I am spending all the bucks on the blower and the time of the install - it's illogical to me why I would not ALSO add another $400 in parts and 3/4 day in labor - and KNOW the issue is put to bed.
I wasn't going to do it as part of my Whipple install... kept reading and talking to people, realized I'd have pretty much everything "done" in the Whipple install EXCEPT the timing cover and the work under it... so - I decided it would be silly to cheap out when so close.
If you are boosting the car off the crank - Do it.
p.s. - I did the beefcake kit too over the holidays with a discount
If I am spending all the bucks on the blower and the time of the install - it's illogical to me why I would not ALSO add another $400 in parts and 3/4 day in labor - and KNOW the issue is put to bed.
I wasn't going to do it as part of my Whipple install... kept reading and talking to people, realized I'd have pretty much everything "done" in the Whipple install EXCEPT the timing cover and the work under it... so - I decided it would be silly to cheap out when so close.
If you are boosting the car off the crank - Do it.
p.s. - I did the beefcake kit too over the holidays with a discount
Buy once cry once.
https://www.svtperformance.com/forums/threads/why-get-billet-opgs.1099104/
https://www.svtperformance.com/forums/threads/why-get-billet-opgs.1099104/
I wonder what percentage of OPG failures happened to manual vs auto mustangs. It probably doesn't matter either way but would be curious to know. I procharged my car almost 3 years ago when there wasn't really a whole lot of stories about people breaking them so I didn't even know they should be replaced. I know the parts are not that expensive (like 400 bucks for OPG's and crank sproket) but to have a shop install them is usually 8-10 hours of labor. Not to mention they would have to remove the supercharger and reinstall that too. Personally I don't trust myself installing OPG's and would rather put that money towards a new forged engine build if/when my engine gives out. Besides there is still plenty of other things that could go wrong like breaking a rod, etc. I'm just not sure it's justifiable on a stock motor. For a forged engine build though its a no brainer.
Are they reasonable insurance yes- did I do them no- would I do them if I had another chance again NO, as long as you plan on staying at those power levels, like mention before/above, I think more opg fail cause of the oil getting windaged , from multiple high rpm runs and pulls and certain rpm spike after the oil is windaged and foamed- I personally have had 50 + full 7400rpm 650rwhp full boost rev limiter hits at the 1000-1050' mark at the strip because of improper trans tuning by my tuner- these were always single passes not back to back with out cool down and were all obviously low 10 second sprints.
I always ran quality oil, and always checked my level, I was probably lucky and at the end of this last season I was just waiting for them to break because of so many full throttle limiter hits- fortunately they didn't and I sold my stock short block this December and am having a new one installed as this is being posted- My new one has TSS opg, and crank sprocket and I went with the JPC bundle with arp crank bolt- to me it was a better deal/product.
I always ran quality oil, and always checked my level, I was probably lucky and at the end of this last season I was just waiting for them to break because of so many full throttle limiter hits- fortunately they didn't and I sold my stock short block this December and am having a new one installed as this is being posted- My new one has TSS opg, and crank sprocket and I went with the JPC bundle with arp crank bolt- to me it was a better deal/product.
I recently installed the Boundary OPGs. The Boundary gears were dense and heavy, and extremely stout for their size. I got my hands on the stock OPGs, and they felt like I could throw them like a frizbee. They felt almost hollow. There is a huge difference between the stock and aftermarket OPGs. Aftermarket OPGs are billet, and the stocks are powdered metal, so there ya go.
Last edited:
The OPG drop test has been debunked. The test is far more severe than any OPG would see in an oil pump housing with oil. OPG's see rotational force(torque) not the force of gravity. It would be like dropping a crate engine and saying its not well built because it is damaged from the fall.
Users who are viewing this thread
