Post most recent pics of your '13-14 GT500

[Vinnie_B]

View attachment 1833303

She is craving for a thick juicy Destroyer Grey Hellcat to feast on..........

I thought my nonsense would give you a good chuckle @biminiLX Hope all is well my friend!

 

[Cobra Therapy]

KB liquid cooled don't really run that hot. Data log from 2022 middle of August in the mid 90's. 48 min cruise.My 3.6 IAT2 avg was barely 118 deg. Avg ECT was 175 deg. Not to shabby IMO.View attachment 1833286

I have talked to a guy that races a 13-14 GT500 super snake at the TRACK, all over the states and he says they heat soak really quick.Others have said that as well.

 

[Cobra Therapy]

I don't know if it is knowledge or obsession LOL

Car is currently producing 1070 on pump 93 and 1208 on pump E85. The car isn;t really that bad to drive at these power levels. It is a lot of fun and is easy to manage tire spin believe it or not.

The one thing that I do know that the 4.7L will have as an advantage is that it will not generate as much heat in the air as it flows through the SC. Also the rotors/compressor pack won't get as hot turning slower. I also realize after much discussion with Shawn that with the bypass/wastegate system he installs that the boost numbers at 2700 CFM of SC output that he can limit boost down low enough with the throttle blade wide open to around 6-7 psi. This can't be done with a bypass valve and a low vacuum signal at the TB with the standard KB bypass valve with the TB wide open(foot flat on the floor), you'll have all of the boost and airflow going into the engine. His system allows you to program boost like a turbocharger set up. So going to the bigger SC isn't a concern with pump 93 and driving on the street. To drive a 4.7L on the street took at least pump E85 in the past with a bypass valve. I can literally program the MoTec to only produce 600-700 Hp at the tires if that is all I want to drive to a car show or to the grocery store if the mood strikes me on the street. Shawn is really trying to get me to go to a 4.9, but I can't see the advantages being high enough. The jumps in airflow for a 1/8" upper pulley change are 80CFM. I also feel the TB will really start to become to restrictive, unless you go to a dual 106mm TB or even something bigger. The lowest amount of CFM output of a 4.9 with a 15% overdriver lower and a 4" upper is 2644 CFM, whereas the 4.7 will be 2536 CFM or I can change the upper to a 3 7/8" for 2618 CFM. I don't know if a 4.9 is worth it, but the kicker is it is only $200 more than a 4.7. What cha say everyone.........4.7 or 4.9????? LOL

My plans have always been since I started modifying the car to go to The Mile, the reason for it taking so long is after the engine failure the car has spent a very long time getting the engine rebuilt. During this time my wife's health degraded to the point where her doctors have for the last 3 years given her a 30% chance of passing away. Covid, her weak immune system and the sum of all of her health problems keep her home 99% of the time. She has asked me not to take the car to The Mile out of fear, fear that I'll get hurt and no one is here to take care of her and fear that if I get hurt and I need care she won't be able to provide it, so the car keeps evolving to a faster version of itself. I would think she'd allow me to go if I stop at the 200mph mark, which would probably take a full weekend event to achieve that in licensing anyway. She has been in a car with me in the distant past to 145-148 so I hope striving to go faster in a car with all of the safety precautions will ease her mind.


Yes I agree, the blue crinkle Whipple finish on that car looks very impressive under the hood

My question is the 1070hp on pump gas.For years people say you can't make that type of power on pump gas and be safe for the motor.Yet the Jesko.makes 1200 plus on regular gas or 93, and on E-85 it makes over 1600hp.There are some of us that think that is a Ford motor, but what do you say about this?

 

[Vinnie_B]

I have talked to a guy that races a 13-14 GT500 super snake at the TRACK, all over the states and he says they heat soak really quick.Others have said that as well.

Yes. This is true. If your not moving or no air flow is moving thru the engine compartment they will get warm but dont most SC cars get some form of heat soak from sitting idle. I cant really comfrim any heat soak concerns tracking the car but I will soon when I get the car setup they way I want it. What Kind of IAT2'S are these guys seeing at the track?

 

[Cobra Therapy]

Yes. This is true. If your not moving or no air flow is moving thru the engine compartment they will get warm but dont most SC cars get some form of heat soak will just sitting idle. I cant really comfrim any heat soak concerns tracking the car but I will soon when I get the car setup they way I want it. What Kind of IAT2'S are these guys seeing at the track?

 

[Cobra Therapy]

Yes. This is true. If your not moving or no air flow is moving thru the engine compartment they will get warm but dont most SC cars get some form of heat soak will just sitting idle. I cant really comfrim any heat soak concerns tracking the car but I will soon when I get the car setup they way I want it. What Kind of IAT2'S are these guys seeing at the track?

Ask the guy that I just sent from my screen shot. That's his car that he races with that Kenny bell that heat soaks quickly.

 

[Bad Company]

My question is the 1070hp on pump gas.For years people say you can't make that type of power on pump gas and be safe for the motor.Yet the Jesko.makes 1200 plus on regular gas or 93, and on E-85 it makes over 1600hp.There are some of us that think that is a Ford motor, but what do you say about this?

To make Hp and have the engine survive you have to work on what restricts air into and exhaust out of the engine first. The reason you do this is to keep the intake air temperatures lower. If the air entering the cylinder is much cooler than normal then the chance to have detonation occur drops significantly. The idea that these engines are going to self-destruct on a specific fuel at a specific Hp output is ridiculous. They self-destruct when they encounter detonation no matter how high the Hp output. To me the only thing you have to manage is detonation. If you can do this then the engine shouldn't be limited in its Hp output. I also think that an aftermarket high quality ECU is the best way to monitor the engine and to be able to limit timing easily to stay away from detonation at all times. The Hp limit is not controlled by how much Hp the engine produces, but by what the conditions are at the moment in time that exist in the engine that causes detonation. Stay away from detonation and the Hp output can be much higher than what is considered normal for that engine.

I'd be leery of 1200 Hp on pump 87 octane fuel to 93. The problem I would worry about the most while on any pump fuel you try to run the engine on is the quality and consistency of the fuel you purchase. Just because the pump is advertising the fuel as 93 doesn't guarantee the driver that was delivering the fuel to the gas station didn't inadvertently make a mistake and dump 87 in the 93 storage tank. Too many variables in the fuel you purchase at a local gas station. I'm seriously thinking of limiting both boost and RPM for anything lower than E40 in my car to lower the potential. Talking with Shawn I know he will be extremely conservative in timing of this engine. He also monitors intake air temperatures with the MoTec ECU to adjust timing tables in real time to limit the possibility of detonation while the car is being driven.

 

[Cobra Therapy]

To make Hp and have the engine survive you have to work on what restricts air into and exhaust out of the engine first. The reason you do this is to keep the intake air temperatures lower. If the air entering the cylinder is much cooler than normal then the chance to have detonation occur drops significantly. The idea that these engines are going to self-destruct on a specific fuel at a specific Hp output is ridiculous. They self-destruct when they encounter detonation no matter how high the Hp output. To me the only thing you have to manage is detonation. If you can do this then the engine shouldn't be limited in its Hp output. I also think that an aftermarket high quality ECU is the best way to monitor the engine and to be able to limit timing easily to stay away from detonation at all times. The Hp limit is not controlled by how much Hp the engine produces, but by what the conditions are at the moment in time that exist in the engine that causes detonation. Stay away from detonation and the Hp output can be much higher than what is considered normal for that engine.

I'd be leery of 1200 Hp on pump 87 octane fuel to 93. The problem I would worry about the most while on any pump fuel you try to run the engine on is the quality and consistency of the fuel you purchase. Just because the pump is advertising the fuel as 93 doesn't guarantee the driver that was delivering the fuel to the gas station didn't inadvertently make a mistake and dump 87 in the 93 storage tank. Too many variables in the fuel you purchase at a local gas station. I'm seriously thinking of limiting both boost and RPM for anything lower than E40 in my car to lower the potential. Talking with Shawn I know he will be extremely conservative in timing of this engine. He also monitors intake air temperatures with the MoTec ECU to adjust timing tables in real time to limit the possibility of detonation while the car is being driven.

Thanks for the info. I'm not a mechanic, just a fast driver.I understand.

 

[Bad Company]

Thanks for the info. I'm not a mechanic, just a fast driver.I understand.

The issues with building Hp and managing detonation come down to 2 things. Airflow and exhaust restrictions. Why? Heat.

There was a comment about heat soaking the HE and Intercooler system of these cars easily. That is true regardless of any superchargered car. The modifications required to help with this are a trunk tank. The more volume of coolant the longer the car can run before the heat rises in the tank. The problem with a supercharger is unfortunately the size of the intercooler in the intake manifold that is restricted by the space of the valley of the V in a V8 engine and how tall you want the complete engine with the supercharger to be under the hood of the car. The other problem is the fact we're trying to move additional air into the engine to be able to increase the Hp output of said engine. The supercharger is a less complex system to install in my opinion when compared to a turbocharger. Look at the supercharger in the GT500 as nothing more than an air pump. Now how come we have boost in these cars? We are trying to move more air into the engine than it wants to use to fill the cylinders. If we can find ways for the engine to ingest the air coming out of the supercharger without having the intake manifold pressure rise above atmospheric pressure then we don't introduce heat into the air entering the engine. For every 1 psi of boost the air increases roughly 10*F in temperature. So if we can move 2000CFM of air into the engine with only 10psi of boost then we only increased the air temperature 100*F above the ambient temperature entering at the air filter.

Now the intercooler itself is a restriction, usually the boost pressure exiting the supercharger is significantly higher and if the intercooler isn't efficient we can have a boost psi differentials as high or higher than 10psi. So the air exiting the supercharger can be another 100*F above what you're seeing in the lower manifold as AIT2 temperatures. You have to find ways to reduce the restrictions to lower temperatures. How do you lower the restrictions, ported cylinder heads and intake manifold, long tube headers, camshafts, bigger throttle bodies, bigger intake and exhaust valves, bigger exhaust systems to reduce back pressure, bigger air intake piping from the air filter to the TB. The idea is to get rid of as much and as many restrictions as you can, which lowers boost pressure the engine sees. The idea is to move the air through the supercharger into the engine and out the exhaust with the least amount of restrictions. Doing this lowers the amount of heat being introduced into the airstream entering the engine. All of this allows you to increase Hp with less fear of detonation. My engine if it had stock heads, cams, exhaust, valves and intake air filtration system would cause the supercharger to produce a much higher boost level for the same volume of airflow in the lower half of the intake manifold, the air temperatures would be much higher and I would be in detonation on pump 93 octane gasoline at lower Hp output levels. If you haven't upgraded the things I've listed and you bolt a bigger supercharger on and all you want to see is the boost go up by 5-10 psi with a power gain then you've put together a recipe that will have a much higher chance to detonate at lower power levels.

Now the heat soak issue while driving these cars on a road course there isn't really anything you can do to stop it from happening. Usually a road course is either a timed event or so many laps. The issues are that over time the coolant in these systems absorbs too much heat and the the HE can't dissipate it to the atmosphere as fast as the higher boost conditions above atmospheric pressure introduces heat into the system. Look at it in this manner. You have added a bigger HE, but you haven't done the modifications listed above because the rules of the class and the sanctioning body won't allow it. Or your just participating at a club event without the rules but you haven't spent the money to increase performance while reducing airflow restrictions It's a hot 100*F summer day and you have a 15 lap race on a 2 1/2 mile course. 32.5 miles that probably takes 20-25 minutes to complete depending on the course layout. Now lets take 100*F air and compress it for you to see 20 psi in the lower intake manifold. While we are doing this the intercooler is still stock and restrictive, so actually the air exiting the supercharger is at 27psi of pressure, as the stock intercooler is this restrictive. Take 100*F temperature and now add 270*F(27 psi x 10*F = 270*F) to the air exiting the supercharger for 370*F(100*F at air filter +270*F from compression = 370*F) that enters the intercooler to be cooled before entering the engine. Can you now understand how much work the intercooler and HE are actually trying to do to reduce the intake temperatures to acceptable levels for the engine to use. The complete system heat soaks very quickly no matter whether it is a GT500 or a Corvette ZR1. Turbo cars that use the stock intake manifold in a GT500 faces the same problems as a supercharged car does, yet you gain Hp by not spinning the supercharger off of the crankshaft. But you have to be careful in how the turbo system is built and sized on the exhaust side correctly to limit restrictions before the turbo turbine housing and turbine wheel. Any restrictions that are too high here effects the Hp outputs of the engine because exhaust manifold back pressure(EMBP) is what is used to turn the turbo so we need a certain amount before the turbo and as little afterwards.

Hopefully these comments help you understand the problems while trying to make big Hp on pump gasoline. Unfortunately the fixes are expensive to do.

 

[Cobra Therapy]

The issues with building Hp and managing detonation come down to 2 things. Airflow and exhaust restrictions. Why? Heat.

There was a comment about heat soaking the HE and Intercooler system of these cars easily. That is true regardless of any superchargered car. The modifications required to help with this are a trunk tank. The more volume of coolant the longer the car can run before the heat rises in the tank. The problem with a supercharger is unfortunately the size of the intercooler in the intake manifold that is restricted by the space of the valley of the V in a V8 engine and how tall you want the complete engine with the supercharger to be under the hood of the car. The other problem is the fact we're trying to move additional air into the engine to be able to increase the Hp output of said engine. The supercharger is a less complex system to install in my opinion when compared to a turbocharger. Look at the supercharger in the GT500 as nothing more than an air pump. Now how come we have boost in these cars? We are trying to move more air into the engine than it wants to use to fill the cylinders. If we can find ways for the engine to ingest the air coming out of the supercharger without having the intake manifold pressure rise above atmospheric pressure then we don't introduce heat into the air entering the engine. For every 1 psi of boost the air increases roughly 10*F in temperature. So if we can move 2000CFM of air into the engine with only 10psi of boost then we only increased the air temperature 100*F above the ambient temperature entering at the air filter.

Now the intercooler itself is a restriction, usually the boost pressure exiting the supercharger is significantly higher and if the intercooler isn't efficient we can have a boost psi differentials as high or higher than 10psi. So the air exiting the supercharger can be another 100*F above what you're seeing in the lower manifold as AIT2 temperatures. You have to find ways to reduce the restrictions to lower temperatures. How do you lower the restrictions, ported cylinder heads and intake manifold, long tube headers, camshafts, bigger throttle bodies, bigger intake and exhaust valves, bigger exhaust systems to reduce back pressure, bigger air intake piping from the air filter to the TB. The idea is to get rid of as much and as many restrictions as you can, which lowers boost pressure the engine sees. The idea is to move the air through the supercharger into the engine and out the exhaust with the least amount of restrictions. Doing this lowers the amount of heat being introduced into the airstream entering the engine. All of this allows you to increase Hp with less fear of detonation. My engine if it had stock heads, cams, exhaust, valves and intake air filtration system would cause the supercharger to produce a much higher boost level for the same volume of airflow in the lower half of the intake manifold, the air temperatures would be much higher and I would be in detonation on pump 93 octane gasoline at lower Hp output levels. If you haven't upgraded the things I've listed and you bolt a bigger supercharger on and all you want to see is the boost go up by 5-10 psi with a power gain then you've put together a recipe that will have a much higher chance to detonate at lower power levels.

Now the heat soak issue while driving these cars on a road course there isn't really anything you can do to stop it from happening. Usually a road course is either a timed event or so many laps. The issues are that over time the coolant in these systems absorbs too much heat and the the HE can't dissipate it to the atmosphere as fast as the higher boost conditions above atmospheric pressure introduces heat into the system. Look at it in this manner. You have added a bigger HE, but you haven't done the modifications listed above because the rules of the class and the sanctioning body won't allow it. Or your just participating at a club event without the rules but you haven't spent the money to increase performance while reducing airflow restrictions It's a hot 100*F summer day and you have a 15 lap race on a 2 1/2 mile course. 45 miles that probably takes 20-25 minutes to complete depending on the course layout. Now lets take 100*F air and compress it for you to see 20 psi in the lower intake manifold. While we are doing this the intercooler is still stock and restrictive, so actually the air exiting the supercharger is at 27psi of pressure, as the stock intercooler is this restrictive. Take 100*F temperature and now add 270*F(27 psi x 10*F = 270*F) to the air exiting the supercharger for 370*F(100*F at air filter +270*F from compression = 370*F) that enters the intercooler to be cooled before entering the engine. Can you now understand how much work the intercooler and HE are actually trying to do to reduce the intake temperatures to acceptable levels for the engine to use. The complete system heat soaks very quickly no matter whether it is a GT500 or a Corvette ZR1. Turbo cars that use the stock intake manifold in a GT500 faces the same problems as a supercharged car does, yet you gain Hp by not spinning the supercharger off of the crankshaft. But you have to be careful in how the turbo system is built and sized on the exhaust side correctly to limit restrictions before the turbo turbine housing and turbine wheel. Any restrictions that are too high here effects the Hp outputs of the engine because exhaust manifold back pressure(EMBP) is what is used to turn the turbo so we need a certain amount before the turbo and as little afterwards.

Hopefully these comments help you understand the problems while trying to make big Hp on pump gasoline. Unfortunately the fixes are expensive to do.

FANTASTIC information sir.

 

[Bad Company]

Here is a data log of Shelby running at the Texas Mile if you look closely the temperatures of the intake air are listed twice. The one that is showing extremely high at 462*F is under the supercharger before it passes through the intercooler. The second intake air temperature reading was taken after the air passed through the intercooler and is reading 152*F. That is a 310*F difference. To cool the air temperatures that much the trunk tank water temperature was 40*F. The other things in the intercooler and HE system that are modified is the intercooler was not a stock one and was a single pass using -20 line entering the rear, the two ports in the front are now exits for the coolant and go through a modified Shelby America HE that has been converted to single pass. Coolant exits the HE and returns to the tank again in a -20 hose. Coolant volume moving throughout the system is roughly 3 times more than a stock car. The car was a 12:1 compression engine running on methanol. This data log was taken in 2014 before KB came out with the Biggin Intercooler which actually has slightly larger opening if you modify the intake manifold correctly. The driver of this car was going through the licensing process and this pass was limited to 200mph. He was doing 209 at the half mile mark and lifted this is why the graphs look as if he shifted up to 6th gear. When he lifted the car slowed dramatically due to the air resistance and he got back in the throttle to get to the speed he needed for the next step up in the licensing process. Unfortunately after this run it started to rain and the event was cancelled for the rest of the weekend. Shawn felt the car would have been faster than 240mph if it had ever gone back to the event for another attempt, the owner decided he didn't want to pursue any attempts at higher speeds.

 

[Tezz500]

Here is a data log of Shelby running at the Texas Mile if you look closely the temperatures of the intake air are listed twice. The one that is showing extremely high at 462*F is under the supercharger before it passes through the intercooler. The second intake air temperature reading was taken after the air passed through the intercooler and is reading 152*F. That is a 310*F difference. To cool the air temperatures that much the trunk tank water temperature was 40*F. The other things in the intercooler and HE system that are modified is the intercooler was not a stock one and was a single pass using -20 line entering the rear, the two ports in the front are now exits for the coolant and go through a modified Shelby America HE that has been converted to single pass. Coolant exits the HE and returns to the tank again in a -20 hose. Coolant volume moving throughout the system is roughly 3 times more than a stock car. The car was a 12:1 compression engine running on methanol. This data log was taken in 2014 before KB came out with the Biggin Intercooler which actually has slightly larger opening if you modify the intake manifold correctly. The driver of this car was going through the licensing process and this pass was limited to 200mph. He was doing 209 at the half mile mark and lifted this is why the graphs look as if he shifted up to 6th gear. When he lifted the car slowed dramatically due to the air resistance and he got back in the throttle to get to the speed he needed for the next step up in the licensing process. Unfortunately after this run it started to rain and the event was cancelled for the rest of the weekend. Shawn felt the car would have been faster than 240mph if it had ever gone back to the event for another attempt, the owner decided he didn't want to pursue any attempts at higher speeds.

240mph on 22 psi of boost?!

 

[Bad Company]

240mph on 22 psi of boost?!

Come on now Krammer, don't you believe???? LOL

You needed to look at the right side of the screen and see where the high was 32.4 psi of boost.

I also believe the pulley combination was spinning the supercharger above the maximum speed of 18,000RPM by KB. I think this is why the intake air temperatures were 462*F exiting the supercharger. Once you spin a supercharger or turbocharger above its maximum recommend speed they really start adding significant amount of heat to the air exiting either of them. Also from my understanding the 4.2L KB SC doesn't have as an efficient design rotor/compressor pack when compared to the 4.7. The engine and supercharger were built before KB offered the 4.7 for sale, it is a 4.2L SC on this run. Today a 4.7 or 4.9 could be turned significantly slower for the same airflow output and not introduce as much heat to the air. I've gone back and forth on which would be more efficient a 4.7 or a 4.9 with the 168mm mono-blade TB. I fear the TB would be a restriction for both of the bigger SCs. If the TB starts restricting the air into the SC, again you start causing more heat to be introduced into the airstream entering the engine. The cost difference between a 4.7 and a 4.9 is $200, so picking the bigger 4.9 really doesn't significantly raise the costs. It has the potential to add 108CFM when both utilize a 15% lower with a 4" upper pulley and you're turning the engine 7500RPM and the SC RPM is 15,281. Now the next interesting question is this.

What will happen if you install a 10% lower and a 4" upper to slow the 4.9L SC down to have the same airflow exiting the as the example above of the 4.7?

The SC speed is reduced to 14,644 RPM with nearly identical CFM of air exiting the SC 2,533CFM for the 4.9 versus the 4.7 turning 15,281 RPM producing 2,536CFM. In this example the TB has to deal with the same restriction because the volume of air each SC is trying to move is identical. At some point turning the 4.9 slow it will lose efficiency. Unfortunately without spending a bunch of time and money to compare each against each other in this manner we can only give slightly educated guesses. I personally think it would be close to each other. The extra mass of the 4.9L rotor/compressor pack is going to take a little bit more Hp to turn it as you accelerate, yet once you get close to the peak engine RPM will it eat less Hp to keep turning it due to the stored inertia? Shawn wants me to go 4.9, I keep thinking this won't give me much of an advantage unless I pulleyed the two the same, but again what is the TB restriction going to do with either set up?


Head Scratcher!!!!

 

[Tezz500]

Come on now Krammer, don't you believe???? LOL

You needed to look at the right side of the screen and see where the high was 32.4 psi of boost.

I also believe the pulley combination was spinning the supercharger above the maximum speed of 18,000RPM by KB. I think this is why the intake air temperatures were 462*F exiting the supercharger. Once you spin a supercharger or turbocharger above its maximum recommend speed they really start adding significant amount of heat to the air exiting either of them. Also from my understanding the 4.2L KB SC doesn't have as an efficient design rotor/compressor pack when compared to the 4.7. The engine and supercharger were built before KB offered the 4.7 for sale, it is a 4.2L SC on this run. Today a 4.7 or 4.9 could be turned significantly slower for the same airflow output and not introduce as much heat to the air. I've gone back and forth on which would be more efficient a 4.7 or a 4.9 with the 168mm mono-blade TB. I fear the TB would be a restriction for both of the bigger SCs. If the TB starts restricting the air into the SC, again you start causing more heat to be introduced into the airstream entering the engine. The cost difference between a 4.7 and a 4.9 is $200, so picking the bigger 4.9 really doesn't significantly raise the costs. It has the potential to add 108CFM when both utilize a 15% lower with a 4" upper pulley and you're turning the engine 7500RPM and the SC RPM is 15,281. Now the next interesting question is this.

What will happen if you install a 10% lower and a 4" upper to slow the 4.9L SC down to have the same airflow exiting the as the example above of the 4.7?

The SC speed is reduced to 14,644 RPM with nearly identical CFM of air exiting the SC 2,533CFM for the 4.9 versus the 4.7 turning 15,281 RPM producing 2,536CFM. In this example the TB has to deal with the same restriction because the volume of air each SC is trying to move is identical. At some point turning the 4.9 slow it will lose efficiency. Unfortunately without spending a bunch of time and money to compare each against each other in this manner we can only give slightly educated guesses. I personally think it would be close to each other. The extra mass of the 4.9L rotor/compressor pack is going to take a little bit more Hp to turn it as you accelerate, yet once you get close to the peak engine RPM will it eat less Hp to keep turning it due to the stored inertia? Shawn wants me to go 4.9, I keep thinking this won't give me much of an advantage unless I pulleyed the two the same, but again what is the TB restriction going to do with either set up?


Head Scratcher!!!!

Ahhh I see it now.

 

[1Kona_Venom]

Horrible quality
forgot to charge my go-pro
So S-10 cell pics

 

[1 Alibi 2]

Horrible quality
forgot to charge my go-pro
So S-10 cell pics

View attachment 1833797

It will do,......................but don't let it happen again !!
.

 

[1 Alibi 2]

.

 

[03DSGMach1]

 

[LivingEZ]

 

[HPLouis]

Took the cars out of winter storage and went for a drive.