really cheap cai

[wbt]

Wow, just wow.

Take a look at the KING OF THE STREET compitition. No stock boxes there.
Chris Cruz this years winner runs a JLT Big Air Intake, 9.70's on 20" drag radials and just made over 900 RWHP.

But I guess that's different and you'll tell me why?

I'm sure wbt's test will be as fair as can be, seeing he's open minded about intakes and the abiltiy they have to making power. ;-)

I don't have the time or energy to argue on the internet about something so rediclious.
Enjoy your discussion guys.

You are right, wow and wow.

1. I ask again what does a FI car have to do with the discussion? Completely different situation when air is being forced into the engine vs. a N/A car. :nono:

2. I have no hidden agenda. In fact, I own 2 aftermarket CAI's. Your plastic piece and an Airaid unit. Regarding being open minded, I stated before I will post results regardless of how your CAI performs whether better, the same or worse than the stock unit. If it is better, I will leave it on the car. The community will get non-biased feedback so it's members can make a better decision about what to purchase for their own cars.

This quote is great:

In the MM&FF 2011 5.0 shootout not a single car had the stock box and were talking about the best shops in the business, JPC, Livernios, Beefcake Racing, Strickly, Evo, Kelley Performance, Woodbine Motorsports and Revolution Performance. ALL were smart enough to get the most ET out of their car using an air intake. So all these shops don't know what their doing? Really?

A few things here....
1. Do these shops sell aftermarket parts? Yes.
2. Do these shops make a profit from selling aftermarket parts? Yes
3. Do these shops sell what they run? Yes
4. Do these shops make money when they don't sell aftermarket parts? Yes but not as much as they do when they sell parts along with labor, tuning, etc.

I am not discrediting any of them. They have a vested interest in this. I on the other hand don't. It cost my time and money to test this stuff out and I don't call around begging for parts from various vendors.

Regarding racers using the stock CAI, NMRA Factory Stock last year had quite a few 2011+ Mustangs in the 11's.

 

[beefcake]

I like the 2 mph, but the .1 is pretty marginal. I don't even know if that is worth the time and expense...unless I wind up stuck back in the 12's.

Mike

It's one of those things, if you are trying to get the absolute most, do it. Plus not to mention, some people like the look of the aftermarket CAI's a lot better as well.

Just like headers, on an n/a car, the gains weren't crazy, but still about 25 rwhp. And the car picked up. But, there is the sound factor there too.

On my car, making the power it is, I guarantee the headers are paying off well over 25rwhp.

The arguement is just old. Me and the CAI Police have been having the same argument for nearly 2 years now.

Whenever a CAI thread comes up, it would be much easier to simply copy and past, so everyone that hasn't seen the argument can see it.

 

[kdanner]

I track tested the Steeda CAI intake.

At the time I track tested the part. I was not selling any of these parts, I did not start selling them until 8 months later.

Even now, I still do not sell any Steeda products.

I cannot attest to other brands of CAI's, as I have not tested them. I can attest that the Steeda CAI, picked me up .1 and 2mph.

I DO NOT SELL STEEDA PARTS, STEEDA HAS NEVER GIVEN ME ANYTHING

FACT, not fiction

I have timeslips, FACT, not fiction

The results are what the results are. The tuning was done by one of your good friends. FACT, not fiction

Want to talk facts? Some of my other friends manufacture or sell parts at small businesses, others work in engineering at some larger ones. You've called up more than one of them begging for free or discounted parts, telling them all about all the "exposure" you're going to get for them in exchange. You provide marketing efforts, either overtly or covertly. That's what you do for a living, you're a salesman.

Whether you like it or not, people can choose to buy one of these based off what you salesmen have to say, or they can base it off what the paying end users have to say. The ones who say they got nothing out of these certainly outnumber you.

 

[ViciousJay]

Want to talk facts? Some of my other friends manufacture or sell parts at small businesses, others work in engineering at some larger ones. You've called up more than one of them begging for free or discounted parts, telling them all about all the "exposure" you're going to get for them in exchange. You provide marketing efforts, either overtly or covertly. That's what you do for a living, you're a salesman.

Whether you like it or not, people can choose to buy one of these based off what you salesmen have to say, or they can base it off what the paying end users have to say. The ones who say they got nothing out of these certainly outnumber you.

regardless of anything, if your really tuning peoples cars ill say this your cockiness and overall demeanor is a joke on this site and Modfords. Since you both do things for the community take it up in a PM, no one wants to see two vendors bitch at each other (no offense beefcake, you were one of the first to test alot of parts)

 

[phack]

I've found some crazy stuff in the manual GT calibrations that limit power on the track, but allow full power on the dyno. Jay, I'll call you tomorrow to discuss this.

IMO (as stated before) it's the TUNE that's limiting power, not the CAI. Hense the approach I've taken of 'limited mods' to go fast. I've been on a mission to maximize every bolt on BEFORE going to the next mod. The last 2 months this car has kicked my *ss at the strip, but we've made serious progress on *how* it limits power at the track vs the dyno.
This weekends drag testing has shown excellent results. Getting around the limitations in the manual GT ECU is in my power...finally!
I am confident we can now 'get the power to the ground' in ways not possible before.

Is this something only advantageous for your drag tune or can it be applied to the performance tune?

 

[D.T.R]

 

[D.T.R]

regardless of anything, if your really tuning peoples cars ill say this your cockiness and overall demeanor is a joke on this site and Modfords. Since you both do things for the community take it up in a PM, no one wants to see two vendors bitch at each other (no offense beefcake, you were one of the first to test alot of parts)

 

[Tucker]

My proposal was simple. I want to go fast. If this part makes me go faster, I will buy it. If it does not, it gets returned. If JLT and Tucker want to roll the dice, I am all for it. Granatelli did this exact same thing over on the Corral with their coils and the guy picked up close to 10 HP, so he bought the coils.

I don't expect this offer to be accepted, however.

Mike

Mike,
Once Shaun gets the tune figured out I have no problem sending you a kit, done deal.
He's onto something so it should be soon.

Other wise it would be a foolish move to send a kit to someone for testing when they have openly said they don't have a quality tune for it yet, don't you think?

Shaun will nail it:beer:

 

[MikeLTDLX]

Mike,
Once Shaun gets the tune figured out I have no problem sending you a kit, done deal.
He's onto something so it should be soon.

Other wise it would be a foolish move to send a kit to someone for testing when they have openly said they don't have a quality tune for it yet, don't you think?

Shaun will nail it:beer:

Yes, of course. That means we do have to wait for Shaun to work the magic he is in the midst of working. I am keeping up with his progress, because the CAI is something I have been asking him about. He has discussed the roadblocks with me, and what he has been working on to get around them. I would not run the CAI without a tune that would not be band-aid solution to the limits encountered. I should have made that more clear when I said I would run it with a "proper" tune.

I am up for it,

Mike

 

[kdanner]

regardless of anything, if your really tuning peoples cars ill say this your cockiness and overall demeanor is a joke on this site and Modfords. Since you both do things for the community take it up in a PM, no one wants to see two vendors bitch at each other (no offense beefcake, you were one of the first to test alot of parts)

I am not a vendor, don't call me one. I've never accepted a dime for tuning someone's car. I don't sell parts either, other than the occasional used part personally owned by me. So, if my no BS attitude is cockiness to you, that's fine, I'm not using forums for stealth marketing anyway.

 

[ViciousJay]

I am not a vendor, don't call me one. I've never accepted a dime for tuning someone's car. I don't sell parts either, other than the occasional used part personally owned by me. So, if my no BS attitude is cockiness to you, that's fine, I'm not using forums for stealth marketing anyway.

thats fine, but instead of acting like a douche bag know it all, be nice and help the community. What just cuz you might know a little more info doesnt make you think you know it all, were here to help each other out. I guess i would expect a little more out of someone your age :nonono:

 

[kdanner]

thats fine, but instead of acting like a douche bag know it all, be nice and help the community. What just cuz you might know a little more info doesnt make you think you know it all, were here to help each other out. I guess i would expect a little more out of someone your age :nonono:

There are those who would see efforts to expose the falsehoods regarding the performance of certain parts as help since it prevents them from wasting their money. I guess you aren't one of them. What do you want me to do? Turn over my files to someone who will use that information to profit from? Not going to happen.

 

[D.T.R]

thats fine, but instead of acting like a douche bag know it all, be nice and help the community. What just cuz you might know a little more info doesnt make you think you know it all, were here to help each other out. I guess i would expect a little more out of someone your age :nonono:

I think that the simple fact of this topic is already helping the community.
At least is helping ME. I think I'm going to save my $$ on the CAI until there is further research and results on it that shows the gains of the CAI.

 

[SVTPete83]

I think that the simple fact of this topic is already helping the community.
At least is helping ME. I think I'm going to save my $$ on the CAI until there is further research and results on that shows the gains of the CAI.

This...

 

[ViciousJay]

I think that the simple fact of this topic is already helping the community.
At least is helping ME. I think I'm going to save my $$ on the CAI until there is further research and results on it that shows the gains of the CAI.

Shaun already said hes found a secret out, i guess we will have to wait, id like to see how this helps and when so i might be calling for a tune

 

[Seer]

I've went 11.9 (2011 5.0 MT82) on the stock airbox/aftermarket tune, and a friend of mine went 12.2 stock airbox and a procal tune.

Now I also went 11.6 NA but the DA also dropped by 1500 as well, but the car did have a CAI then, so cant say what attributed to what.

 

[SID297]

That's right on par with the dyno gains.
Adding our intake to a tuned GT we typically pick up 12-15 RWHP.
.1 & 2mph is about 12-15 RWHP.

Just looking at the time slip list on this forum nearly all 11 second cars have a filter/intake and most 12 second cars have the stock box.

Lund tune Terry?

WBT, why the hostility? :shrug: Shaun has said over and over the issue with some not gaining time at the track is due to the tables in the tune.

If the cars are making 12-15 more HP on the dyno and the tune isn't getting it to the ground more work should be put into the tune instead of trying to discredit the intake, wouldn't you think?

Intakes don't just stop working in 2011 Mustangs.

As for dynoing with the hood up, it must be done that way to be fair. There are only a couple dyno shops that have dyno cells that can control the temps and wind as if the car is driving on the street. Arrington has this and Travis this sites owner tested the Airaid intake on it and with the hood closed and it still picked up power.

When driving under hood temps are not as hot as some think. Once moving they come down fast. Check it with your stock box. It goes up at idle and comes down at speed. The difference I have found in testing is that the open filter IAT's come down faster than the stock box does.

I just did this today with my 2011 GT Roush blower car with JLT Big Air Intake.
IAT Temp test - YouTube

At 45 mph IAT's were only 2 degrees higher than ambient.

With the air inlet on the 2011's under hood temps don't get much higher than 10-15 degrees above ambient in slow speed traffic.

So dynoing with the hood closed and a small fan isn't doing the intake justice.

So their not "hot air Intakes" at all.
I say test, test and test. If you make power on the dyno, work more on the tune to get it to the ground.

An air intake is the # 1 -#2 mod every car owner does and that's not because they don't work.

You guys running 11's with the stock box are killer drivers and tuners, congrats!!:beer:
Once you get the tune down for the good intakes you'll be even faster.

Thanks
Jay

That's pretty much how I see it.

I wasn't being hostile. I am responding to these "claims" so the community isn't brainwashed further than already has been. Let's break this down:

1. Your argument about dyno'ing with the hood closed is laughable at best. Both intakes are still being used under the same conditions. Dyno'ing with the hood open doesn't make anything fair other than claims that can be made to sell a product. Again, we don't drive our car's around with the hood open.
2. You are right about Travis testing the Airaid intake with the hood open and closed. He stated with the hood closed, the results compared to stock were similar and gains were negligible.
3. My tuner and I reviewed IAT's with a aftermarket CAI on my car in traffic and we noticed that temps were much higher than ambient. It took almost 1 mile of driving for the IAT's to move back down close to ambient temps. They are hot air intakes.
4. I guarantee you my tuner is one of the best. He doesn't offer his services for sale to anyone and does it only for himself and close friends. He has many connections in the Ford tuning community. He damn sure knows how to tune for an aftermarket CAI.
5. CAI's are one of the more popular mods because they are offered in package deals with tunes. The gains on these cars are in the tune, very little if any are a result of the CAI.
6. Comparing FI intake results to a N/A car is ridiculous. No idea why this was brought into the picture.
7. As I previously stated, I purchased your plastic CAI with my own money and will be spending my own time testing it at the track. I will report unbiased results to the community regardless of if it performs the same, better or worse than stock. How many owners out there are willing to do that?

2. Incorrect. I found that in Arrington's dyno-cell the difference of hood up or down was negligible with the intake. Back-to-back runs (with a cool down) with the intake on the car and only the hood position changed gave us a difference of 1-2 HP.

 

[wbt]

That's pretty much how I see it.



2. Incorrect. I found that in Arrington's dyno-cell the difference of hood up or down was negligible with the intake. Back-to-back runs (with a cool down) with the intake on the car and only the hood position changed gave us a difference of 1-2 HP.

In comparison to the stock CAI?

http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...4-svtp-tests-jlts-painted-plastic-intake.html

Hmmmmm........

 

[Tucker]

Regarding racers using the stock CAI, NMRA Factory Stock last year had quite a few 2011+ Mustangs in the 11's.

That was a rule:-D Everyone had to run the stock box.

1. I ask again what does a FI car have to do with the discussion? Completely different situation when air is being forced into the engine vs. a N/A car.

Not sure what your talking about here and don't really care. I did IAT testing on my S/C car to show IAT's aren't anywhere near as hot as you say. BTW, My S/C intake is just like my N/A intake, so temps are the same.

2. I have no hidden agenda. In fact, I own 2 aftermarket CAI's. Your plastic piece and an Airaid unit. Regarding being open minded, I stated before I will post results regardless of how your CAI performs whether better, the same or worse than the stock unit. If it is better, I will leave it on the car. The community will get non-biased feedback so it's members can make a better decision about what to purchase for their own cars.

We all agree "some" are not able to tune the car for the changes an intake makes. So until you figutre that out, no cense in testing.

This quote is great:

Quote:
In the MM&FF 2011 5.0 shootout not a single car had the stock box and were talking about the best shops in the business, JPC, Livernios, Beefcake Racing, Strickly, Evo, Kelley Performance, Woodbine Motorsports and Revolution Performance. ALL were smart enough to get the most ET out of their car using an air intake. So all these shops don't know what their doing? Really?

A few things here....
1. Do these shops sell aftermarket parts? Yes.
2. Do these shops make a profit from selling aftermarket parts? Yes
3. Do these shops sell what they run? Yes
4. Do these shops make money when they don't sell aftermarket parts? Yes but not as much as they do when they sell parts along with labor, tuning, etc.

Hmm, doesn't hold water:nono:
Times ranged from 11.20 - 12.20 and MPH from 114-121.

Mods included Cold Air Intake, Headers, cat backs and tuning
ALL had at least an intake
So if the stock box is the way to go you'd think at least one shop would have tried to show off it's tuning and driving abilty and run it stock right? :shrug:

Please, the best in the business were at this thing and NONE were foolish enough to run the stock box.

Imagine if more time was spent at the track figuring out the tune problem vs running around the forums attacking parts sellers.

 

[Tucker]

In comparison to the stock CAI?

http://www.svtperformance.com/forum...4-svtp-tests-jlts-painted-plastic-intake.html

Hmmmmm........

Wrong test and wrong thread. He tested the Airaid at Arrington