Tuning question

[madscotsman]

Based on other's experiences, what is typical length of time to resolve an issue with a tune. If the issue is created with daily driving, will a dyno tune really help? Is there something a tuner can do in the car that they cant do with datalog files. Vendor is in FL but will be in OH (4 hour drive for me), in June, and wants to see my car. Don't want to drive all the way there to just keep having the same problem.
I'm working with the owner now of a vendor that I bought an upgrade package from including a tune. Car stalls multiple times at least every other time I drive it. Slow down to come to a stop, downshift to second, push the clutch in to either go to 1st or neutral so I can stop, and the car just dies. So it either dies at a stop sign/light or going around a turn. I am on around my 20th tune revision and have provided log files with the issue.

 

[Weather Man]

Time for a new tuner, it is that simple.

 

[BigPoppa]

Mine had issue with holding idle when coming to a stop after installing the twins and an entirely new fuel system with e85 from basically stock. After mentioning it to my tuner and a single datalog, it was fixed with the next revision.

You can hire their services from the link in my signature

They don't make a bunch of funny YouTube videos, though, if that is what you are after.

 

[ibleedblue65]

Based on other's experiences, what is typical length of time to resolve an issue with a tune. If the issue is created with daily driving, will a dyno tune really help? Is there something a tuner can do in the car that they cant do with datalog files. Vendor is in FL but will be in OH (4 hour drive for me), in June, and wants to see my car. Don't want to drive all the way there to just keep having the same problem.
I'm working with the owner now of a vendor that I bought an upgrade package from including a tune. Car stalls multiple times at least every other time I drive it. Slow down to come to a stop, downshift to second, push the clutch in to either go to 1st or neutral so I can stop, and the car just dies. So it either dies at a stop sign/light or going around a turn. I am on around my 20th tune revision and have provided log files with the issue.

I know most probably don't realize it since we are now in the era of email tuning, but you are always going to end up with a higher quality product with less hassle and better customer service when you have your vehicle tuned in person. A good tuner will ask you to drop the car so that they can drive it a day or two to make sure the driveability is jam up before giving it back to you.

It still amazes me how many people do email tuning.

 

[ibleedblue65]

Dp

 

[ibleedblue65]

Time for a new tuner, it is that simple.

Mine had issue with holding idle when coming to a stop after installing the twins and an entirely new fuel system with e85 from basically stock. After mentioning it to my tuner and a single datalog, it was fixed with the next revision.

You can hire their services from the link in my signature

They don't make a bunch of funny YouTube videos, though, if that is what you are after.

What if there is an actual mechanical issue with the car?

 

[Weather Man]

What if there is an actual mechanical issue with the car?

They can see that in the logs. The good tuners have done multiple similar cars and know what and how it should respond.

Hell, LITO from Venezuela earns a damn good living remotely tuning 3V cars everywhere in the world.

 

[Newtermiowner03]

Remote or email tuning has it's up and downs. If your tuner is very familiar with you car and the mods you have a simple data log sent to him he should be able to figure it out. However dyno tuning has its ups and downs as well. If the tuner wants a wide open throttle data log then it could be risky for your safety and the safety of your wallet if a cop catches your running 110mph down the highway vs putting it on the dyno and being able to get a WOT pull. BUT to be blunt and more accurate with your question if your tuner hasn't figured out your car yet he's probably incapable of email tuning your car. He may have better luck in person on a dyno or him datalogging while your driving(maybe your not logging correctly) but I kind of agree with an above comment of you may need to start looking for another tuner. If you've already payed the guy before and he's willing to try to correct in person without charge I'd give him another shot if it doesn't work out find another tuner.


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[rotor_powerd]

Dyno tuning is always the best way to go. The tuner can see and feel exactly what's going on with the car and make changes on the spot. You'll still need a tuner that's familiar with the platform and hardware that you're using though. The problem with SCT/HP Tuners and other flash methods is that you're forcing the factory ECU to do things it wasn't necessarily meant to do, and there are right and wrong ways to go about getting the car to behave how you want it to consistently. You want to find someone that is a "calibrator," not a "tuner."

 

[03cobra#694]

Dyno tuning is always the best way to go. The tuner can see and feel exactly what's going on with the car and make changes on the spot. You'll still need a tuner that's familiar with the platform and hardware that you're using though. The problem with SCT/HP Tuners and other flash methods is that you're forcing the factory ECU to do things it wasn't necessarily meant to do, and there are right and wrong ways to go about getting the car to behave how you want it to consistently. You want to find someone that is a "calibrator," not a "tuner."

While I do agree with most of this. It's still a simulator vs real street conditions. I think you know what I mean.

 

[rotor_powerd]

I do. Can't beat street tuning for tip in and part throttle stuff. The cost of your "tune" goes from $500 for an email tune to a couple thousand dollars once you get into all of that, though. You get what you pay for

 

[blownbrainmustang]

I'm currently in the process of buttoning up the tvs tune for my car with an email tuner.
After today's part accel/idle log I was sent a revision along with an issue being noticed. He noticed at idle car fluctuating 10% rich to 10% lean and informed me of the (mechanical) issue that causes this symptom.

TL;DR- Good tuner should be able to see issues in a log and inform you of problem.


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[madscotsman]

I am not here to try to trash anyone, the "tuner" is VMP. I bought their roush upgrade about 2 years ago. It was installed at my local dealership who is a Roush certified dealer. Thought was if I had issues, dealership would help. I trust my service guy as he is also a friend. The kit came with JLT intake, colder plugs, 2 pulleys, an SCT tuner with their tune loaded on it. Car stalled randomly since install but it wasnt ever enough of a headache or occuring frequently enough for me to datalog it. I purchased a VMP fuel pump booster which required an updated tune for the voltage changes. That is when the issue got worse. I started with one tuner at VMP with my request and payment for the tune update, and then reached out to Justin after at least 5-6 updates since the issue was not getting resolved. Car was at the dealership for 2 days where they went through everything, looked for vaccum leaks, and did every possible diagnostic test they could perform on the car for free even though I am out of warranty(car has 25k but is a 2012), including testing the fuel pump booster. They datalogged the car however Ford does it and told me they are 100% sure it is the tune. Im on Justin's 9-10th revision and the car still stalls multiple times at least every other time I drive it. I plan to try to make it to Ohio next month as he has told me he will look at the car free of charge, but having to call him every day with the same results is getting frustrating. Just wondered if anyone else had gone through issues like this and trying to understand how/if paying for a dyno tune (my idea not vmp's), would/could resolve an issue that occurs only when the clutch is engaged or the car is in neutral and coming to a stop. Was wondering what he can do in person that doesnt get captured with a datalog?!?

 

[ibleedblue65]

They can see that in the logs. The good tuners have done multiple similar cars and know what and how it should respond.

Hell, LITO from Venezuela earns a damn good living remotely tuning 3V cars everywhere in the world.

Um not necessarily. For instance, it's nearly impossible to see spark blow out in a log.

 

[Newtermiowner03]

I would try not to pay full price for the dyno tune. If the reason for being put on the dyno is because the can't get the email tune quiet right. I would push for only paying the difference between the two. As I said above I'd take it to him this time. Let him datalog the car while your driving and try to replicate what it's doing while he's in the car data logging and if needs to be on the dyno try to push for only paying the difference of the two prices. And if you still have a problem after that I would either ask for another tuner at vmp Alex maybe? Or go to a different tuner all together. I dont know where you live but someone on here could give you an idea of good tuners nearest to you.


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[BigPoppa]

Um not necessarily. For instance, it's nearly impossible to see spark blow out in a log.

You simply look at the curve of rpm vs time which is the same data you are collecting on a dyno. Heck, if you know the exact weight of the car, you can get an exact power output also.

When the slope is inconsistent or erratic when compared with the previous portion of the curve, you can see where the stall is at. You then have to figure out what the cause of the stall is, just like on a dyno.

While a dyno is more convenient for the tuner and safer, a good street tune is the only way to replicate true driving conditions.

Same thing goes for the drag strip. You ultimately change the tune based on the logs of your runs, not by putting it on the dyno, which is why I try to get good log data for my tuner every time I go to the strip.

 

[Stang Lover]

I would of been switched after the 5th revision. Sorry you are having issues with your tune. If you decide to switch tuners I would give Palm Beach Dyno or Lund a call.

 

[RedVenom48]

+1 for Lund. Switched this past fall through Lethal Performance and damn, has my car been stable and makes solid power for running the stock M122. My idle quality was dramatically improved. Customer service is second to none as the Lunds will talk you down from any hairbrained idea you might run by them lol.

Soon as I can afford a remote dyno tune from them its on.

 

[Deceptive]

As good as VMP has seemed to be and the number of revisions I am willing to bet the dealership missed something.

Not saying that Justin could not be missing something. You are at the mercy of hoping the dealership didn't miss anything or that the issue is the tune. It could be the ECU itself.


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[Kiohtee]

I can't speak to or against VMP except that I've always heard good things about them, but I'm currently tuned with Lund. And man am I happy with them! I was also happy with Bama, believe it or not, and even had their tuned verified on a dyno where the owner of the shop told me "honestly, you'd be wasting your money going from us to them as everything appears spot on."