Worked 02 SS vs. 99 Cobra

[99NJCobra]

Ok, so my friend has an '02 SS anniversary edition with H/C/I, full exhaust, and bolt ons and is putting down 401rwhp at the moment. He also has a 100 shot to boot. I wanna give him some competition (for when he isn't hitting the juice) within our circle of friends so I'd at least like to try to put down between 390 and 410rwhp NA. I won't be racing much at all, but it'll be nice to have the power there. What would you guys suggest H/C/I wise? Right now I have stock headers, O/R x-pipe, cat back, CAI, and 3.73's. Eventually I want to go with a a forged bottom end (thinking about a 5.0 stroker???) but for now it'll be stock block and internals.
Thanks.

 

[Orange Stang 04]

Staying NA at those power levels will be expensive. Why not just get a procharger and you will have over 400 rwhp on a safe tune.

 

[UCBeau]

400 rwhp while N/A? haha got 10,000 bucks?

 

[Torch10th]

I doubt if you can reach those power levels on the stock shortblock. The stock itnake ported or not also isn't going to cut it.

Remember that power isn't everything. Power to weight ratio is. Why not finish up all the bolt-ons

ported upper/lower, long tubes, pullies, go with 4.30's and a tune. This should get you to around 320 to the tires if not slightly more.

Now start shedding weight. Rear seat delete if you don't carry passengers in the back. racing seats in the front. lightweight battery lightened hood. lightweight flywheel and pressure plate, aluminum DS... These are all things that will reduce weight without significantly reducing comfort.

Also it's easier to obtain the power to weight ratio (within reason) you want by reducing weight over adding power. You also get the added benefit of being able to stop faster, consume less fuel and create less strain on the drivetrain.

Then get a set of sticky tires. I'm sure you'll be plenty of competition for him at that point. Probably not beeting him but at least enough to have some fun with him.

 

[poopy01]

pick up some 04 cobra heads with a P&P, new cams, fr500 intake, and more bolt ons. Or a supercharger. I myself would go with the first, I love N/A power. But it would cost alot more cause of the intake.

 

[99cobrablack]

It'll take alot with what you have, to meet up with what he has. I would start with a SRA, and either alot of spray or boost.

 

[REX-RACER]

I doubt if you can reach those power levels on the stock shortblock. The stock itnake ported or not also isn't going to cut it.

Remember that power isn't everything. Power to weight ratio is. Why not finish up all the bolt-ons

ported upper/lower, long tubes, pullies, go with 4.30's and a tune. This should get you to around 320 to the tires if not slightly more.

Now start shedding weight. Rear seat delete if you don't carry passengers in the back. racing seats in the front. lightweight battery lightened hood. lightweight flywheel and pressure plate, aluminum DS... These are all things that will reduce weight without significantly reducing comfort.

Also it's easier to obtain the power to weight ratio (within reason) you want by reducing weight over adding power. You also get the added benefit of being able to stop faster, consume less fuel and create less strain on the drivetrain.

Then get a set of sticky tires. I'm sure you'll be plenty of competition for him at that point. Probably not beeting him but at least enough to have some fun with him.

Agreed! Don't buy into the aura and mystique of the all powerful "El Ess Won" h/c/i combo. They're beatable. Just to prove the point take a look at one of our members hear puttin' the smack on a C5 Vette! This was done w/ the help of 4.56 gears: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288475

Granted that's not an h/c/i car but a 'Vette is significantly lighter than a Camaro and it obviously had bolt-ons so I'd take them to be in a comperable performance range n/a. Like Torch10th said leverage and weight reduction are your friends plus you need to optimize your bolt ons and tune. Another thing to keep in mind that might get you a little more hp to the ground would be to use quality synthetic fluids like Royal Purple or Red Line in the engine, trans and dif. You can actually pick up 5-8 hp that way too.

The key to beating the LS1 cars, off the bottle, seems to be gearing and driving. Good luck! :beer:

 

[AJRED99]

I doubt if you can reach those power levels on the stock shortblock. The stock itnake ported or not also isn't going to cut it.

I disagree, I have a 99 cobra with full bolt-ons along with fully ported C Heads, stage 3 comp cams and valvetrain and the stock intake which is fully ported and polished also, LT's, ect.... After all is said and done I am making a little over 400rwhp with the stock shortblock. To top it off I also am using an NX EFI Race kit and spraying a 100 shot :fm: . Granted my block is on borrowed time but it runs hard as hell and would give quite a few built H/C/I LS1's and run for their money!

 

[AJRED99]

400 rwhp while N/A? haha got 10,000 bucks?

My set-up was expensive however it didn't cost anywhere near 10 grand. But I also had alot of hook-ups and did all my own work.

 

[BelvedereGTX]

My set-up was expensive however it didn't cost anywhere near 10 grand. But I also had alot of hook-ups and did all my own work.

What did you have done?

 

[jd93gt]

I disagree, I have a 99 cobra with full bolt-ons along with fully ported C Heads, stage 3 comp cams and valvetrain and the stock intake which is fully ported and polished also, LT's, ect.... After all is said and done I am making a little over 400rwhp with the stock shortblock. To top it off I also am using an NX EFI Race kit and spraying a 100 shot :fm: . Granted my block is on borrowed time but it runs hard as hell and would give quite a few built H/C/I LS1's and run for their money!

I'm foaming at the mouth.... how's the driveability with the stage 3 cams? How much did the cams and valvetrain run you? Dare I say... How's the gas mileage? hahhaha ... That's kinda what I have planed for my cobra whenever the stock block goes, maybe not quite as hairy.. but close to. Your car sounds beast, I doubt you'd have problems with an H/C/I Slo-maro.

Back to the topic. I would have to agree with the above post. Don't focus so much on meeting his power level, shed some weight. But DEFINATELY get gears if you want to be close. Ported heads and cams will also help.. but are also QUITE expensive when we're talking about 4 valves... he's a little easier off with a pushrod motor, H/C/I is alot cheaper for him. I'd say, look into ported heads, ported intake, long tubes, gears, tune and shed some weight and you'd be "competitive" with him.

 

[stangin99]

Brian,

To beat CJ, you'll need a good amount of work.

IE Ported 03/04 or FR500 Heads, FR500 cams or even bigger, fully ported shortrunner intake or FR500 intake, longtubes, 4.30/4.56 gears, and a damn good tune. That will get you close to the 400rwhp range and give you enough gear for down low that you should be able to hang in there with him. To get you over that 400 mark, I think a 305 big bore would do it nicely....stroker's aren't the greatest idea for a DD car.

 

[UCBeau]

My set-up was expensive however it didn't cost anywhere near 10 grand. But I also had alot of hook-ups and did all my own work.

that, my friend, is exactly why i said 10,000 bucks.

 

[sur_real1]

What is the deal with the shortblock without boost? Why does it start to have real issues at the higher power? Is it because the motor needs to pull some serious R's to make it's power? And, where is the point where the block starts to see problems? What HP Range?

 

[AJRED99]

What did you have done?

every bolt-on you could think of. pm me if you want a list

 

[na svt]

What is the deal with the shortblock without boost? Why does it start to have real issues at the higher power? Is it because the motor needs to pull some serious R's to make it's power? And, where is the point where the block starts to see problems? What HP Range?

The stock block does not have any real issued in an n/a motor. You won't have any problems n/a with the bottom end unless you spin it extremely high. I'd keep it at or no more than 7200.

The FR500 cams are very mild, especially when compared to the stg 3 comps. You can get there with those cams but you will need the FR500 intake also and that costs too much money.

360-370rwhp is very easy to attain with a stock shortblock. In fact, some have reached 360rwhp with stock 99/01 cams. Furthermore, this power range can be reached without porting, just a good valve job. Heck, 360 has been made with a stock intake, stock cams, stock shortblock and shortys!

It takes the right combination of parts and it won't costs anywhere near 10 grand. Quality headwork, good valves, cams, short runner intake, long tubes and 4.56s and you be whoopin' up on H/C/I LS1s.

AJRED99, have you dyno'd your car yet?

 

[na svt]

....stroker's aren't the greatest idea for a DD car.

...and you say this why?

 

[Nazman]

every bolt-on you could think of. pm me if you want a list

He runs the full "Naz-ty" option! :rockon:

ahahahaha!!!!

Naz

 

[AJRED99]

I'm foaming at the mouth.... how's the driveability with the stage 3 cams? How much did the cams and valvetrain run you? Dare I say... How's the gas mileage? hahhaha ... That's kinda what I have planed for my cobra whenever the stock block goes, maybe not quite as hairy.. but close to. Your car sounds beast, I doubt you'd have problems with an H/C/I Slo-maro.

Back to the topic. I would have to agree with the above post. Don't focus so much on meeting his power level, shed some weight. But DEFINATELY get gears if you want to be close. Ported heads and cams will also help.. but are also QUITE expensive when we're talking about 4 valves... he's a little easier off with a pushrod motor, H/C/I is alot cheaper for him. I'd say, look into ported heads, ported intake, long tubes, gears, tune and shed some weight and you'd be "competitive" with him.

Drivability is all in the tune, Nazman hooked me up with a great tune. I get 260 miles to the tank and can cruise with the AC on and radio turned up, however sometimes it stalls but rarely. Not bad for the aggressive cams, you should hear the lope of the cams :mj: As far as the valvetrain I got a great deal on the cams, springs and titanium retainers for 1300 bucks. And yes Camaro's, vettes and others dont really give me too many issues except the new Z06 those are still out of my league (ummm I need more juice) ha ha

 

[stangin99]

...and you say this why?

the stroke on the 4.6 is already relatively long...anymore is starting to pull the pistons too far down among other things.

I would love a 324 for like a weekend/track car...but I wouldn't want to drive it to work every day of the week.