I would at least strap it down to check your A/F ratio with the 4lb boost increase just to be sure everything is ok.
M122 Blower on a Terminator? It CAN be done!
- Thread starter JeremyAlan
- Start date
I would at least strap it down to check your A/F ratio with the 4lb boost increase just to be sure everything is ok.
I'm putting in my AFX wideband this weekend. I barely ever go full tilt on her, I mostly cruise to save gas. Of course having said that, I did hit 140 yesterday lol
Lol. I'm just curious what's she's making, the numbers you have now are deceiving 
Show me where your getting your numbers. With a port he will be making 570 but thats only adding the factor of TB,MAF,Injectors,pump or BAP, Pulley, Porting, tune..
Now lets break down the price.
Unported M122 on ebay are LISTED for 1k+. Lets be generous here and say he gets one for 700 for some reason.
M122- $700
Tune - $600
Port - $1000
S/c custom Mount bracket - $1500 (listed on cobraengineering.net)
Throttlebody - $500
Injectors - $300
Pulley Upper - $80
Lower pulley -$400
100mm Idler - $150
BAP - $250
MAF -$200
FOR THE GRAND TOTAL OF $5680 Now these numbers are rounded DOWN and are very generous. The reality is youll probably need to relocate the battery and kit. The supercharger is what kills you since most GT500 owners feel that their blower is somehow better than the rest since it came off a GT500 and i rarely see one listed or sells below 1k on ebay so the $700 is rounded down $300. Now lets say the bolt on kit thats listed for $1500 isnt the right price since it doesnt really say what exactly is included in a partcial kit. Lets say the kits $500 for example. That STILL means your budget is $4680!!!!! And thats to make that 580hp your speaking of, maybe 600 if modded correctly. Now look at a whipple that you can get for $3500 that ISNT maxed out with porting and all the goodies. If your a smart shopper you can pickup a whipple for $3099 on AM.
I must be missing your point 04svtsnke.. Seems a lot like a money pit! besides most those mods are rounded off by 100 to 200. The only way i see this working out positively is the person having a friend or knows someone with a doner gt500 willing to give up the blower for nothing and the add-ons. I also forgot a heat exchanger - ___- silly me.. Add $350. So just over 5k
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First off the kit is $650.
Second if you pay more than $500 for a M122 you got ripped off.
Then all the rest you listed is at least required to run a Whipple/KB. And most of those mods are required if you want to max out your M112.
So the extras are part of the game. It doesn't matter what direction you go you are going to spend money making horsepower.
Like I said it is a option in the middle. I don't make any grand claims other than a bigger, better designed blower is going to make more power. Pretty simple.
Thanks for asking
Second if you pay more than $500 for a M122 you got ripped off.
Then all the rest you listed is at least required to run a Whipple/KB. And most of those mods are required if you want to max out your M112.
So the extras are part of the game. It doesn't matter what direction you go you are going to spend money making horsepower.
Like I said it is a option in the middle. I don't make any grand claims other than a bigger, better designed blower is going to make more power. Pretty simple.
Thanks for asking
First off the kit is $650.
Second if you pay more than $500 for a M122 you got ripped off.
Then all the rest you listed is at least required to run a Whipple/KB. And most of those mods are required if you want to max out your M112.
So the extras are part of the game. It doesn't matter what direction you go you are going to spend money making horsepower.
Like I said it is a option in the middle. I don't make any grand claims other than a bigger, better designed blower is going to make more power. Pretty simple.
Thanks for asking
All the parts listed are mods youll need to support a modified blower FOR POWER. Yes you can settle and get the m122, the kit and basics to make it functional but i cant see you pushing more than 520hp and a torque curve below 500. At that rate your still dumping $2500. Those are the mods needed for maxing a m112 or pushing nice boost with whipple/kb and it wont be any different if your maxing out a m122. What do you think?? since its a gt500 the rules dont apply lol. Youll still need the same mods to support the power. Just because you have a gt500 blower doesnt mean you have all the gt500 parts. You can have a ported m122, m112, whipple, kb it doesnt matter.. If your shooting for 550+ your going to need those parts. Its a money pit!!! The only factor i see in this is the gloating youll be doing at a carshow saying you have a gt500 blower but in retrospec its like bolting a eaton m112 to a cobalt SS (yes i know its a 4cyl and it wont work) but for example, even tho the eaton came off a terminator it wont make your cobalt ss do 9sec at the track.. Its just a slightly more power blower vs the m90
Too some this all up. Eaton makes supercharger OEM setups for STOCK applications in most popular manufactured cars such as Ford, Chevy, Benz, Cadillac ect. They arent going to have the same power output as a company who manufactured a twin-screw for 1 goal.. POWER OUTPUT. These cars are made to cross the country without blowing up and have a additional 90hp for example. Take a look at the Ford GT, OR new CTS-V They still have those setups but arent boosting any 800hp.
Its cool that its been done i give mad props. I just dont see this being some kind of trend catching on that people do as an alternative for power vs turbo,twin-screw, centrif, exhaust turbo, ported root
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Your comparison is not apples to apples like you are trying to make it look like.
The following below in red are needed with a Whipple or a M122.
The following below in red are needed with a Whipple or a M122.
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You made my point. All the mods need to be done no matter your choice.
This is just one of the many choices available to our cars.
And yes it has not "caught on fire". I have now sold 11 kits. I dont even make much on them by the time im done. Who cares. It is fun helping others who don't have access to machines that I do.
Most people who go this way already maxed out there M112 and want to get more without spending $3000 on a Whipple. One even sold it and moved up to the Whipple.
Obviously you have money (or credit anyway) or you would understand that the big step into the TS is more than a lot of us have laying around. So we step up year after year until we get there. And to some this is just that step. Yes even I eventually stepped up to a TVS. Which I had a full year before it was a option because of this kit.
Sir I understand your questions. And I take the time with everyone to make sure they understand what is involved. I do not push this on anyone. Notice the few people on here that are very happy with the way it turned out.
This is just one of the many choices available to our cars.
And yes it has not "caught on fire". I have now sold 11 kits. I dont even make much on them by the time im done. Who cares. It is fun helping others who don't have access to machines that I do.
Most people who go this way already maxed out there M112 and want to get more without spending $3000 on a Whipple. One even sold it and moved up to the Whipple.
Obviously you have money (or credit anyway) or you would understand that the big step into the TS is more than a lot of us have laying around. So we step up year after year until we get there. And to some this is just that step. Yes even I eventually stepped up to a TVS. Which I had a full year before it was a option because of this kit.
Sir I understand your questions. And I take the time with everyone to make sure they understand what is involved. I do not push this on anyone. Notice the few people on here that are very happy with the way it turned out.
James,
You have done a great job on this kit and I am impressed how well it works.
Thanks for the remote IAC adapters. They are the same great quality as everything else we have gotten from you.
BTW: Congrats on the birth of your second child!
Thanks Rick.
6 more adapters will be there Thursday.
6 more adapters will be there Thursday.
Good timing. I need to put the Dragon back on my car.
I want to hit the track before we go to MIR.
Dude everything you said was so fully of fail. I gotta work.best believe I'm going to set time away from my life to set you straight on this kit. Have a good night.
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You most certainly can try. I welcome your input
Your prices are way off scale. The prices that you include would also come with any change of the supercharger. That cost is incurred regardless of the blower. If you take into account the most basic costs, the M122 + adapter plate is much cheaper at about a 1000 together than the initial cost of the whipple. I don't know anyone who bases prices off of ebay. That's like basing prices of cars off used car lots. If that was the case, all terminators would be 27k dollars
My final thought
Too his her own or however that expression goes. I would call a m122 a budget build, as well as a m112. You can slowly invest into them without dumping 3k at once and still have a car you can drive and slowly improve at your own pace. Thats absolutely fine!!!! Its great to see a project come through too the end and see the final results. That person definantly has the passion to push forward to have a special build.
My own view might be different than yours. I think m112 porting is great!! keeps a stock look and has some awesome bolt-on power goodies to boot. Yields some nice numbers and thats great if you dont mind stopping there. BUT theirs plenty of people out there that port and go bigger because some have that ongoing earge for MORE POWER!!! nothing wrong with that either, no such thing as too much power. I just feel for the person who wants to port a m122 and will eventually want MORE POWER that this direction is not such a good one being clearly youll end up spending more in the end then you would if you did in 1 shot for a twin-screw and you wont be stuck with a maxed out eaton wishing for more power but your stuck because your maxed. My thoughts on this might be frowned on but i see it as this..... People buy K.I.T cars to look like a exotic, get noticed, and go fast. You can spend $50,000 and make a Ford GT K.I.T and thats AWESOME!! not everyone can afford a supercar. But you wont perform,sound, or handle like the exotic would. And if you choose the K.I.T direction, you would see that if you saved up a little longer you could have just afforded the real thing and not sacrifice anything. You can port the hell out of a eaton m112 or m122 but at the end of the night its a eaton and it has limitations and if you choose more power, your now stuck with a costly investment that you cant really sell for more than breaking below even. Those are my views you can hate them but i just dont see the point. M112 I see the point, and its awesome, but m122 i feel is a lost cause. My example with the K.I.T car might not seem realistic because not everyone has 50k to even invest but you can pickup used supersport exotics for decent prices. The eaton porting is great but its not only cost. I see it as you maxed out the eaton and structurally pushed it to the limits for every ounce of power. If you grandma it i dont see the problem but if you like to rip on it, i dont see the eaton holding up to the punishment that a twin-screw would. Ofcourse everyones idea of getting on it is different. Some people ride hard, or drive it like its stolen or the occassional redlight launcher. I just cant picture from a engineering standpoint of maxing a m122 to the absolute limit + mods then beat on it in hot weather daily and not expect soemthing to break.
Sorry if i hijacked this thread. Sweet build though.
Too his her own or however that expression goes. I would call a m122 a budget build, as well as a m112. You can slowly invest into them without dumping 3k at once and still have a car you can drive and slowly improve at your own pace. Thats absolutely fine!!!! Its great to see a project come through too the end and see the final results. That person definantly has the passion to push forward to have a special build.
My own view might be different than yours. I think m112 porting is great!! keeps a stock look and has some awesome bolt-on power goodies to boot. Yields some nice numbers and thats great if you dont mind stopping there. BUT theirs plenty of people out there that port and go bigger because some have that ongoing earge for MORE POWER!!! nothing wrong with that either, no such thing as too much power. I just feel for the person who wants to port a m122 and will eventually want MORE POWER that this direction is not such a good one being clearly youll end up spending more in the end then you would if you did in 1 shot for a twin-screw and you wont be stuck with a maxed out eaton wishing for more power but your stuck because your maxed. My thoughts on this might be frowned on but i see it as this..... People buy K.I.T cars to look like a exotic, get noticed, and go fast. You can spend $50,000 and make a Ford GT K.I.T and thats AWESOME!! not everyone can afford a supercar. But you wont perform,sound, or handle like the exotic would. And if you choose the K.I.T direction, you would see that if you saved up a little longer you could have just afforded the real thing and not sacrifice anything. You can port the hell out of a eaton m112 or m122 but at the end of the night its a eaton and it has limitations and if you choose more power, your now stuck with a costly investment that you cant really sell for more than breaking below even. Those are my views you can hate them but i just dont see the point. M112 I see the point, and its awesome, but m122 i feel is a lost cause. My example with the K.I.T car might not seem realistic because not everyone has 50k to even invest but you can pickup used supersport exotics for decent prices. The eaton porting is great but its not only cost. I see it as you maxed out the eaton and structurally pushed it to the limits for every ounce of power. If you grandma it i dont see the problem but if you like to rip on it, i dont see the eaton holding up to the punishment that a twin-screw would. Ofcourse everyones idea of getting on it is different. Some people ride hard, or drive it like its stolen or the occassional redlight launcher. I just cant picture from a engineering standpoint of maxing a m122 to the absolute limit + mods then beat on it in hot weather daily and not expect soemthing to break.
Sorry if i hijacked this thread. Sweet build though.
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If you can find a m122 for 500$ id say jump on that! :banana:
but ive only seen those suckers sell for outrageous prices and at the end of the day a ported m112 vs m122 w/ bolt-ons only yields like 30-40hp more
When i installed james' kit i was happy with it. I already had the 60's, bap, a lifetime tune. I thought it was a great idea and i was only looking for a little more power. I found a low mileage m122 for $400.00 shipped. Had it ported in which i traded posi some cash and parts. I then sold my blower and dragon for 850.00 so actually i only shelled about $500.00. I did buy a whipple at a really low price and sold my m122 kit for about 1400.00. I just had to put in another 800.00 for the whipple and then i had to buy gt pumps 400.00.
I went from the m112 to a m122 for less then $1000.00. I then went to a whipple and added another $1000.00.
I think your veiw on power production is a bit skewed as far as power goals and prices are concerned but that's another topic for another day. Like a few have already said(and James has at least twice) this kit is the middle of thaddeus ported m112 and twin screws/turbos. It's not going to be the ultimate made for every key kit but it does a damn good job for what it's advertised to do. I aaas in the same boat as Others where I had already maxxed out my m112 and was making 520/535. Not bad numbers but unless I added nitrous or e85 I wasn't really going to make more on pump gas and not run around with torco in the trunk. With James's kit, you can make 550+ and like amount of torque with an UNPORTED M122 and his adapter kit. For someone in my shoes who didn't have twin screw money but had a grand to spend went this route. I lucked up and got my ported blower for 550 and his adapter kit for 650 puts my total at 1200. Besides a gt500 slot style maf and adapter harmess( 70 bucks) my car will make at least what's Jad g's car made(572/560) if not more with the same boost as my old setup. There are whipple and KB cars making similar power on pump gas as Jad g's car is making. The twin screw is more efficient but to be honest the power difference between the blowers isn't enough for me to want upgrade to just a 2.3 whipple or KB. It'd be a 2.9 at the least for me to see some good gains on pump gas. This is a perfect bang for buck kit that's for thos sealing a bit more power with ease and still have oem reliability. I added a few more things to my car while doin my blower swap and still have 300 miles of break in miles on my clutch before I dyno but I'll be sure to post. Btw if you look. Ack at the Op's first post he says when Caleb added 2* of timing (19 total) the car made 570 UNPORTED. The problem was he saw a little spark knock and wanted it to be safe so he took out 2 degrees. 570 on an UNPORTED eaton is stout in my book for a 4.6 based motor. I have a lot more I'd like to say to you but I honestly don't think it'll change your view so I hope you understand what I'm saying and read up on this kit some more and do some REAL apples to apples comparison and no bs and if you still think this kit is crap then I won't cai plain but I promise you you wont
You cant base your power goals off others builds. Look if you want to truly prove your point, when your done throw your dyno up. Im starting my whipple build in 2 weeks so by the time its finished so should yours. And it will be solved there. Dyno numbers for the members, PM's budget and over all build specs. Fair?
That sounds good. I have three pulleys I'll be using so I'll be covering a wide range of boost and numbers.
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