This one of the most informative threads I've ever read on SVTP.
Come to my house and attempt to enter without a warrant, I'll shoot your ass plain and simple, and take my chances in front of a jury.
The point is that you wont make it to a jury. You really think you are going to take down an entire tactical team?
The point of this ruling, even though the opinion was crudely written, is there is no point in physically resisting what you perceive to be an unlawful entry at the time of entry. There are remedies in the law that will come into play after a court decides the entry was unlawful.
Come to my house and attempt to enter without a warrant, I'll shoot your ass plain and simple, and take my chances in front of a jury.
You are looking at this from a Marine's POV and are taking it personally because a former Marine (I know there are no former Marines) died. The men dressed in black also had written in large white letters the word "POLICE."
The "GODDAM HAT" was obviously part of a bigger situation. No judge is issuing a warrant for a hat. It is obviously what the hat means. For a judge to issue a valid warrant it must be found on credible testimony before that judge amounting to probable cause. Just stating there is a DEA hat will not get the warrant. However, as an example, testimony from a CI says this person wore a DEA hat to commit a certain crime and that is corroborated, then looking for that particular evidence is important.
Believe it or not there are bad people in every walk of life, even Marines.
Former Marine Found Guilty in Wife, Sons' Murder Case - FoxNews.com
Former Marine indicted in 2009 Snell murder | WJLA.com
Former Marine Sentenced For Murder - San Diego 6
Or this one - it happened a few miles from my office, both officers were/are friends of mine. I look at life (and situations such as this thread are built on) through the eyes of someone trained and experienced with the law surrounding searches, warrants, etc. which is what I told you in my last post. You are not trained or experienced, yet you continue to try and paint the police (along with Adam and I) as the bad guys over one news story that the ink isn't dry on. Read on.............
Marine Is Suspect In Ceres Police Officer Killing - Sacramento News Story - KCRA Sacramento
Police Videos, Law Enforcement Videos, Taser Videos and Police Pursuit Videos - PoliceLink
The truth about the cop-killing marine
Michelle Malkin
If you watched the evening news a week ago, you may recall the sensational story of a distraught Marine who died in a murderous shootout with police. Anti-war writers and Latino activists have turned the cop-killer, Lance Cpl. Andres Raya, into a martyr. Don't believe the hype.
Network and cable TV shows repeatedly broadcast video and photo stills of Raya's Jan. 9 bloody gun battle in a Ceres, Calif., liquor store. Mental health experts immediately blamed post-traumatic stress disorder. Ignoring the cold-blooded murder of one of the ambushed police officers who was lured to his death, international headlines instead trumpeted the supposedly traumatized Raya:
Teenage War Veteran Committed Suicide 'By Cop'
Marine 'Committed Suicide by Cop to Avoid Iraq Return'
Kin of Marine Who Shot Policemen Ask if He Is a Casualty of War
Young Camp Pendleton Marine who shot officers did not want to go back to Iraq.
A far Left Web site, San Francisco Bay Area Indymedia.org, posted a complaint that the California legislature -- which lowered its flags to honor slain cop Sgt. Howard Stevenson -- was showing "no consideration [for the] young man whose life was ruined by military service."
La Voz de Aztlan, a radical fringe publication by Mexican nationalists, lionized Raya and demonized police:
"One can only speculate what horrors Andres Raya experienced in Fallujah. The slaughter by U.S. occupation forces of Iraqi civilians in Fallujah has been compared to the slaughter in Guernica by Nazi forces in 1937. Many U.S. Marines with a conscious (sic) have found it very difficult to reconcile the Iraqi civilian murders in their minds and have committed suicide. U.S. Marine Andres Raya decided to take some cops with him. Most probably he was harassed by them while growing up Mexican in this small northern California town." The paper also lambasted Raya's hometown, Ceres, as "a redneck town notorious for its mistreatment of his people."
Writing in the anti-war publication CounterPunch, Jack Random lamented Raya's death as "symbolic of the untold story of war. Hundreds of thousands of trained killers survive combat only to come home to a life for which they are no longer prepared. They have seen what men and women should never see. They have engaged in operations that brought them face to face with the death of innocent civilians, women and children."
The only elements missing in the bleeding-heart coverage of Raya's story were the soundtrack to "Platoon" and a bulk order of Kleenex. There's just one thing wrong with the sympathetic spin about the anti-war Marine. It's all dead wrong.
This much is true about Raya: The 19-year-old man did in fact serve with the Marines' 1st Intelligence Battalion's motor transport unit as a driver in Iraq.
But contrary to the impression left by initial media reports, Raya had never seen combat. And he was not headed back to Iraq. He had been transferred to a new unit scheduled for deployment to Okinawa. "During our investigation, we found he wasn't due to go back to Iraq, never faced combat situations and never even fired his gun," Stanislaus County Sheriff's Deputy Jason Woodman said.
Raya was high on cocaine at the time of the ambush, according to police reports. He was reportedly affiliated with the prison gang Nuestra Familia. Investigators found photos of Raya wearing gang colors and a shopping list in his bedroom safe that included body armor, assault rifles and ammunition. Authorities also discovered a video showing Raya smoking what appears to be marijuana and making gang sign gestures. The tape showed desecrated pieces of the American flag laid on a gymnasium floor to spell out expletives directed at President Bush.
Family members deny Raya's gang ties and blame the military. Meanwhile, Raya's neighborhood was decorated with anti-cop graffiti such as "Kill the Pigs" in his memory. And militant Hispanic residents celebrate Raya. Ceres resident Hilda Mercado told The New York Times that Raya "died like a true Mexican: He died standing on his feet."
The question isn't what got into Raya when he entered the military. The question is why and how Raya -- who police say had a propensity for violence well before he joined the Marines -- got into our military in the first place.
And now you know the rest of the story.
Sergeant Howard (Howie) Stevenson
Ceres Police Department
California
End of Watch: Sunday, January 9, 2005
Biographical Info
Age: 39
Tour of Duty: 20 yrs
Badge Number: 143
Incident Details
Cause of Death: Gunfire
Date of Incident: Sunday, January 9, 2005
Weapon Used: Rifle; SKS
Suspect Info: Shot and killed
Sergeant Stevenson succumbed to gunshot wounds sustained the previous night during a shootout with a suspect armed with a semi-automatic rifle.
Sergeant Stevenson and other officers had responded to a liquor store on North Central Avenue to investigate reports of an armed male who was acting strangely. The first officer on the scene was shot and wounded by the suspect. This officer took cover behind a car and returned fire as Sergeant Stevenson arrived at the scene. As Sergeant Stevenson exited his patrol car, the suspect shot him twice in the head, killing him.
The suspect exchanged shots with responding officers before fleeing the scene. He was shot and killed approximately three hours later during a second shootout. The suspect was believed to be under the influence of cocaine at the time of the incident.
Sergeant Stevenson had served with the Ceres Police Department for 20 years. He is survived by his wife, son, and two daughters
As far as the "rest of the story" - in this case the Sheriff's dept has already made it clear he's not releasing ANY of the documents, so we'll NEVER know the real story will we?:nonono:
What constitutes "resistance"? If one or more people show up at my door demanding entrance, and refuse to produce a warrant, is it considered "resistance" if I merely tell them to come back when they have a warrant and close the door? And if these same people then break down the door with force, having failed to produce a warrant, why am I not justified in using force to defend my home and persons inside?
This ruling is bad law and will get some LEOs killed or injured. The law enforcement community had better rethink it's position, as "I vas just following orders" is not a valid excuse against violating the 4th Amendment.
Hey Brother..... I get your point. And I sincerely express my condolences for your loss. Losing friends and comrades in arms sucks. Cops aren't the only ones that happens to.
As I said, I FULLY realize we (Marines) aren't all Saints. Would you like for me to post some stories of some Dbag cops just to "even the score?".. i can def do that if that would help- Google works on my computer too. No one is perfect or has perfect people in their organizations- even LEO's.
His "jury" would be comprised of 6 or 8 guys dressed just like the one he "shot". His house being the courtroom and a quick "guilty" verdict in his future.
How many times have you actually repeated the "point" of this ruling in this thread and people still don't get it. :shrug:
The driver, a young man exited the car and ran into the house through an interior garage door. I followed him in and tackled him in the living room of the house. His father was not happy and tried to stop me. By the end of the evening, the son went to jail for DUI and other charges. The dad went to jail for interfering, resisting, along with the mother who also interfered.
The son was later convicted, the dad and mom both maintained they were within their "rights" to defend their home and their son. They both finally plead to lesser charges.
What's my point? - No one likes strangers in their homes, I don't either. But, I am not so dense as to think if my kid runs in the house followed by a cop that he is to be considered innocent and the cop is the guilty party.
Unfortunately, some folks are that dense.
I can understand the reactions of the family. Our instincts are to protect family above all else. A father seeing his son tackled (especially when unexpected) would provoke some aggression the majority of the time.
Even when its a cop in a police uniform? Are you ****ing stupid? :dw:
*removed by moderator*
Banned from posting here? For what?..
Dont answer that. I dont want to clutter this thread with an argument with you. Itll prove to be a waste of time anyways. An abomination.. :lol1: